Are the Horde evil?
by Jennie Lees 
Dec 29th 2005 at 4:00PM
Academic weblog Terra Nova has a
furiously raging debate going on with one of its recent posts, "The Horde is Evil". The original poster,
Edward Castronova, claims that the Horde races are inherently evil -- "One element of this is the fact that
the words 'troll' and 'orc' and 'undead' have implied evil creatures for as long as those words have been in use in the
English language (since the 9th century in the case of 'orc'). No one, not even mighty Blizzard, can un-do the meaning
of a word in a matter of a few years." -- and that we should consciously be aware of the evil inherent in a
"bad" character when we play it.The comments thread is filled with denials, mainly from Horde players, citing examples such as Shrek the ogre and the Tauren race's inherent nobility as refutations of this hypothesis. It's an interesting point to think about. If you play Horde, do you do so because you like the power-driven, warmongering, "evilness" of the races? Or as an antidote to the Alliance's sickly-sweet blathering about the Light? Or perhaps just as an experiment, to explore the whole game?
Filed under: Analysis / Opinion
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
Orii Dec 29th 2005 4:54PM
Are the Horde evil? not really. They are merely trying to reinvitent thier lives on Kalimdor after yearsof demonic enslavement(Orcs), civil war(Trolls),and cultural hatred from Centaurs(Taurens). Its not thier fault. However...If any race in the dead is evil, its the Undead. they-ARE-evil. period.
vahlere Dec 29th 2005 5:11PM
I am Horde and I am eeee-vil. Bwahaha!!!
Mike Dec 29th 2005 5:13PM
Well, the undead might be inherently evil, but that isn't gonna stop my Paladin from trying to destroy them on sight. This is an interesting debate; it reminds me of the dilemma that Tolkien claimed to have in later years, about the possibilities of redemption for an inherently evil race, and how he didn't feel he had included that possibility in his stories, instead painting them in broad black & white strokes.
Personally, I think orcs & trolls are evil, undead are just really unlucky, and the Taurens just tossed their hats into the wrong ring...
syco Dec 29th 2005 5:18PM
The only ones that are definantly evil are the Undead. Although even they can almost be sympathised with, in that, it must REALLY suck to be undead. It would tend to screw with your perceptions of right and wrong.
The taurens are definantly not evil, and the Orcs got screwed over by the Burning Legion. I'm not familiar with the troll's backstory, they might be evil too, I don't know.
And half the humans are evil, so it balences out.
Tyler Love Dec 29th 2005 5:26PM
People get entirely too caught up in this non-sense. Ultimately you can argue that this is a video game, blizzard created it, therefore "orc" and "troll" means whatever the hell blizzard wants it to mean. It's all based on your perspective, and although the titles of the races may have evil meanings established a bazillion years ago the word "Evil" itself is subjective. For something to be evil it must be morally objectionable. So if you do not believe, in this case, killing humans, paladins, night elves etc is morally objectionable then it isn't since morals are determined by every individual for themselves.
In other words, in the created reality (yeah I guess you could almost call it a reality based on how serious people take it) that is "World Of Warcraft" what is evil to a real human being isn't in the game.
Simply put, if you want to believe something is evil, then it is, and if you don't it isn't.
Brinstar Dec 29th 2005 5:29PM
I agree. I think the Undead/Forsaken are quite evil as presented in the PvE content, but I still play one. I don't agree with the motivations or the rationale behind the Undead's aspirations, so it's kind of interesting to put myself in those shoes.
Tyler Love Dec 29th 2005 5:29PM
Damn I'm smart!
Brinstar Dec 29th 2005 5:34PM
Also, to respond to the "People get entirely too caught up in this non-sense" comment:
What people fail to understand is that this is an academic argument that an academic has presented about morality and MMOs. Academics are trained to question what most people consider trivial facets of gaming. It's what academics do, and not just in game studies.
Linchburg Dec 29th 2005 7:50PM
Evil is a state of mind. Since *real* people make up each side in this game, I think it depends on the person playing the character more than the back-story of the race.
I'm sure there are some pretty greedy Human Priests running around killing little bunnies for no reason.
Timmay! Dec 29th 2005 7:59PM
The only arguement for calling the Horde in it's entirety "evil" is because the names associated with their races are often seen as "evil".
Taken directly from the worldofwarcraft.com:
Orcs -
"he savage, green-skinned Orcs are one of the most prolific races of Azeroth. They are commonly believed to be brutal and mindless, possessing no humanity or empathy for other races. Born on the hellish world of Draenor, the Orcs were brought into the kingdom of Stormwind through the dimensional gateway known as the Dark Portal and forced to wage war on the Humans. Although few are aware of their history, the Orcs once cultivated a noble, Shamanistic society on the world of Draenor. Tragically, the proud Orc clans were corrupted by the Burning Legion and used as pawns in the Legion's invasion of Azeroth. The Orcs managed to rebel, however, and they were ultimately able to help turn the tide against their demon masters. Led by the young Warchief, Thrall, the Orcs have reclaimed their strength and honor. Now, the Orcs stand ready to fight not for the sake of conquest, but for their right to survive in their adopted world. "
Tauren -
"The Tauren are huge, bestial creatures who live in the grassy, open barrens of central Kalimdor. They live to serve nature and maintain the balance between the wild things of the land and the restless spirit of the elements. Despite their enormous size and brute strength, the remarkably peaceful Tauren cultivate a quiet, tribal society. However, when roused by conflict, Tauren are implacable enemies who will use every ounce of their strength to smash their enemies under hoof. Under the leadership of their ancient chief, Cairne Bloodhoof, the Tauren allied themselves with the Orcs during the invasion of the Burning Legion. The two races have remained steadfast allies ever since. Like the Orcs, the Tauren struggle to retain their sense of tradition and noble identity. "
Trolls -
"he vicious Jungle Trolls, who populate the numerous islands of the South Seas, are renowned for their cruelty and dark mysticism. Barbarous and superstitious, the wily Trolls carry a seething hatred for all other races.
One tribe, however, was forced to overcome its prejudices when it encountered the Orc Warchief, Thrall, and his mighty Horde. The Trolls of the Darkspear tribe, long since exiled from their ancestral lands in Stranglethorn Vale, were nearly destroyed by a band of aquatic Murlocs, but Thrall and the Horde managed to save them. In return the grateful Trolls swore an oath of eternal allegiance to the Horde.
Led by the cunning Shadow Hunter, Vol'jin, the Darkspear Trolls now make their home in Durotar along with their Orcish allies. Their village, named after their fallen tribal elder, Sen'jin, lies along the eastern coast of the harsh, rocky land. The Darkspear tribe also occupies tracks within the nearby jungles of the Echo Isles.
As part of the Horde, the Trolls have extended their loyalty to the mighty Tauren, but they have little trust for the manipulative Forsaken, whom they believe will visit only misery and strife upon their allies. "
The only race that's inherently evil is the Undead.
Silvertusk Dec 30th 2005 12:50AM
Tell me, are the Undead evil, or are they just progenerating? Afterall, they have no "junk" anymore, being dead and whatnot, so their only means of surviving as a species is to turn others into undead. People's vision of what is truly "evil" differs greatly from race to race.
OmegaHack Dec 30th 2005 11:25AM
I play the horde, and I think that alliance are evil. Not becuase I am horde, but because they are always ganking horde players. When I see an Alliance player grinding, I am not about to go up to them and gank them for no reason. Ovbiously this does not apply to BG that is a different story.
Melkior Dec 30th 2005 12:35PM
I am an undead warlock, and I'm as evil as they come. I DO gank Allies that I see grinding. Why? Because I never did until every single Ally that ever attacked me outside a BG attacked while I was fighting a mob and had half my hp. Therefore, since I am evil but this evil is a result of the Allies' activities on my server, which one is the greater evil?
mancko Dec 31st 2005 1:06PM
It's all relative, though, isn't it? It's not like this isn't a debate that hasn't raged in the real world since...well, since forever. The man who steals from a vendor to feed his family, is he evil? To the vendor, yes, because the thief is taking what he has worked hard to attain. To the family, no. The thief is offering them a better alternative to starvation.
The undead are trying to do what they can to survive. In their sunken, worm-eaten eyes, they're not evil, they're just making the most of the situation they're in. They believe that what they are doing is the best way to achieve their ends, so is therefor not evil, just necessary. The same holds true for the orcs, trolls, and Tauren.
But then again, fantasy works very often create this issue. What if you were an Orc who didn't want to kill elves? What if you were a goblin who wanted to paint pictures instead of murder an pillage? What if you were (and this is outlandish, I know) a drow elf who doesn't want to slink around in the Underdark and be all murderous?
Evil, whatever that is, is created by personal choice, not by right of birth. And even those who choose to claim to be truly evil will attempt to explain it or justify it (see comment #13). So evil is as evil does, but even that depends on the point of view. Moral relativism strikes again, I suppose.
mancko Dec 31st 2005 2:22PM
It's funny--my previous comment was merely as a result of responding to the other WOW insider readers' views, but now that I've read the actual article involved... well, I have problems with it, and for want of a better way of putting it, the author comes across as being either morally grandstanding, naive, or both. His arguments, as laid out in the article are thus:
1) The word "orc" has been connotated as evil, and therefore the race is evil whether blizzard chooses to characterize them as such or not.
This is clearly ridiculous. Any author of a fantasy text, and for the purposes of this argument, Blizzard is the "author" of a "text" called World of Warcraft. The fact that the characters in that world are creating the story as they go along is irrelevant. The universe, and therefore the rules, are made by them. This is the overriding answer to the argument, but let's go further.
He says that "orc" and "troll" mean evil things, that they have meant evil things in the past, and therefore they are evil. Poppycock. Ask any reader or scholar who is well versed in Tolkiens works and history what an "elf" is. In Tolkien's world (and indeed, in WOW) elves are tall, noble folk. But what about Santa's elves? What about the rather morally ambiguous elves of Grimm's fairy tales? Tolkien decided that "Elves" were what he wanted them to be, and we can't change that because we can point out that in the past, elves have most often been characterized as something more akin to fairies or gnomes. Dwarves hold as well. A Nordic dwarf was an evil thing. Red Caps were dwarves, and they dipped their hats in the blood of their enemies to give them a rusty hue. Authors create worlds, and are not bound by precedence. Especially in a fantasy world, where the rules are bound only by the laws laid forth by the authors.
2) He is a father, and his son was scared by the undead character and the undercity. When I was five, I was terrified of the cover of a picture book I was given. The creature on the front was obviously evil, with big eyes, a bulbous nose, and hair on his feet and wrists. I wouldn't dare open the book for a year after I got it. When I finally plucked up the nerve, I found out the name of this terrible beast: A hobbit.
Kids are afraid of the unknown, and it's hardly fair for an adult to categorize a thing based on the imagination of a three year old. It's unfair mostly to the child, who might not understand and who might have the kind of imagination that turns things boogiemen no matter their real connotations.
3) Playing evil makes you evil. The author leaves out one thing that makes computer games popular and is the reason why games like "Grand Theft Auto" and "TIE fighter" are wildly popular. In fact, lets go back even further: Why is Richard III one of Shakespeare's most popular plays and characters? Because evil is fun to contemplate.
Most of us don't really want to be evil in real life, and besides, the rules set forth in modern society make it impossible to be evil without completely losing every advantage society gives us. But in a game, there are no strictures like that, and if there are, the consequences are much less dire. So kill, maim, and steal, folks. Just be prepared for some consequences, and for the sake of gamers everywhere: not in real life. Or, if you must, don't blame games. :)
4) There are no children in Horde society. Well, you never see baby pigeons either, unless you invade a pigeon nest. Most creatures choose to protect their young from the dangers of the outside world. Particularly a world as unwelcoming as exists in the Horde areas. I would actually see the callous way humans let their children run around in areas teeming with vicious wolves and murlocs as evil, but who am I to judge?
And their's the rub. Obviously, the person who wrote the article is entitled to his opinion. But again, it comes up to personal choice. Some horde are evil. Some humans are evil. Some gank, some don't, some just do quests and help their guilds.
Far be it from this one person to decide what is evil and what isn't.
Anyway, far too much rambling. I have to get back to work now.
armaanster Jan 1st 2006 6:40PM
I personally think that neither side is evil, however the alliance are goody goodies, the horde, are just really really unlucky and trying to make their life better, the horde is basically like all the poor in the world banding together trying to make life better.
A lot of people prefer to join the horde because they are almost "rebels" as in they arent really as "civilized" as the alliance.
The alliance hasnt faced many "hardships" in their history, but the horde is burdened with it.
I would like to combat all who say that the Undead are evil, as being one i would know, the undead are just like the rest of the horde, but picked on, mostly because of their looks, the forsaken used to be under the control of the lich king, (basically the burning legion) they like the orcs were cursed, they have managed to break free of their curse much like the orcs, but remain undead
I hope people take these things into consideration before pointing fingers
my general point is that good and evil arent as easy as black and white, in the middle of good there is evil, and in the middle of evil there is good
I hope this helps people realise that
jakk on the blackrock server Jan 2nd 2006 5:27PM
# 16 its like the french revolution all over again.
i have and undead priest that i created for the sole purpose of smiting bunnies does that make make me evil? hell yea it does! but the undead as a whole arent really evil its more like they are driven by the need for revenge. and they will kill anyone who gets in their way.
James MacAulay Jan 3rd 2006 11:39AM
Mancko: good points! And as for the "no children in Horde society" thing, I feel I should add a reminder to everyone of the orphanage in Orgrimmar.
My two cents: the best thing Blizzard ever did with the Warcraft story was make the Horde more identifiable. The fact that WC3 began with an orc on what amounted to a *vision quest* is a good example of how the story began to step outside the frame of the humans' cultural hatred.
I think pretty much the only ones *portrayed* as genuinely evil in the Warcraft universe are the demons; almost everyone else is either the unwitting pawn of demons, or is "just trying to survive in a hostile world." Particularly, I find it kind of strange that so many people so easily label the Forsaken as evil while sparing all else from any such harsh judgement.
The Forsaken wake up in their crypts to a world that believes them to be *an affront to nature*. Their former brothers and sisters believe that every last one of them should be destroyed. I think that, in the face of a world which wants you screaming in a bonfire because of what you are, it's understandable that you would jump at the chance to transform the bullies into what they most hate.
I find the notion that an entire species could be inherently evil to be completely ridiculous (you may have noticed that I also don't particularly like the misuse of the word "race" in Warcraft terminology). Indeed, I find the notions of good and evil themselves to be completely ridiculous; they are just terrible ways of categorizing things which don't have much functional value in the real world. In a work of literature these terms can be more meaningful if that's what the story is about, but Blizzard has decided to make things less black and white and I think that's terrific.