Guardian pets need a mind of their own
by Mike Schramm 
Apr 24th 2007 at 1:59PM
This forums thread points out something interesting about player "guardians." Not pets-- guardians like Shadowfiend (which a priest I know called his shadowfriend), the druids' treants, and my shaman's totem elementals. After players wonder why shadowfiends keep breaking shackles, Neth says something that made me do a double-take: shadowfiends, as guardians, have an actual AI that is supposed to go after non crowd-controlled targets first.That's news to me. I haven't spent a ton of time around shadowfiends, but in my experience, shaman and mage elementals and other "uncontrollable" pets (that's why they're called guardians) tend to go after anything that happens to be close to them. That's why they don't get popped when there's sheep or shackles around-- my guild could have used that fire elemental DPS on Moroes, but because it was so important to keep those shackles up, I've been saving the elemental for later. If there really is an AI (and if it works-- even Neth agrees that may not be the case at this point, though she says the shadowfiends on the PTR are supposed to be doing things right), then maybe we can start trusting summoned guardians not to touch CC'd targets until it's OK to do so.
Of course, there's other ways around it-- normally, I just don't pop my pets out until I'm sure there's no more CC left to break, but my pets are leashed to my totem, so with careful positioning, I can still avoid CC. And I believe both mage and druid guardians are targeted-- they open fire on whatever you've got targeted at the time, right? But I'd love a little AI, or at least a little control, in something like my Searing Totem. If there's a CC'd target out there, it's not worth the trouble to drop it even for the extra DPS.
Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Instances, NPCs, Buffs
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Andre Vidal Apr 24th 2007 2:55PM
Mage's pets are controlable
JLBorghead Apr 24th 2007 2:21PM
I can't imagine this would be too difficult for them to fix. I did some escort quests in Terokkar last week and the NPCs don't hit my sheep until they've defeated all other opponents. Interesting...
doa Apr 24th 2007 5:39PM
thing that makes me mad as a warlock is when a shaman can bring out a pet (either fire or earth one) and use it to pvp with within a town. It always happens in area 52, and when ever my pet by chance gets put on aggessive I get put into combat and killed by guards or My pet is on defensive and a shaman decides to bring it out and put me into combat and die.
And it should be a easy fix for blizzard. Just a matter of putting it in the same cat. as the locks minions.
Röh Apr 24th 2007 2:28PM
The guardians DO respect sheeps and shackles. The AI is built, and it works beautifully. This is not something very difficult to test.
If there is more than one mob, the sheep will be respected. But, when the only mob that remains is a sheep, or a shackle the guardian will attack it.
Hellspawn Apr 24th 2007 2:33PM
actually its the same as hunter pets, when my hunter scatter shots, my pet stops attacking as well....mind you if my pet is fighting a mob, and another attacks me i freeze trap the mob on me, when we finish the mob, for some reason my pet turns and goes after the ice trapped mob....So maybe they have it implemented and freeze trap doesn't count as a CC effect? I dont know either way it is at least partially implemented already with hunter pets, maybe even the generated guardians, think Ill go to SM library to get me a dog whistle tonight and find out...
another thought i have not tried on the subject, could i use mechanical yeti, dog whistle, and my felsteed boar trinket at the same time and have a mini army along with me and my pet?
Samidare Apr 25th 2007 2:21PM
imo, they should be like the mage pet. you can control what its going after and you can cast the spells for it. Put it on passive/aggressive etc.
On the flip side, shaman guardians are free. Mage pets are a trainable talent. So can make to big of a deal out of it.
I just normally wait till there is nothing in the area, or the fight is not going to be endangered by my pet. Then unlesh it. Mainly during boss fights.
Flit Apr 24th 2007 2:46PM
@ hellspawn:
Nope, only one non-combat pet, and one Combat pet can be out at the same time. Hell, i can't mind control some mobs in netherstorm with my pet out (!) because they are considered "summoned creatures"
klink-o Apr 24th 2007 3:16PM
Hell, if they can teach my succubus to get the hell out of AOE I'll be happy.
Mike Schramm Apr 24th 2007 3:17PM
But mages' pets aren't controllable in the sense that they've got a pet bar and you can fire their spells/set them to passive/etc when you want, right? Don't they just follow your target?
I consider a hunter's pet "controllable" (even mindcontrolling minions makes them "controllable"). But while I've never played a mage high enough to have a water elemental, I was under the impression that they're summoned and then they just hit whatever you're hitting-- no pet bar at all.
Quoi Apr 24th 2007 3:19PM
The water elemental has a pet bar. That's why it's so uber.
Pritchard Apr 24th 2007 4:14PM
My Water Elemental when summoned will go after the sheep if what I had sheeped had previously hit me, unless I've specified it hit the target I'm currently DPS-ing by mashing its attack button.
It seems the lag for the WE to attack and its health and mana will be fixed with 2.1, which is nice to hear.
Glocky Apr 24th 2007 3:24PM
@2 re: shackles + Fire Elementals don't mix
Shammies' Fire Elemental guardian most definately breaks shackles during Moroes fight, as recently as April 17/07 (i.e. the patch that is currently live)
Decae Norgannon-H Apr 24th 2007 3:39PM
The pets DO have a mind of their own, and thats the problem! :)
Kyane Apr 24th 2007 3:52PM
Mage elementals do have pet bars and are user controlled.
Ryan Apr 24th 2007 3:57PM
The mage's water elemental has a pet bar and is controllable like a hunter's pet. 2 minute cooldown.
A Shaman's does not have a pet bar and is on a 20 minute cooldown.
Therefore, mages can use them in arenas, Shamans can't. The cooldowns need to be the same and our shaman "guardians" need a pet bar so we can actually make them useful.
Mike Schramm Apr 24th 2007 3:58PM
Thanks for the clarification, Ryan.
Sal Apr 24th 2007 4:26PM
Won't the fire elemental blast wave break shackles?
drew Apr 24th 2007 4:50PM
Sackle breaks because moroese vanishes and the only mob it sees is a shackled one.... I thoguht that was obviouse to everyone....
Ryan Apr 24th 2007 4:53PM
Sal,
Yes... it does break CC abilities (shackle, sheep, sap, etc...) which is why it's hard to use our guardians in certain fights such as Moroes as mentioned in the post.
I think that's the main reason shamans are hoping for a pet bar. That way we can use it to benefit the raid without it turning into a liability by wiping everyone.
Scalin Apr 24th 2007 4:52PM
In a slightly related note, Thrall in the Durnholde event will ignore CC'd targets if there is a non-CC'd target close by. Had two mages dropping two sheeps on the mages that spawn as Thrall is running out, and he wouldn't hit one until all the rest were dead. He'll even go for sap before seduce/sheep, which I found funny.