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All of the latest Mists of Pandaria newsBlizzard disbands extreme erotic roleplaying guild
by Elizabeth Wachowski 
Sep 17th 2007 at 10:44AM
I've been sidestepping writing about this issue for some time, since it's bound to generate some controversy here and I hate bringing publicity to bad people. But as the topic keeps popping up again and again, particularly on roleplaying servers, it might be time to bring it out into the open.
An erotic roleplaying guild that now spans two realms has been accused of defending pedophiles and engaging in extreme sexual situations without any way to verify that their members are above the age of 18. While the guild in question says it has been reported many times and is not violating policy, and that minors joining an ERP guild are being poorly parented, Blizzard has forcibly disbanded the guild -- only to have it reform under a new name. There might be some disturbing content following the cut, so click at your own risk.
Abhorrent Taboo was mainly a Hordeside RP guild on Ravenholdt, but recently expanded to an Alliance auxillary on Blackwater Raiders. The guild leader posted a somewhat hostile "welcome message" on the BWR forums: "Role-playing is legal. Even if you are role-playing something that would be considered deplorable and highly illegal IRL, it's still just role-playing and isn't subject to any form of disciplinary action. Negative publicity is still publicity. Make a Digg or website about how sick we are. Report us to PervertedJustice. All it does is bring in more members. In fact, the Digg the guy on Ravenholdt made about us was so effective, several people signed up for WoW just to be in our guild. The bottom line is: We're allowed to do what we do on any server we please and no one can do anything about it."
Now, most RP servers are okay with ERP, if a little squicked out by it -- serious roleplayers tend not to like being thought of as cyberers. But AT has a history. As reported by TenTonHammer and then Dugg, AT's leader has talked about pedophilia in a positive way in guild chat. The exact quote is "I want to defend us, but I also want to defend the pedosexual community." The guild leader notes that she was talking about pedophiles who don't actually molest children and that she hates kids herself.
After AT opened their BWR auxillary, a 25-page thread sprung up and was deleted about AT's intentions. AT's recruitment policy, which was reposted onto the BWR forums from elsewhere, stated: "NOTE: Be advised that we frequently ERP in guild chat and often engage in even potentially offensive kinks such as (Extreme) Ageplay, Bestiality, Child Birth, [something that is censored by the WoW forums so I can't tell what it is], Watersports, or any other kink those playing may wish to explore. If you are easily offended or upset by others using kinks you may not personally enjoy, this is not the guild for you. Furthermore, we are a guild based on freedom of love and sex. Monogamy of any kind runs counter to this, and so, all sexually exclusive relationships are prohibited." They add that officers should enjoy ageplay and bestiality. There have also been insinuations, denied by the guild leader, that AT is purposefully lax in checking up on the ages of applicants, and a poster from Ravenholdt says that the guild solicits new players in chat channels without informing them of the purpose of the guild.
As a result, there have been several posts in the Customer Service and Suggestions forums asking that Blizzard do something about extreme ERP. Basically, the opponents say that since Blizzard lets minors in the game, they are responsible for protecting them from unsafe environments, and that AT is a lawsuit waiting to happen. Supporters, or at least non-opponents, say that AT is only engaging in fantasies, that ERP doesn't actually hurt people, and that it's close to impossible to keep minors from joining a guild if they really, really want to.
It looks like Blizzard has come down on the side of the opponents, as Abhorrent Taboo has been forcibly gdisbanded. "This matter is not one Blizzard takes lightly in any way, shape or form, and we do not wish to have this topic continue circulation," wrote Blizzard employee Verrith. " ... Let it finally be said that we appreciate those of you who brought this particular issue to our attention and that we will continue to follow up with this matter in the future to ensure the safety of all parties concerned." However, the members have reformed as Vile Anathema.
I'm torn on what side of the fence to fall on about Blizzard's actions. I'm highly creeped out by "ageplay" in a video game where it's impossible to verify actual age, and the guild leader's posts do seem like they're actively seeking out controversy. But fantasy isn't reality, and I'm not entirely comfortable about the precedent this sets. What do you think about this situation?
Filed under: Virtual selves, News items, RP
Reader Comments (Page 5 of 8)
Xaria Sep 17th 2007 5:39PM
What is often forgotten in all this is Blizzard's own EULA and TOU which expressly forbids obscene and sexually explicit language.
THERE IS NO ALTERNATE PROVISION FOR PRIVATE OR GUILD CHAT WITHIN THE GAME IN THE EULA THAT ALLOWS SEX CHATS.
So while some MAY THINK it's ok because they have not been banned YET, it's well within Blizzard's contractual rights to ban when someone complains this type of activity exists.
Legally, you will WILL be prosecuted if you attempt to converse sexually with a minor. I have no doubt that Blizzard would be named in such a suit if enough evidence was presented that they did not exercise due caution to protect a child who is allowed to enjoy the use of the account a parent signs up for. (1 minor child and 1 parent/guardian).
The free speech First Amendment does not apply where Blizzard's servers are concerned. In fact, even the bandwidth providers for Blizzard could pull their contract with Blizzard if they so wished. It's happened before. CorporateOffenders.com regularly rats out pedophiles to bandwidth providers.
A multitude of things could happen here if this situation persists. They should just ban the scum and be done with it already. But no, that makes too much sense.
Xaria Sep 17th 2007 5:47PM
Theserene wrote, "Like I said, for violating blizzard's rules they deserve to get banned, but I see no actual LAW being violated here since they have not committed a crime. They have not done an illegal act and you cannot convict someone (the whole locking them up thing) because you think they *might* do something."
It is against the law to converse sexually with a child online. I don't know where you were when it was brought out that a 13 year old MINOR was in this guild, but the girl herself posted her personal information on the WoW forums, which was promptly deleted by Blizzard.
So watch how you word things. It is completely illegal to be even "chatting" with a minor sexually online. You don't have to meet them personally. You merely have to be engaged in conversation with them. Don't suggest otherwise.
Mike Sep 17th 2007 5:53PM
This was already reported to the FBI. I read on another site, maybe a week ago, where the guy had taken it to that level because he didn't get any satisfaction from Blizzard. The problem had been going on for awhile with no bans. I think he said almost a year. Blizzard wanted him to pay to get off the server. He refused and took it to that level.
I wonder if Blizzard finally made a move due to some heat.
Poormojo Sep 17th 2007 5:56PM
@78 "What is often forgotten in all this is Blizzard's own EULA and TOU which expressly forbids obscene and sexually explicit language."
Well fuck me. I typed /flirt and my character said some sexually explicit things. You better ban my ass and everyone elses. Blizzard can't have it both ways: you can't both include sexual overtones and explicit sexual content (Hi, succubus) and then also ban people for doing the same thing.
Also, all current research shows that adolescents are not harmed by sexual talk. At all. In fact, it's natural. It's what people do.
Who cares if a seventeen year old and an eighteen year old talked dirty or cybered or pretended to piss on each other? What harm is it doing? How is this any worse than someone taking their PvP guild into Stormwind/Silvermoon and killing every person they find?
itukitty Sep 17th 2007 6:05PM
I dunno, I spent a good deal of time looking for the broken law, this is the best I got, California State Law 288.2 (b)
b) Every person who, with knowledge that a person is a minor,
knowingly distributes, sends, causes to be sent, exhibits, or offers
to distribute or exhibit by electronic mail, the Internet, as defined
in Section 17538 of the Business and Professions Code, or a
commercial online service, any harmful matter, as defined in Section
313, to a minor with the intent of arousing, appealing to, or
gratifying the lust or passions or sexual desires of that person or
of a minor, and with the intent, or for the purpose of seducing a
minor, is guilty of a public offense and shall be punished by
imprisonment in the state prison or in a county jail.
itukitty Sep 17th 2007 6:08PM
forgot the link...
http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/displaycode?section=pen&group=00001-01000&file=281-289.6
Phoebe Sep 17th 2007 6:17PM
Lilith posted this on Darknest. She's a nervy little pervert. Can't wait to see this one is an isolated cellblock.
Q u o t e:
We've already reformed and begun our restoration process.
We'll be more stringent on security than we were previously, as it was a spy within our ranks that caused our disbanding. We will also be exploring other options to ensure that every member can engage in every sort of play that they so desire without exposing themselves to potential threats of being reported.
Other than that, however, we're still going to be the exact same group of people with exactly the same storyline.
I'll be back in game on Monday Evening, and anyone who wants to return to us is welcome to send me a PM here with their character name, their RH profile, and a description of why they loved being a part of .
Please be aware that we will henceforth be VERY cautious of certain individuals. If you fall into this category, do not be offended. We merely wish to ensure that our members are free to enjoy themselves without reservation in a secure and pleasant environment.
The Alliance guild was also disbanded, and will be reforming as well. Those wishing to rejoin it should follow the same procedure as stated above.
Thank you.
Alicia Sep 17th 2007 6:24PM
"Blizzard can't have it both ways: you can't both include sexual overtones and explicit sexual content (Hi, succubus) and then also ban people for doing the same thing.
Also, all current research shows that adolescents are not harmed by sexual talk. At all. In fact, it's natural. It's what people do." - Poormojo
You're an IDIOT, Poormojo! It's against the law, stupid! It's people like you who disseminate false information because they secretly promote this garbage. Your ignorance of the law is no excuse here. It's you who can't have it both ways. Either you love perverts or you don't. Don't give me this, "It's not doing any harm" bull. That's the creed that pedophiles spew to excuse the sick way they think. But thanks for letting us know what you are made of.
Siorra Sep 17th 2007 6:28PM
Let them play the game how they want. Admitadly bringing a younger audience in is, essentially, wrong, but it's not exactly something that can be helped. Well, maybe better parenting...
But yeah, I once danced for a Tauren on my Belf. 'Exotic dancing' he called it. I called it the best 20g I EVER made. :D
Poormojo Sep 17th 2007 6:34PM
@86 Hi, Alicia.
I just finished reading Levine's "Harmful to Minors," and she argues really persuasively that there is no evidence that consensual sex, in and of itself (be it real or fantasy) is damaging to adolescents (i.e. those folks who are post-puberty but not yet of the age of majority.)
And really, I think that consensual TALKING--which is what was happening here--is fine. If some folks in the guild tried to arrange a realspace meeting, well, that would send up lots of red flags and probably be grounds for some prosecution, depending on the ages involved.
But this is TALKING. This isn't a pedophile preying upon a child. This is people TALKING. We clear on that?
And laws get changed all the time. Laws should be firmly based on science and ethics and morality. I don't acre what the legal statues are, I care if an action is moral and ethical. Perfect example: Oral sex among consenting adults is illegal in most states. Which is utterly ridiculous.
So the question then is: should people be allowed to talk about sex and kink on the internet? Should teenagers be allowed to talk to adults about it?
Addendum: should teens be allowed to read explicit novels? Should teens be allowed to read Savage Love?
Also, let's stick to discussing the topic and not lob personal attacks, okay?
skakillers Sep 17th 2007 6:35PM
so glad my ravenholdt toon is alliance.
Poormojo Sep 17th 2007 6:38PM
@86
Also, you signed your post "Alicia" but you also signed your posts as "Phoebe" and "Mike" and "Xaria" and probably others.
Why?
Idu Sep 17th 2007 6:38PM
It's just amazing how hypocrite people can get. Claiming that fantasy about this and that will surely turn into reality (without ANY proof of this actually happening) and in the same time playing games that are occused of the very same thing. Some people are still very certain (without any proof, once more) that violent acts in a game will surely make you do those acts in real life. We surely have fantasies about killing - for example we plan ingame raids to commit a blood bath every day. Like said - how many of you have actually murdered, poisoned and set people on fire in real life because of doing so in a game? How many of you have your sense of reality twisted because you have played a fantasy game and roleplayed? How many of you think dragons actually exist?
It's a funny thing that gamers, who are often being themselves victims of false beliefs and "you lose your grip of moral and reality if you play" -arguments and now they themselves make the same claims about other players.
The children are always a great pull. I just wonder why to say its okay to get drunk ingame, kill people ingame, talk about killing and getting drunk ingame, but still talking about sex is for some reason a strict no-no and violence and drugs are not. Haven't seen too many of "OMG my kid is getting his hands on massive amounts of ale in the Orgrimmar inn, please Blizzard do somethin!" sort of hysteria.
Not taking sides on the issue, just the specific argument presented.
Alicia Sep 17th 2007 6:46PM
Poormojo, I don't really care what book you read to back up your arguments today. The law is the law. That book you read is not the law. It is also incorrect. Talk to any of the sexually abused who recount what happened to them as a child and tell them it wasn't "harmful".
Pedophiles believe they are not harming the children. In their sick minds they excuse their own behavior with this faleshood. Many of them even state that babies flirting with them. It's an excuse for their behavior and it's sick. If you can't see that, you need help. You shouldn't be reading books that further condone the falehoods. You should be talking to the actual abused because they don't agree with you at all.
Alicia Sep 17th 2007 6:52PM
Our gaming group is here at the house. Got a problem with that? Xaria showed us the post and everyone is reading it right now. There are 5 of us here at the moment, not one of us who agree with you. We all bring our laptops to Mike's house on Monday nights and raid Kara together. At 7pm server time if you must know. The other group goes to Tom's house. We are all RL friends since you're so nosey. Oh, btw, this is Alicia and it's my real name too. So you can lose the conspiracy theory.
Poormojo Sep 17th 2007 6:57PM
@92 Mike,
I don't condone abuse. I doubt anyone here does. But I don't think talking in WoW in a guild that you voluntarily join is abuse. Do you?
Remember: we are discussing TALKING.
And "the law is the law" is a bullshit argument. And a tautology. See my post above re: consensual oral sex among adults being illegal in most states.
Idu Sep 17th 2007 7:00PM
Yes, let's throw out every research that is even suggesting something we might not like to hear! Let's throw out science, let's not worry ourselves with evidence that might contradict our beliefs or reshape our thoughts, it must be EVIL. This has been the trend like... forever.
Surely those who have been forced and used against their will have experienced trauma, no question there. But have those that have been there willingly actually experienced the same thing as those that were forced? Have WE made them victims ourselves by beliving certain things and making them believe certain things? Questioning our way of reasoning and studing this issue is the only way to discover the truth. Be sure to notice, this has nothing to do with some people believing they are not doing harm when they actually are doing it.
Xaria Sep 17th 2007 7:02PM
I see me, Phoebe, Alicia, not sure which one the Mike was. Jason couldn't have posted because he's making salsa.
We start raiding in 5 minutes. I'm sitting here reading and making mage water. Anything else you need to know Inspector Clueso-Clueless?
Since all of us appear to think the same, there was definitely no need for anyone to post under different names because it all speaks the same sentiment, just differently. So if you're trying to make some sort of issue out of the fact that we're all friends, you just failed.
Poormojo Sep 17th 2007 7:06PM
So it's back to personal attacks then, eh?
You never answered any of my questions about this whole matter. Specifically the ones up in @88.
Here's a question: if the guild were all adults engaging in erotic role play, would it be okay with you? What if it were all teens?
Xaria Sep 17th 2007 7:10PM
The law says you can't solicit children online sexually, Poormojo. It really doesn't matter what you think or your book thinks.
Blizzard's policies also don't say, "Oh you can talk like that so long as it's in private." They may excuse more because it's done in private, but they aren't going to excuse unlawful things. Therein lies the difference. Get it straight! You can call it a bs argument all you want. That doesn't make it lawful. You're the one who needs to educate yourself. You do look like a fool to all of us here tonight.
I just want to say to all my friends reading, I really love knowing you and thank you for being my friends. My NORMAL friends who I can trust and have fun in life with. This crap is disgusting. It makes me cherish my normal gaming group all the more. Thank you!!
Ok, let's do this! I'm out to do kara.