Do you have roots in World of WarCraft?
by Mark Crump 
Oct 21st 2007 at 10:00PM
The first MMO I got hooked on was EverQuest. The harsh nature of the game forced you to bond with other people. Some of those bonds have lasted longer than I played the game. I started EQ seven years ago, and while it's been at least a year since I've logged in, I still chat with people I met in-game even though they've quit as well.Because WoW is an easier game than EQ (we can debate whether WoW is a training wheel game about as long as we can debate casual vs. hardcore), I'm concerned it might not have a long-lasting social fabric. In many ways my EQ guild was like family: we loved and fought (usually amongst ourselves) as much as most families. A guild alliance that lasted not even a year still has people stopping by to say "hi" six years after it disbanded. People stop by their old EQ guilds all the time. A lot of the time it's like old soldiers getting together to talk about a bad situation. "Say, Gan, remember that time it took us ten hours to almost clear Fear, and we wiped near the end and it and it took another ten to get our corpses? Was that a pain or what?" Shared misery can make for some long-lasting friendships.
In my EverQuest guild, I had over 2,000 posts on our guild's message boards. In my various WoW guilds I'm lucky if I have 50 over the last two years. One-third of my AIM list is people I met in EQ; zero are from WoW. How about you? How often do you talk out-of-game with other players, and will you keep in touch after you've quit the game? Is it because WoW doesn't have the hardships of other games, or am I just and old fogey remembering the good old days?
Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Odds and ends, Humor
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Erron Kelly Oct 21st 2007 10:13PM
Out of all my years playing games across the internets, I've only ever stayed in contact with one person outside of a game, and that game happened to be WoW.
We kept in touch due to a mutual interest in writing and now we both write for Daily Gaming News. So despite only keeping in contact with one person, it was probably the best person I could have kept in touch with.
rathe Oct 21st 2007 10:45PM
The reason I find that EQ had a stronger social network was that I had a more more incentive to do pickup groups than I do in WoW, and so I met more people on the server. In WoW, at max level unless there is an item in a dungeon that you need, or faction, there is no longer any need or desire to do it. In EQ there was at least AAxp.
On the other hand, pvp servers in WoW can be tight knit due to the strength in numbers when grouping when outdoors
slunk Oct 21st 2007 10:44PM
I have a large group of friends in EQ. Some of us were friends that we met in guilds, others, were quality players we grouped with regularly. We all shared a channel in EQ, we even shared account info. I still have a list of account info, 26 names, 12 have current passwords, from EQ and I've not played in over three years.
These are all people I trust, who trust me. I'm sure if I was to log into EQ, and ask the other 14 people for their current password, they would share it with me.
We spent alot of time together, we relied on each other, and we all still trust each other.
We have our own private messageboard. We are spread out over many, many games, and talk about that one game that will reunite us all.
All of the people in WoW I'm this close with, are either from EQ, 2 of them, or they are close RL friends of those two people.
My friends in WoW, I don't rely on. I don't need them on a day to day basis. Once a month, I might need to ask someone for help. In EQ, I had to every day.
I remember the first three people in EQ I grouped with, but I couldn't tell you the name of the tank who was in my WoW group 4 hours ago.
kunukia Oct 21st 2007 10:45PM
The guild I am in is a spinoff of an EQ guild. It is very tight, and there are many RL friendships that have come about because of friendship in WoW and this guild.
Redbull Fan Oct 21st 2007 10:47PM
I used to play EQ back when the kunark expansion was just just released to give my story a context. There are some of the players I played with in EQ that do play wow on various servers but a bulk of them either still "try" to play or play EQ 2. Because of the causal feel of WoW and the enormous amount of players on each server, you can run into a new person every day play, and you do. This limits the amount of interaction between players which would also limit the social factor.
Girl Meets WoW Oct 21st 2007 10:46PM
I've met about 40 of my guildies in real life, none of whom I knew before I started playing WoW, so I'm going to have to disagree on this one. Then again, maybe I just have an awesome guild.
Merus Oct 21st 2007 11:33PM
I never played EQ, nor do I intend to, but I played Puzzle Pirates. In that game, to get anywhere you need to join a guild - on the other hand, their LFG system is simple and effective, so every ship can nominate to appear on the LFG board for whatever they're doing, with players being able to join and leave the ship's crew at their leisure so long as it's not currently in battle - so you tended to get much stronger social relationships than you do in WoW, which is very achiever-killer focused, in the Bartle sense. (Blizzard don't want players being able to make any sort of lasting, non-anonymous impact on the world, which is foolish because we will anyway.)
Cadex Oct 21st 2007 11:34PM
I have several friends that I met in EQ who I talk to on a weekly basis. Apart from my RL friends in WoW, I rarely talk to them. Its just not the same atmosphere.
conankudo Oct 28th 2007 4:44PM
I don't keep in particular touch with some of the members of my old guilds, but whenever I pass them in SMV or Shatt or whatever (or they tell me it's them since they're on one of their many alts) we usually start talking about how things went in the past and catch with each other. I do keep in touch with a few people outside of WoW a little bit, but only a few that I have known for awhile and would consider pretty trustowrthy. If I do, I throw them onto my myspace and chat and keep up with them about RL and WoW simultaniously.
Amok2006 Oct 21st 2007 11:50PM
I've only been in WoW for just under 2 years and have zero contact with people from it. However, I have been a part of an FPS guild for the last 6 years. Hundreds of people over time with a steady 140 active. We do keep in touch and have far more camaraderie than in WoW guilds. Hell we even go to QCON every year with 30+ bodies showing up from around the world.
Its not that WoW doesn't have interesting people, its just not much keeps a group together for a long time. If WoW was less diverse this would change. Now its mostly groups of the moment whether it be PVP or whatever guild you're in for the moment.
Taeo Oct 22nd 2007 12:29AM
I'll have to agree and disagree.
I played EQ for a maybe a year or so. It definitely is a lot more hardcore as far as the amount of time and patience required to do anything. Skill wise it's a little hard to compare (most say WoW requires more "twitch" skill to play well where as EQ is slower but strategic).
My point is, due to the effort and time investment required to reach the level cap in EQ most of the players that make it that far are probably planning to stick around for quite a bit. It's hard to play Everquest casually and succeed. WoW players on the other hand tend to come and go. Casual players can do pretty well. In this way the AVERAGE WoW player is not as attached to his fellow players as an EQ player might be.
I happened to get lucky I suppose because I landed myself in an awesome guild nearly from the get-go in WoW. For nearly 2 years I was a member and webmaster for the most dominant guild on my server. We kept the same core group of 25 or so members for nearly the whole time pre-TBC.
I made many very good friends during my time there. Although I lived across the country from most of them I now keep in touch with many of them regularly outside of game. Hell I even have a place to stay should I ever decide to visit Australia. Although the guild collapsed shortly before TBC we remained pretty closely knit.
You can have the same sort of lasting friendships in WoW as you can in EQ, it's just a bit less common due to the casual nature of the game.
Leshrac Oct 22nd 2007 12:48AM
EQ was my first MMOG too, and as a result it is still my favorite MMOG. EQ was the first of its kind, a 3d MMOG, and WoW has improved upon what EQ did but they never truly were the innovators, WoW is evolutionary NOT revolutionary. Blizzard just built upon EQ, most of the lead designers and thought leaders at the helm of WoW were ex-EQ players (Rob Pardo, Jeff Kaplan, etc.).
I just don't get the same charge out of WoW as I did with EQ, the harsh death penalties really lent themselves to some intense fights. WoW is the Fisher Price MMOG, and truly welcomed at that, 2 AM corpse runs on weeknights got old. WoW is a softer, gentler and kinder MMOG but I think because of that it is less rewarding.
makabak Oct 22nd 2007 12:51AM
I think this could be a really great column. I enjoy hearing how WoW has changed over time.
Geeky, I know.
But if you're like me, you can check out current (and previous!) official patch notes at http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/patchnotes/ .
Also, here is Wowwiki's page on Patch History: http://www.wowwiki.com/Category:Patches
Deewee Oct 22nd 2007 1:28AM
Everquest1 ftw :-)
Played it myself 5 Years on Vallon Zek, Red Server.
And yeah you are right, the Family feeling was really something i am totally missing in WoW.
-Dw
hpavc Oct 22nd 2007 1:35AM
The Guild and Social system in WoW is horrid compared to what we are used to with even the most basic program on the the internet. Guilds are less than a irc channel from perhaps 20 years ago with some special ops commands .
WoW needs a better system, perhaps the ability to belong to more than one guild or to join special interest groups (for a lack of a better term). Sure I want to belong to the 'get things done' guild, but I wouldn't mind belonging to my RL friends vanity guild.
Yes you can make custome channels, but WTF is that value wise?
Still even the most basic IM client has more power than WoW. Yes I can install WIM, a friend note app, friend sync app, and some friend monitoring apps to keep track of where they are and what level they are, but most of these are pretty cheesy.
It seems WoW lacks severely in the Social / Guild system. Its quite hard to get to know people other than the 'tactical acquaintances', most of the good ones seem to be made in vent where all of the above is pretty much over.
Silvertusk Oct 22nd 2007 3:55PM
I've been in two WoW guilds that I will never forget. The first, Martyr (of Burning Legion - Horde) was a great, semi-casual-oriented guild that lasted a solid few months and had a cadre of great members. The guild has since disbanded due to the inability to beat Molten Core . . . (cough) . . . but, I still had a great time.
The second, Brothers of Night (also of Burning Legion - Horde), my current guild, I am fiercely loyal to. People have constantly attempted to poach my Paladin from their ranks, however I decline no matter how much I may or may not be offered. The guild is very casual-oriented, and we're currently farming Kara and Gruul, and are going to attempt SSC this coming week. We've lasted from Classic WoW and made the transition (with some minor amounts of trouble) to Burning Crusade. I don't think I'll ever stop going to the forums, and I very much doubt I'll ever leave them.
I dunno. The author is most certainly wrong, I guess is my point. I love my guild, I love the friends I've made, and I love World of Warcraft for its accessibility.
Dustin Oct 22nd 2007 5:15AM
EQ= Nerds of a feather stick together
WOw= theres nerds and normies guilds are hard to keep alive so are guild websites wow is more of a mix of the genres in ways wow is difficult and in ways it aint i think that goes the same for eq
flame on..
Lemming Oct 22nd 2007 5:56AM
I'd actually say it's because in Everquest, there was more time to sit around talking where as in WoW you actually want to play the game. :P
I started with UO, then played Galaxies, Guild Wars - then WoW.
Junzim Oct 22nd 2007 6:56AM
The best MMORPG relationships are forged in times of hardship.
In Shadowbane it was the sheer bloody mindedness not to lose all that you and your Nation/Guildmates had built up, a legacy and dedication that ensnared hundreds at a time.
Relationships with UO players were easily formed because back then there really weren't many MMORPG players so we all were generally of a similar type.
One of the most important themes in gaming is Risk/Reward.
In WoW there is no risk, you wipe in an instance? You res up and repair your gear. Your gear never 'dies', it can't be destroyed like it could be in Ultima Online or other MMORPGs. You never lose XP, your gold can't be looted, there's always a comfy bed at the inn for you.
You can't 'get worse' at your skills, nothing that you've attained can be taken away from you by the game or by another player. It's also the reason why WoW beggars are such a joke. WoW players suffer no hardships so the sense of comraderie is only really strongly present amongst players who routinely walk into the few fires the game has to offer: World PvP or Hardcore Raiding.
You tend to find the closest player relationships in those two areas of the game because in both you have groups of players who end up fighting alongside each other for protracted periods of time against often impossible odds. There's not many other areas of the game where you can realistically have your ass kicked over and over.
Caribbean Oct 22nd 2007 7:31AM
I don't talk to anyone out of game.