Patch 5.4 patch notes
Virtual Realms feature revealed
The Proving Grounds are coming
The latest patch 5.4 newsHunters no longer have FD Drink in 2.3: Bug fix or nerf?
by Robin Torres 
Nov 15th 2007 at 8:30AM
There is a new uproar on the forums, this time from Hunters -- petitions, titles in all caps, threads being moderated, etc. What are they all upset about? It seems an important item was left off of the Patch 2.3 notes:- Fixed a bug in which Hunters were able to disengage from combat using Feign Death during boss encounters.
The Hunters are upset because they were not just using Feign Death to drop aggro during boss fights, they were also restoring mana by drinking.
It has been suggested that this was actually nerfed because not only could you drink during a boss fight, you could also change gear. Nethaera agrees that this functionality was not intended, but still maintains this is a bug fix and not a nerf.
Along with the standard flame posts you would expect in this thread, there are also some constructive comments with possible solutions. Nethaera has promised to pass them onto the development team, particularly these two points:
- Hunter mana efficiency needs to be increased so that they don't need to drink during boss fights.
- Hunters should be able to feed their pets after being revived during a boss fight.
The fact that this "bug" is only "fixed" for boss fights is interesting. Also, did this just go unnoticed by players on the Test Realms or was this a last minute change added after the PTRs closed down before the patch? The details do seem a bit fishy.
What do you think? Bug fix or nerf?
| It's a nerf! Where's the petition? | |
|---|---|
| It's a bug fix. Hunters shouldn't be able to kick back and relax during boss fights. | |
| Ooooh! Polls are pretty. |
Filed under: Hunter, Patches, Analysis / Opinion, Bugs, News items, Forums
Reader Comments (Page 4 of 4)
ThorinII Nov 15th 2007 1:06PM
I have not taken the time to read all the posts so far, but I have to state my opinion on this even if it repeats someone else's...
As a Hunter, let me say, only huntards will be affected by this. I have NEVER feigned during a boss fight except to release aggro. If you are eating/drinking during a boss fight, you need to be ejected from the run. That shows you have no concern for your fellow players and are only out to save your own arse. You should have pots at the ready at all times no matter what class you are.
As for the "one ice blocked mob at a time" issue, this does complicate things a little. Especially during a bad pull when solo questing. But, you have lots of traps, a pet, a very small deadzone on your range weapon now, adapt and conquor for crying out loud. As an engineer I have explosives that buy a second or two when needed, they have saved my arse more than once.
**Hunters unite in educating huntards and save our class!**
hpavc Nov 15th 2007 1:50PM
The raid boss 'pulse' to get the raid parties into combat seems to be more aggressive and in higher frequency.
This would be the mechanic that keeps someone (a rezer) from shadowmelding, in prowl, etc in a hiding place in an instance and the rest of the raid fights the boss. The boss now knocks a hunter out of FD if if they are in a similar situation.
This could also be an attempt to address goofy loot exploits that went bad.
Spenda Nov 15th 2007 1:58PM
@57:
I think you are actually agreeing with the hunters talking about the cost of arrows/bullets.
The point was that every class who is raiding properly spends a lot of money to be prepared, but for some reason there is an irrational feeling that plate wearing tanks get the short end of the stick because of repair bills. 15g to repair your armor? Big deal. Maybe if it was 100g I'd have a little sympathy.
The guild banks can now pay for repairs, but what about all the other raid related costs? For the record I'm not suggesting that all raid costs should be communal, but just that tanks crying about armor shows a lack of understanding of other classes.
Melf Nov 15th 2007 2:16PM
Um, we haven't been able to FD + drink since they introduced the "in combat pulses" waaaaaaaay back in MC days when Paladins and Priests could hang back out of combat to do OOC rezzing zergs on bosses. This is nothing new. Any hunter feigning during a boss fight will be put back into combat within a few seconds anyway.
Not sure why people think this is a nerf...
Salty Nov 15th 2007 2:20PM
Feign death is not evil, only ignorance leads to that impression. Feigning death to drink during a boss fight is only an offense to the raid if it is not appropriate. Any time the raid leader calls to stop DPS for any length of time, it's a perfect place to FD and drink. In fact, if you weren't doing that, you weren't using the full gamut of your abilities to help the raid.
If you stop DPS to drink when you should be DPSing, yeah you're doing it wrong - but don't belittle hunters who are intelligent enough to do everything in their power to help the raid when it is situationally appropriate - including drinking at such moments to boost the overall DPS of the raid.
Let me tell you, as a raiding hunter, I use feign death at almost every cooldown. I don't wait to start DPSing until the tank has aggro because my job is to misdirect and hit my biggest damage-dealing shots. When those 3 shots are over, the tank has decent threat, I DPS really really hard until my threat gets high and I feign death, but before I've hit the ground I've checked if it was resisted, I've popped my damage trinkets and I'm casting a steady shot. I use FD to DPS as hard as I want immediately after the pull and throughout the fight. Additionally, I misdirect the tank every cooldown because those shadow priests and warlocks are gaining on his threat.
Feign death isn't for saving repair bills or surviving wipes. Feign death isn't only for huntards, it's for Hunters who realize it allows them completely unmitigated maximum damage from the instant the encounter starts.
Paw Nov 15th 2007 2:41PM
People can QQ all they want. It was what is was and now it is what it is. If it screws with your tactics, you're just going to have to learn a different method of play. Just like locks in PvP. Every patch sees a new (warlocks call them nerfs, everyone else calls them fixes), and PvP locks have to figure out how to compensate because it is highly unlikely that Blizzard will roll it back. In this case, the ones affected are Raiding Hunters, and given the evidence, Blizzard will likely leave it as they changed it. Roll with and get over it. Adjust your tactics and keep going.
Spenda Nov 15th 2007 2:46PM
@63:
You are exactly right about everything you said. Anyone who runs with hunters and sees them doing things differently than Salty should give them some helpful pointers.
Methian Nov 15th 2007 3:05PM
For all those out there calling this a "bug fix":
Bug fix is something implemented because something isn't working as intended. Calling a feature that has been in the game for years a "bug" isn't justified. The change in FD/combat mechanics is a change, not a fix. And, as most of you can agree, as it is a negative change it is, by defenition, a nerf.
FD+drink isn't really the question as most hunters haven't used this method bar a few select encounters since pre-TBC days. It is more about FD+pet feeding and fd+gear change. Unhappy pet drops escpecially BM hunter dps and with the added, on top of very high ammo costs (does any other class pay almost a silver for every 500 damage they do?), costs of repairing hunters will be the most costly class to raid with.
Sqeakerbeaep Nov 15th 2007 3:09PM
ok, what the ppl saying, fight like the rest of us dont understand...is that if everyone else dies...why not be able to fake death? the ability was given to the hunters. warlocks have health and soul stones, mages have easy mana regens. rogues, actually can sprint out of the instance...each class has their own special ability's. and if someone gets used to using that ability, then it should not be changed. Lets take away using a soulstone during a boss fight or, the evocation ability in a boss fight...FD can be used to get the aggro off the hunter and onto the pet, in most cases, if the hunter has gained to much aggro in a boss fight, and theres a warrior trying to get the bosses attention...well FD would be a good thing to use there. Its dependant on how you play, and really if you don't like hunters, don't play them and also, don't sit and complain about them, theres many reasons why things are the way they are. and also, Blizz shouldn't change things that affects the way a person plays the character. I don't even have a hunter, and i understand why ppl are mad.
hos Nov 15th 2007 3:30PM
Apparently Hunters havn't been doing this for 3 years and it's just now been noticed and labeled a bug.
k?
Wolfkin Nov 15th 2007 4:00PM
@Sensible Warrior-
I don't necessarily disagree with what you're saying, but I'm not sure I'm clear what analogy you're trying to draw with your "tooltip" statement. Are you saying that because the Feign Death tooltip doesn't say "removes hunter from combat" or something like that, this is by definition a bug or exploit?
guesswho? Nov 15th 2007 5:31PM
@39 I challenge you to name one class that needs to spend gold in order to dps. go ahead you cant amirite??
Connrad Nov 15th 2007 6:44PM
Ok, I wasn't aware you could do this, but I have also never run out of mana in a boss fight (I don't even have the mana cost reduction talent)....Ok, I did run dry once when I first started raiding and I had poor mana management, but I turned on aspect of the viper and kept autoshooting while my mana regenerated. If you switch to AotV occasionally, and use pots, you should be fine.
Also, I want to point out I find it amazing that people's guilds allowed them to stop DPSing long enough to drink to get mana back. If you did that a couple of times during a fight, you are missing out on quite a bit of DPS. If I had done that in my guild, they would have brought another hunter who knew how to manage their mana better.
Aberu Nov 16th 2007 9:55AM
I'm a hunter. It's a bug fix. End of story. Spirit is the second-most underused stat for hunters, but maybe they should start getting it. I used to be a spirit whore, and people would laugh at me, then I would beat them on the damage meters because of more passive regen. I had no need to FD drink at all.
J Nov 19th 2007 4:09PM
@71
Your argument sucks because hunters don't "need" to spend money to dps either. They can always melee. ;)
yey Dec 11th 2007 6:17PM
I play a hunter and I agree with salty in every point
and you dont need to spend 41 talent points on readiness to double trap, just lay down a trap, wait a few seconds, get a mob on the trap, and lay another one.... simple as that. I think they shouldn`t nerf that, imo that was not a bug, becouse once a mob gets trapped its not a active trap anymore, so you should be able to lay down another if your CD is down
I used to FD + drink when you have to stop ur dps and do nothing, it was an advantage, but it wasn't necesarie. Thats why mana pots exist and aspect of the viper, its makes your dps go down, but its way much better that keepengin Aspect of the hawck on and just auto-shooting.
I dont see the point that bosses should kill you with FD on, thats where the name comes from: "Feign death", simple like its name, feign death to avoid it