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All of the latest Mists of Pandaria newsAsk WoW Insider: Who pulls?
by Barb Dybwad 
Nov 16th 2007 at 8:35PM
Welcome everyone to Ask WoW Insider, where your questions get answers every week. Last week we looked at whether there are really people without alts, and this week we turn our attention to group strategy. David wants to settle the matter about who should be doing the pulling in groups: Now, this may just be me, or does it seem strange when people talk about hunter or mage pulls? I understand that in certain cases there is a need to have a hunter pull, especially with Misdirect, but when it comes down to it, any time I run something I never get to pull (Hunter here). Not that it's much of a complaint, more of a curiousity. For the most part Warriors will have a ranged weapon, Bears will use Faerie Fire, and Pallies will go with Avenging Shield. I just usually find it more complicated to pull with a hunter and then have the tank grab the aggro, when they all have ranged capabilities for pulls. I might also have been spoiled with all my tanks, as it has been months since I've PuGed a tank and we never seem to use CC in any instances anyways. Thought this may be a viable question, or maybe I'm the only Hunter out there that has been spoiled like this?What say you folks -- should hunters or any one class be doing the pulling in instances or in groups? Are there classes that should never pull? Should warlocks have "Wait for sunders!" mandatorily tattooed on their virtual eyelids? Who should pull -- let's hear it!
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Filed under: Instances, Quests, Ask WoW Insider
Reader Comments (Page 2 of 2)
Brian Nov 17th 2007 4:55AM
Depends entirely on the pull. 'Back in the day' I used to chain pull MC which was great fun. I know some tanks who prefer to pull as it gives them more control of where the mob paths. On the other hand there are also a few special 'pet pulls' which only a hunter can do. Then there's the sheep pull, where a mage sheeps one target and they all come running.
There is no one set class who should pull. That just limits creativity. :)
Sne Nov 17th 2007 5:16AM
We use sheep-pull...and it works like a charm. We are not hardcore gamers, but run heroic pre-Kara instances and the sheep-pull works there. Sheep-pull (mage aggro) ---> Frostnova the rest of the mobs (still mage aggro) ---> Lock(s) dot up all mobs (lock aggro) ---> Massive grp DPS based on raid-icons ---> Warrior shouts (Warrior aggro) ---> Usual heal/fight/Finish off mobs. The End. This way we have have 10 secs of controlled damage before the "real" fight starts (the warrior-part). It means that there are almost no damage done to the grp before the tank takes aggro after those 10 secs.
Schulf Nov 17th 2007 7:19AM
As a Druid Tank - Fire Mage and Hunter i'd like to add my opinion.
I dont like to pull as a mage. I feel insecure pulling as a Hunter and i like pulling as a tank.
As a Mage i have nothing protecting me from a group of mobs - lets say 3 or 4 Heroic like mobs. I am totally dead if the tank is not able to grab the initial aggro from me. I always refuse to sheep pull - but i am always looking out for the pull so that i can sheep as early as possible - most of the time its half a second after the pull so no problem for the tank to thunderclap or anything.
A Hunter is capable of pulling - no question there - but i dont like it. Sure i might survive 1 or 2 Hits on non heroic mobs propably even on heroic - but why would i want this ? I set my Freezing Trap away from the zone where i expect the fighting to take place - wait for a pull get my CC Target to the trap - while already engaging in Damage making And if the trap fails i use my survival skills to get the mob back to the tank. A pull with misdirection is ok - but there is the cooldown.
Why should i make the tank work for his/her aggro ? When tanking the first 5 seconds of a big battle - 3-5 non CCed Mobs - are the most important seconds of the whole fight. Every point of rage the tank doesnt need to waste on stupid stuff - like getting initial aggro - is important.
If a hunter pulls such a group and he starts off with the aggro of 3 targets that are not going to be crowd controlled - the tank has to get those targets back first before he can start with positioning the mobs - and getting the aggro going.
I'll give a more exact example.
A Druid Tank starts a fight with 30 Rage. only 30 small points of Rage to build aggro of so many mobs.
I normally pull with faery fire on a secondary target - while the mobs are approaching me i switch to the primary target and get ready to mangle and maul it.
Then i switch to tertiary and lacerate once. After giving the secondary another lacerate i go back to hitting the primary and use extra rage to swipe. Maybe if the mobs are hitting hard i have to add another lacerate on the secondary and tertiary to keep the healer safe.
And if i have to use 10 Points from my all so small starting pot of rage to get initial aggro i get cranky - because i could have used it so much better for a maul or something.
@6 : I have not read this post before - it is not badly written - but i still dont see the advantage a Hunter has over a Tank pulling. The author only considers a pull with 1!! target that has to be tanked.
If you only have 1 target left thats not crowd controlled i dont care who pulls - Hell let the healer pull - 1 Autoattack and the aggro is back at the tank no problem there.
As to the zone of ultimate safety - replace the hunter with a tank in the picture and you have the same result. only thing different - the tank will surely die if the pull does not work - the hunter might survive if not 1 mob resists feign death.
And another thing - a hunter can not do a misdirection pull - if he is trying to keep the group safe *g*
So that said - i like my hunter - its awesome DPS. In some encounters he can easily outDPS my Mage especially with a warriar tank and sunder armor.
Another big advantage Hunters have over most other DDs they will not have the same aggro problems most other DD classes have. Feign death after the first shots in a fight and you start with a clean aggro list ^^
Dave Nov 17th 2007 8:45AM
I'm not entirely familiar with Druid tanking, but don't druids have a rage generation ability they can pop and get at least enough rage to do an AOE type ability on a pull?
Warriors can pop bloodrage and get enough rage to demo shout or thunderclap and despite common ignorance that's PLENTY enough to pull mobs off a caster. They only get a token amount of splash threat from their buddy getting sheeped. Poly isn't a high threat spell. If we were talking a CS pull, then yes that's a little more dicey since CS dumps a lot of threat all at once. Poly, not so much.
The real issue is that most tanks want to be two button tanks and not have to use their full array of skills. Incidentally, this is why there are so many bad tanks, and a shortage of tanks overall. I know lots of warriors who do absolutely nothing but sunder and heroic strike. Nothing at all. Lazy! In those cases, Yeah I'd rather Captain Lazytanks pull I guess.
The other issue is still that most tanks feel they have to be %100 in control of the situation in a 5-man group no matter what. Most of the comments seem to agree with this, despite what the words actually are. Unfortunately, there are 4 other people and you're never in control as much as you think you are. Keep the CC out in front, that way you as a tank can use all your skills at all times to effectively generate huge amounts of threat.
Try it for a run through your favorite non-heroic instance. You might find that you like it a lot when you can just go nuts on everything without worrying about sheeps breaking and other CC going sour. I guarantee your DPS will enjoy it, because they usually have to hold back.
Maybe we're talking about vastly different worlds here, but I'm personally talking 5-man stuff. If you're in a Raid maybe your priorities change. I'd personally think it even MORE important to have a good tank who can effectively manage his threat generation and keep particularly dangerous trash at bay, but I guess once you're a guild leading tank, you're not going to let anyone steal your thunder ever, right?
itsthemechanec Nov 17th 2007 10:49AM
Tank pulls. Most of the time. It's the safest bet.
Except when I'm on my mage and I'm playing with who I know to be a competent tank -- then I'll happily sheep pull/break poly with PoM-Pyro because I know he's on the ball enough to charge and stun my targets long before they get a chance to harm me.
It's all about your crew, and how good they are. With a really good group of your homies you can play fast and loose even in Heroics and not wipe. (We've finished heroic Botanica before without wiping once.) If you got a PUG, then.. stay on the safe side and let the tank do the pulling.
Capn John Dec 14th 2007 10:04PM
LOL @ #12.
I'm guessing you play a Rogue...and...a Troll Rogue at that, right? Of course you're a Troll :D
droobles Jan 3rd 2008 9:20AM
As a feral tank, I like to do the pulling. As others have said, irrespective of who pulls, I need to be in control of the fight. Its easier for me stay on top of things if I am sure of the kill order, and if I start out with the aggro. That being said... FFF is a weaksausage pull. I prefer to pull, especially with multiple targets, with a starfire on the secondary (or tertiary) target, followed by an immediate moonfire on the primary (or secondary target). This generates more than enough aggro on later-in-the-kill order MOBs to keep them off the healer while I build up respectable aggro on the higher-in-the-kill-order MOBs.
The GCD for shapeshifting is up by the time the MOBs run to you (if you SF/MF at max range) and you can start tanking with a good threat lead on the rest of your party.
Also - this gives me something to do with my mana that just seems to sit around otherwise!
But I'm leet, so your mileage may vary.