Totem Talk: A deep discontent

I really didn't see this coming. Perhaps I'm naive. Perhaps I simply don't keep track of these things in a sufficient manner. But if you'd told me that shamans were going to be nerfed again in patch 2.4, I honestly would have laughed. No way, I would have said confidently, there's no way they'll nerf shamans again. Clearly, I underestimated the capacity for nerfing inherent in the shaman class. Now, I've already heard all the responses... that it's a PvP nerf to keep elemental shamans from outputting crazy burst damage. Yes, I've heard tell that Kalgan promises buffs as well as nerfs in 2.4 and that's good. But the bare fact of it is, yet again, a specific shaman spec gets a direct DPS nerf. By themselves, these nerfs aren't any major deal. But when you see a series of them popping up like this, it's extremely disheartening and all the nebulous promises of incoming buffs (with no specifics or concrete details) don't counter the disappointment and in some cases outrage of seeing your talents and abilities become less useful.
Now, every class has been and will experience changes like this, it's the nature of attempting game balance between wildly disparate classes with varying abilities. There's no conspiracy here. Rob Pardo's daughter does not hate shamans (to my knowledge). And yes, I still enjoy the class myself and like playing a shaman. I think we bring a lot to raids and instances. But I also worry for the future of the class, especially when I see veteran players getting ever more frustrated, angry and fed up with it.
Is this going to be the end of elemental shamans in PvE or PvP? No. It's not a crippling set of changes, merely an inconvenient set. While the ultimate effect of this particular change will be minor, the effect of change after change reducing the spec's damage is ultimately one of discontent and alienation among the players of that spec. Elemental shamans grew in popularity specifically because of nerfs to enhancement combined with much better itemization for them in Burning Crusade, in my opinion, but to call any shaman spec popular is to be understood in the context of shamans as a singularly underplayed class. Both druids and paladins, the other two hybrids, are significantly more popular than shamans. Going over the WoW Web Stats of my guild's last Tempest Keep raid, I see that we brought two shamans out of 25 people, one elemental, one resto. We had four druids and five paladins.
It's not that shamans can't perform well in raids. They most certainly can. It's that there is a constant sense of uncertainty, a sense of 'what will they do to us this patch' that infects the shaman community and, no matter how positive you are, no matter what forums you avoid, no matter your love for the class you're aware of its presence. You're aware of how few shamans there are at 70 when your guild can recruit every class but shamans. As someone who, honestly, wants to promote shamans of all specs and see them in raids and PvP, I find this to be troublesome. It's hard to convince people to play and level a shaman when the old veterans are retiring their characters in disgust and there's no one to show new players how to learn what to do.
It's in the spirit of a real fan of the class and its unusual advantages to any group that I look at the process of balancing classes and how its affecting shamans, and more importantly, shaman players. Sometimes we forget, or choose not to consider, that the people who post irate screeds on the forums or who complain in guild, the guy making a comment on a website, that player isn't always just upset to inconvenience you. He or she has put real time and effort into his character, has chosen a spec, assembled the necessary gear to make that spec viable, worked out strategies in how to play it. only to have to reconsider it again and again and again. Since shamans increase the DPS of players around them, it can be especially easy for those players to forget or ignore the effects of these sorts of changes. After all, reducing Call of Thunder's critical chance doesn't reduce the benefits the mages and warlocks get from Totem of Wrath, so why should they care if the shaman herself takes a DPS hit? This is why at times I wish that these adjustments would be in a manner that affected the shaman's buffs to other classes, but I'm under no illusions: if that happened, guilds would probably just use less of the shaman than they already do.
In looking at the specific nature of the most recent adjustments to elemental shamans, it's hard for me to see any benefit to it from a PvE standpoint. Our elemental shaman, while an excellent player with a host of knowledge about the spec (which I've been brutally stealing in order to level my own) is rarely exceeding our casters or rogues. There's simply too much else she has to do, dropping totems, interrupting casts, throwing backup heals when needed, for her to dedicate all of her time or energy to purely DPSing. I don't know why it was necessary to reduce their crit chance. From a PvP standpoint, I've never run into an elemental shaman in Arenas, so I can't comment. In AV, I kill them fairly easily. They're harder to kill in WSG and AB, where they can put up a surprisingly hard fight. I still don't feel particularly overawed by their burst DPS (with the proper array of cooldowns and trinkets, yes, they can chain lightning an entire opposing group for significant damage. Is it overly effective? I'm not qualified to make that judgment. But I am interested in seeing what this does to elemental shamans in PvP, along with the set bonus reduction on their arena gear.
These aren't game breaking changes. But when shamans see their signature talents reduced in effectiveness (the 'change' to Earth Shield being a weird hybrid of a nerf and a buff) repeatedly, it's disheartening. When shamans are told changes will increase their DPS when in fact they decrease it, it's confusing. When every single patch seems to hold some kind of lurking dread for your class, it can become maddening. While we do have Sentry Totem to help ease the pain, it can seem like the class must be terribly broken to see so many adjustments on top of each other, and each one a reduction in some ability or another. (Ah, what would we at Totem Talk do without Sentry Totem jokes?) I personally hold out some hope that the promised buffs Kalgan speaks of are more than vapor, that we'll see issues of totem management addressed and that all three shaman specs get some love. But I guess I'm one of the stubborn ones. There's really not much that could be done to make me unhappy with my shamans.
I probably shouldn't have said that, huh? Ah well, I guess if I'm going to dare the universe to prove me wrong I can suck it up if it does.
Next week I hope to pick enough brains to get a working answer to how shamans in 2.4 will stack up.
Filed under: Shaman, Patches, Analysis / Opinion, PvP, Instances, Raiding, (Shaman) Totem Talk, Battlegrounds, Arena
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Reader Comments (Page 3 of 3)
TheCarnifex Feb 21st 2008 2:48PM
I have a 70 Elemental Shammy on Malfurion Alliance side. I can honestly say I feel as if I'm stuck at level 64. You must play your toon to the hilt to be viable in raids and PVP. No, I'm not asking for an easy button, but it feels like trying to blow up those long clown balloons after smoking a pack or two. You can do it, but you'll be gasping your lungs out with blue lips.
Now what do we have to look forward to? A nerfing on gear that is NOT easy to get from arenas for us (ele). Yeah, yeah, "shamans are OP" and "l2p noob". I remember getting my butt handed to me in BG's pre-BC by shamans. I also remember that the trade of Paladin and Shaman for Horde and Alliance was for balance. Balance...riiight.
I have parked my shaman and only bring him out for special occasions, kind of like the nice plates you use when company comes to dinner. They look nice, but are not for everyday use.
Stay focused my browbeaten brothers, our day will come. And glory shall surround us with cries of "Nerf shamans!"
Bresh Feb 21st 2008 3:13PM
Well... If you can't figure out *why* our class (Shaman. Was born, and will die, a Shaman in WoW) is less popular in raiding scenarios than the other two hybrid specs... you need help. Let's look at the skill sets:
Shaman: DPS, DPS, or Healer.
Druid: DPS, Healer, or Tank.
Paladin: DPS, Healer, or Tank.
If that doesn't sum up the entirety of the situation, I don't know what will. Unfortunately, it's simply a fact of life for those of us who are dedicated to our class. My first toon was a Tauren Shaman, and I played him for a year and a half, to 70 before switching servers and rolling a Draenei Shaman to be with friends. That one's at 52 currently and leveling fast, and he's already got guilds attempting to poach him since I already know I'm going Resto. Once I get this Shammy up to 70, I'm going to roll another so that I can have *two* raiding healers since my current guild still needs one.
Do we have problems? Yeah. Are we the only ones? No. Do we seem to have a higher percentage of people whining given our lower numbers? God. Yes. But it's kinda funny. Every time Blizz decides to make a change to our class, it doesn't seem to bother me. Ok... the Clearcasting change pissed me off, but that wasn't isolated to Shaman, so I let it go.
Thing is, I wouldn't trade my class for anything. And chances are I'll be the last Shaman standing after everyone else rerolls. I knew what I was getting into when I rolled this one. Healer in Mail. And yet, I may roll a third simply because I'm having so much fun leveling ENH. My hunter? She's neglected nowadays simply because I found the life of a Hunter boring at 70. She's good for farming, and the occasional instance run, but good luck getting me to play her when I hit 70 on my Shaman.
But, that's just me...
wally Feb 21st 2008 3:41PM
So when is this blog going to be renamed shamen-insider?
jefeweiss Feb 21st 2008 3:49PM
I have played MMORPGs since Everquest "The Early Years" and I'll give everyone a bit of advice. It's a lot more fun to just play the game and not worry about the buffs and nerfs. Just play the hand you're dealt. You will be a lot happier with the game, and if you spend a lot of time thinking about the game when you're not playing, you will be a lot happier in general.
Most of the time that anyone spends "QQing" about how OP some other class is or how their class needs some buffs is time wasted forever. Going down that road is one of the things that ruined previous games for me. Just let it go.
Calybos Feb 21st 2008 4:05PM
Good advice, Jefe.
Irv Feb 22nd 2008 1:05AM
and that is why i don't PvP that much. success is so tied up with other classes' abilities and Blizzard's own concept of "balance".
PvE is less stressful, and you keep your sanity.
vildand Feb 21st 2008 3:59PM
I can't remember the last time I visited wowinsider without some kind of whine article, and I've frankly about had enough of it. Shamans have trouble, and I personally support buffs for shamans, but we get it already. You guys don't have to keep reminding us.
Discontent and complaints are always based on personal opinions, and personal opinions are always going to offend/bore/annoy someone. And while I can see the need for a horde of new articles on a community page like Wowinsider, your sistersite joystiq seems to do just fine without whining.
Doma Feb 21st 2008 4:38PM
No one is forced to read this. Considering the hysteria on the forums, this column is consistently well spoken and comprehensive.
frankly, the fact that it's been dismissed (by other classes and blizzard alike) as excessive QQ is part of the problem.
totem talk is about/for shamans- if people get tired of seeing consecutive articles about shaman nerfs, then blame the rolling patch, not the people being affected.
All the commotion may seem excessive, but this has been steadily brewing for a long, long time. In proper context, this column is justified.
anonymoose Feb 21st 2008 4:24PM
"Shamans were nerfed in the scaling to 70 precisely because they were so powerful at 60. The fundamental aspects of the class that caused this still exist, so to compensate they have been underpowering shamans, making everyone unhappy. Recent changes have brought the class closer to the other classes in terms of implementation of abilities."
What?! What?! What are you trying to say? Shaman were nerfed because they were powerful? Some remnants of that remain so for everyone in WoW to be safe, nerfing will continue?
So how do we explain warlocks, and any other class of the minute which is currently OP? Shaman were formidable pre 2.0, there is no denying that. However, why is that bad?
When 2.0 came out there were 2 classes my holy priest could solo in a pvp environment--warriors and shaman. That's considering the painful nerfing that holy priests saw as well.
Honestly, there isn't much sense to it that I can see--I'm really unclear why you would want to gimp one specific class but not another. Or better yet, buff one class and another.
Someone insert the link from the EU forums of the CM stating that stats didn't show shaman were unpopular, just overwhelming popularity for other classes...
Matt Feb 21st 2008 5:32PM
We regularly take 3 Shamans, one of each spec. That is just slightly over their proportional representation (25/9=2.7). Taking 5 of any class is ridiculous, that isn't a Blizzard issue, that is a poor raid leader/guild recruitment. I recognize that Shamans have issues, but complaining about their PvE representation while comparing them to a class that has 5 in your raids is silly.
Salchow Feb 21st 2008 6:28PM
In PvE:
Resto shaman is great, only matched by CoH priest in raid healing.
Enh. shaman seems like every raid wants one to buff their melee dps, but 1 is all you want. And that is how it should be.
Ele. shaman. Most Really High End guilds don't use one, because they don't feel it brings enough in terms of dps compared to bringing a mage or warlock instead.
We can all sit here and argue about numbers of dps, hps, or whatever you want. But, the fact of the matter is this. You are viable when the guilds at the very top wants you in their raid. Untill then you are just the best that could fill the spot untill they find a pure class to take your spot.
PvP.
I leave to someone else
Rudi Feb 21st 2008 7:15PM
So I went to try to find some numbers. First, the number of lvl 70's by class (http://www.warcraftrealms.com/census.php?serverid=-1&factionid=-1&minlevel=70&maxlevel=70&servertypeid=-1). Second, the number of each class ranked 1850+ and 2200+ in Arena PvP (http://www.realmhistory.net/arena-statistics/class-breakdown.html). I then weighed the number of each class in the Arena PvP rankings based on the ratio of that class to the highest population class at lvl 70 (Warriors, surprisingly). For example, there are 58 Shammies per 100 Warriors, so I bumped the Arena PvP rankings based on that ratio. This creates what I would hope would be a list of the rankings in all Arena PvP if you disregard class population. Here are the results:
2v2 1850 2v2 2200 3v3 1850
18702 Druid 285 Druid 14669 Rogue
14787 Rogue 194 Warrior 13446 Druid
13231 Warlock 164 Warlock 13259 Priest
13109 Warrior 147 Rogue 11959 Warrior
13082 Priest 109 Priest 10626 Warlock
8457 Paladin 57 Hunter 10114 Shaman
8101 Shaman 46 Shaman 9576 Paladin
6249 Mage 23 Paladin 8635 Mage
5722 Hunter 11 Mage 5856 Hunter
3v3 2200 5v5 1850 5v5 2200
213 Druid 8346 Shaman 252 Priest
198 Rogue 8335 Paladin 230 Paladin
194 Priest 7997 Priest 221 Shaman
152 Warrior 6648 Warrior 161 Warlock
117 Warlock 5978 Warlock 150 Warrior
111 Mage 4752 Mage 130 Mage
69 Hunter 4741 Druid 108 Druid
65 Shaman 4144 Rogue 82 Rogue
42 Paladin 3074 Hunter 74 Hunter
Hopefully the format isn't too hard to read but Shaman performance in Arena PvP closely mirrors Paladin performance, and both dominate in 5v5. The only class that looks like really needs a buff are Hunters.
Imogynn Feb 21st 2008 8:38PM
Your numbers are obviously flawed. You adjust for population assuming that the size of the population has nothing to do with arena. You assume that a big population with a small arena population shows poor performance of the class; and that is just a plain bad assumption.
Hunters are popular for nice easy levelling, they are a fun choice for non-serious players. There are serious players playing hunters, but it is also a class with huge casual apeal. The lack of hunters in arenas is probably due to lack of casual wanting to play arena in the first place.
Shamans on the other hand it seems that the shaman class is leaking players because it has a (?deserved?) reputation as being a poor performer in any thing but raids. The reason the shaman class is small is because it is thought to have poor pvp and heroic performance.
---
You really can't make the assumptions you are making from the stats you are presenting. Its just bad logic.
Moofles Feb 21st 2008 7:46PM
The problem with shamans is not pve but pvp. Has been for years.
The only chance shamans have in Arena is a paly that will BoP them right when someone jumps them.
Granted that both elemental and enhancement shamans can put out a lot of dps. But, thats all assuming that the other team ignores the shaman and doesnt cc him. Which just about never happens ever in arena.
Everyone knows to CC the shaman or DPS the shaman first.
Why? obviously they are the weakest with absolutely no CC or anti CC. No survivability besides wearing a shield, having an earth shield.
That and Totems are useless in PvP.
Dunjeon Feb 22nd 2008 11:28AM
I have been playing a shaman since beta. When wow classic released on the 24th of November I was playing a shaman that night, and am still playing that exact same character. I've spent a year playing each spec, leveled from 1-60 as elemental, turned into a resto shaman for a year for end game, then leveled to 70 as enhance and raid end game as enhance now.
There's not been a nerf I can't really deal with. It makes me sad to see the class get nerfed in patch after patch, but we also get some pretty good buffs along with it (enhance really got some huge buffs in 2.3, and watershield, on the whole, is a megahuge awesome amazing buff for the class). In fact, watershield is such a hugely powerful buff, I will be very surprised if we get any significant buff this patch.
If you are a serious arena player you know that watershield is devastating in terms of longevity for resto shamans, same for enhance and elemental. It's such a huge buff I can't believe people don't recognize it as such. Of course the changes to the enhance tree are mostly pve centric they are so good that again, it would surprise me if we get any significant buffs out of 2.4.
The nerfbat for our class is something you either learn to deal with and play around, or quit and reroll rogue or warlock. I have stuck with it, and will continue to do so, I've always felt blizzard has done what's best for the class according to their own agenda and if they neglect us in 2.4, you just have to say to yourself, "Ah well, there's always next patch."
By the way, to the comment directed at the WF rank5/4 nerf in 2.1, I was very upset when this happend as well, but after raiding through the end game content I can safely say that if they hadn't added the CD there is no way we would fit the role of support DPS. Our dps is very very good even with the nerf and I don't honestly see that CD being lowered ever.
Dwarfbane Feb 22nd 2008 4:06AM
I have had a shamen for 2 1/2 years. I love him in pve and battle grounds. Hes resto so not much is broken at all. In arenas I struggled along for a while and got sick as even with full S1/S2 vindicator it was just so hard.
So I now play my alt frost mage in arena, got 300 higher ranking with crap gear and enjoy that part of the game with him.
I would love it if enhance becomes the viable 2v2 build as I havent played enhance for a while and its lots of fun.
As previous posts have said if you worry about every little change you will become bitter and twisted.
JrSlacker Feb 22nd 2008 5:09AM
I honestly think that people don't see shamans as useless, it's more so finding good ones. On many occasions I've grouped with other shaman, and it's bad to see how some people play the class. I've been grouped with countless ENH shaman who don't think it's important to put totems down, but is important to spam earth shock constantly, and also don't find it important to off heal if needed.
I roll Elemental, and I enjoy every minute of it. I've done a few Kara raids, and have hit the top three in DPS, and I'm using "welfare epics", and I only get praise from the people in there. Our class is not meant to be a "blow the guy up" class, we are SUPPORT, just like in WC3.
Our totems bring so much to the table, that I don't know how many times against Maiden that grounding totem has saved all of our casters and healers from her holy fire. Countless times has tremor totem saved any group I've ran with from running into other mobs, and I don't care what anyone says, but I think many of us do not know how much other classes appreciate the buffs we bring.
As for 2.4 goes, it's not official until the day it's patched in, and who knows what else will happen, only time will tell.
Vestras Feb 22nd 2008 8:47AM
I've only fairly recently made an effort to get to know the shaman class, but I gotta agree, Blizz loves to beat them with a nerf bat on occasion, they really need a make over from the top down.
I can only hope that blizz will get some long time players and listen to what people want, and actually give it to them! It's great that there will be a CC ability in the 71-80 range, but how does that help leveling 1-70?
As a side note, I reall wish blizz would stop harming PVE (Which makes up the majority of the game) just to balance crap for PVP (which is an afterthought).
Angus Feb 22nd 2008 9:47AM
Here is the world through the eyes on an enhancement shammie that plays resto when the guild desperately needs him too.
My class has become a frustration of the highest degree. Not because of constant nerfs, but because of "consistancy"
Blizzard's devs have none. Prior to TBC there were 3 ways to PVP. CC and kill, survive (and kill) or Burst kill.
Mage: 3 Warlock: 1
Warrior: 2,3 Rogue: 1,3
Priest: 2 Druids: 2
Paladin: 2 Hunter: (1),3
Shaman, 2,3
Now with BC we have the following ways to kill people.
CC and kill, survive and kill. They want bursting someone down to not happen because "It is not fun to just get instagibbed." Let's look how the stuff works now
Mage: 1,2 (thanks to iceblock, numerous escapes and tricks)
Warlock: 1,2 (thanks to insane health and pet)
Warrior: 1,2 (intimidating shout, charges, plate, health, MS)
Rogue: 1,2 (cheat death, vanish, Cloak, stunlock)
Priest: (1),2 (mana drain, MC, healing through it, CC iffy)
Druid: 1,2 (do we need to go there? Cyclone, lifebloom spam)
Paladin: 2 (some CC, well timed it effectively ruins you)
Hunter 1,2 (traps, MS shot, purge shot, rage to survive)
Shaman: 2 (that's all we got, outlasting you)
The funny part is that every OTHER class got stuff to make up for losing their burst potential. Shaman have now effectively be stripped of their burst damage. But there is no corresponding increase in CC to make up for it.
So which is worse, being instagibbed with no chance to stop it, or watching your shaman get CCed and killed over 5-10 seconds with no way to stop it after 1 trinket, that everyone else has access to and have extra CC to just put you back in it?
Now try playing that when in PVE they only want CC DPS and gear you really need requires badges. Leather gear, because you have no itemization.
Oh, they also changed Ret paladins' itemization for them, after saying they wouldn't because people had bought it, as is. But they are not going back and changing enhance shaman itemization after 2.3 made all that MP5 an utter waste of points. Not consistent.
Rogue mace spec has a 6% chance to stun with 5 pts. Not consistent.
List goes on.
pablo Feb 22nd 2008 7:19PM
Great post. I play a 70 ele shaman as my main and all time favorite character and am getting fed up with the nerfs. I play end-game raids as well as pvp bg's and arena and we are gettin hit on every front. This thing with nerfing the pvp set gear resistence to LB interruption is very troubling to me. It is simply not fair of Blizz to retro-activly screw with gear you have allready gotten through your blood, sweat and tears. If they want to nerf the new s4 gear then fine, people will know what they are getting before they "buy" it but it is maddening that they can come back after you aquire your whole set, mainly for the set buff, and then nerf you big time. Enough Blizz. It makes me wanna quit playin WoW.