Officers' Quarters: Saving a PuG guild
Anyone who has an unguilded bank alt can appreciate this scenario: You're in the auction house, minding your own business, when without any warning the whole auction interface goes away, only to be replaced by a guild charter that someone wants you to sign. It's pretty annoying and rude when people do that without asking first. If you're not in a guild, it can happen to you anywhere.
Usually they don't want you to actually stick around once the guild is formed, but other people actually send guild invites this way. It's not as bad when it's a noncharter invite, since it doesn't close any of your windows. But it always mystified me that people would recruit like this. They don't know anything about you; you don't know anything about them. So it's not so much a guild as it is a long-term pick-up group. I suppose some of the members must know each other, but everyone else was just scooped up fresh from the Barrens. Do you ever wonder what might happen if you actually joined that guild and stuck with it? This week's e-mail comes from someone who did.
Hi Scott --
Thanks for the column. Believe it or not, even those of us who don't lead guilds tune in and get some good tips and advice from you.
I'm an unashamed noob who suddenly has a guild issue. Here's how it breaks down . . .
I got massively bored with my Night Elf Druid after getting him to Ashenvale, and nearly gave up on WoW. I'd only sunk three weeks into the game, and still had another week in the bank, so I rolled a new character. Right out of the gate, I decided to play a more social game: get into more pick-up groups, join a guild, and figure out what these "instance" thingies were all about. So when I was in the middle of a fight and a guild invite popped up onto my screen, I joined immediately.
No, it didn't occur to me that someone spamming invites at level-2 characters might be a member of a pretty weak guild.
So now it's two weeks later, and I've had almost no contact with my guild. In fact, the guild doesn't really seem to exist in any meaningful way. Members that don't quit within two days simply stop logging in. The guildies who *do* login seem to be good folks, eager to play a better game and have a good time, but there aren't very many of them. I'm now the highest-leveled and most-active player in the guild, but as a low-level, uninformed new player, I don't know that I have much to offer to the rest of the folks. And in terms of gaining new skills, experiences, or insights, I'm not getting anything out of my guild membership. In fact, I'm in pretty much the same boat I was with my druid, and I'm losing interest in solo grinding against gigantic spiders. It seems like, without good, solid teamwork, a guy misses out on a lot of good stuff WoW has to offer.
Here's my question: How does someone repair a guild? What can a noob bring to the table in a guild setting, that can help his officers and guild master revitalize things and move on ahead? I hate giving up or abandoning people, but I guess quitting the guild and shopping around for a more experienced, more active guild might be the best option for me. What do you think?
Thanks . . .
"Ziggy"
Ziggy, you are boldly blazing new territory. Most people would have given up long ago, and I respect your desire to save this guild from itself. Even though you aren't an officer, that's officer-quality initiative!
Yes, you probably would be way better off trying to find a new, established guild. I can't imagine a worse way to start a guild that just randomly throwing invites at characters without a guild tag. I could write volumes about how to find a good guild, but plenty of people before me already have, so let's focus on your desire to fix this "PuG guild" you've found yourself in.
The first thing I would do is find out who's in charge and see if they've given up, too. It's a simple matter: Hit the O button, click on the Guild tab, toggle Show All Players, and see who the highest-ranked members are. Now see how long it has been since they have logged in. If it's been longer than a week, these people probably aren't too interested in running the guild.
Send the guild leader an in-game letter politely asking the officers what they plan for the future of the guild and what you can do to help. You might even ask them if they want to turn the guild over to someone who is online more often. Go ahead and offer to take over if you want to. I wouldn't worry too much about how they'll react. You have nothing to lose!
If it's been shorter than a week since an officer was online, or you do see one of them online frequently, you should approach him or her about your concerns and offer to help move the guild in the right direction.
It's possible that you'll never hear back and the officers will never be online again. In that case, it's going to make your job all but impossible, since no one will have access to the guild interface and presumably no one will have the authority to invite new members or promote existing ones. Your only recourse would be to have everybody quit the guild and form a new one, run by officers who actually play. However, without any viable means to communicate this transition to all of the members, making sure everybody is aware of the new guild will be tricky. You'd have to add every character to your friends list and whisper them next time they're online.
For guilds to thrive, they need above all else a means to communicate. The best tool for this is a Web site with your own forums where members can post ideas, officers can schedule events, etc. But sites generally cost money and they do take time to set up. You're probably a long way from that step.
So, once you get the officers' attention, suggest they schedule a meeting using the only means of communication available to you: the in-game guild interface tools. They could change the guild's message of the day to tell people about the meeting, and put more details in the Guild Info window. Make sure they give members at least a week's notice. You could have everyone physically meet somewhere in Azeroth, but really you just want as many people as possible online at the same time. The purpose of the meeting is (1) to see how many people actually care about the guild, (2) to get to know each other a little bit more and find out what everyone's needs and expectations are, and (3) to discuss steps for taking the guild to the next level, such as scheduling nights for regular instance runs, setting up the guild bank, and so on.
If the current officers aren't interested in doing this, ask them to promote you so you can set it up and run the meeting. Don't worry about being a "noob." If you have the highest level character, it's possible everybody else is a noob, too. We were all noobs once, and I certainly had no idea what I was getting myself into when I was the one running around getting everybody to sign our charter (and I actually knew 9 out of the 10 signees!). But it's worked out for me -- it can work out for you!
At the meeting, if nobody shows up for it, you've pretty much established that the guild is a dead end. Go ahead and quit. Find a new guild and move on. But you might be surprised. Maybe people will be excited that someone is willing to take charge and make it into a real guild rather than a bunch of strangers with a common chat channel. What you do next will all depend on what the members want. You might not have all the answers, but at least they'll know that someone is listening to them and trying to help.
/salute
Send Scott your guild-related questions, conundrums, ideas, and suggestions at scott.andrews@weblogsinc.com. You may find your question the subject of next week's Officers' Quarters!
Filed under: Guilds, Officers' Quarters (Guild Leadership)






Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Naix Mar 3rd 2008 11:06AM
You can not save the unsaveable. PUG guilds are stepping stones to better active guilds. Having a guild name under your name is like walking into a bar with a woman. You have shown yourself to be wanted, acceptable, and desirable.
So don't fix the guild, use the guild.
Zarzuur Mar 3rd 2008 11:10AM
This also happens in the starting zones, especially Northshire .. "sign plz", without warning or explanation!
Shrama Mar 3rd 2008 11:14AM
I have one method for that: "1g" :-)
I can make it or not... but I will not be asked again... usually I leave such a guild anyway and it is nice money when you are new on the server and you have nothing (but not only then - it is nice alcoholic beverage party later too) :-)
Daniel Mar 3rd 2008 11:15AM
I disagree that PUG guilds don't work. Indeed, in all reality, the guild that I run is a PUG guild. If it weren't then I wouldn't have met some of my best friends in the game.
The thing is that we do have standards. Players must be lvl 20+, and spend a couple days at a reduced privilege rank, where we can see if they are assholes or not. If they are we just kick them (we have a good group of officers, all again people who I didn't know before I invited them), if not then they become members.
This seems to work, and although you do get the occasional quarrel, it gives for some sociality while leveling. While PUG guilds may not be the best around, as said above, they are a stepping stone to learning more about the game, and just generally having fun.
anonymoose Mar 3rd 2008 2:06PM
I think we need to define our terms more carefully. If you have "standards" you are not a PuG guild.
The guild the OP is describing is what I would call a "drive by ginvite" guild. They don't care about standards, they just random invite.
Azhural Mar 3rd 2008 11:22AM
I actually joined a pug guild when I started my rogue after 2.3 hit. I saw this one hunter being online the same times I was so we where trying to get a teamspeak server to play on. As soon as we got one we did instances together and eventually formed our own guild, which lead us to the one we're in now and have been since November.
I'd suggest you find someone you like in your guild and then move on to better things with that person.
Slayblaze Mar 3rd 2008 12:03PM
"You're in the auction house, minding your own business, when without any warning the whole auction interface goes away, only to be replaced by a guild charter that someone wants you to sign. It's pretty annoying and rude.."
One word that fixes that: "Autodecline"
Don't leave Ironforge without it.
Ravenswing Mar 3rd 2008 2:48PM
I won't go into Ironforge without it either. Wonderful toy.
MechChef Mar 3rd 2008 1:20PM
I'm not much of a guild whore. I've only been in two guilds since the beginning of my in-game life. I guess if I were in an abusive relationship where my girlfriend beat me, I'd stick it out. Essentially, #1 was a stepping stone. A leveling guild. I got fed up and quit because it would never become end-game. #2 is also a stepping stone, though I've not milked it for all its worth. I still need a few more Kara pieces before moving on. It it weren't for the occasional 25-man we run, I'd have quit already.
I guess my point is that you can try as much as you can, if a leveling guild sucks, there probably isn't much hope you'll be able to fix it. Get a few levels, jump ship, try someone else. Then find something serious @ 70.
Oh, and to the author, if your bank-alt is sick of getting /ginvites, create your own guild so you can have your own g-bank. "Offering 1G for guild signatures, no commitment required" in starting areas is a fast way to get the sigs.
~Lootbabe - Campaign of Hatred
lvl 2 Belf pally
Bank alt. Guild Master.
Omenator Mar 3rd 2008 12:12PM
I've toyed with the idea of starting another guild. I even went so far to roll a lowbie and buy a charter so I didn't have to gquit my current one.
I ran out to barrens with my new charter and spammed general chat offering "1g to sign charter, you will be gkicked on turn in". I filled my roster in 5 minutes. Only one person asked why they couldn't stay.
Inviting anyone below 50 without a main is asking for character abandonment.
Of course, as soon as I did that, I decided to stay where I'm at, so now I have a level 10 GL of a guild of 1. He is decked out with a sweet tabard and a bank tab :P
Angus Mar 3rd 2008 12:19PM
Easiest way to make a bank alt.
Get a single tab, use all your bank slots and bag spaces.
Fairly cheap way to have a huge amount of storgare for that main.
:)
artguy Mar 7th 2008 6:15PM
hey sounds like me
ace danger Mar 3rd 2008 12:39PM
I created a guild for myself and a RL friend of mine. I originally did it for a couple of reasons: I needed more bank space (filled all slots with 16-slot bags and didn't want to buy 18/20-slotters for my bank alt) and I had a name that I really wanted to see under my toons names.
rockfist Apr 7th 2009 1:33PM
Great topic! I've been struggling in this area for the 3 years I've played WoW. I am a hardcore casual (ie. addicted but I can't raid regularly), but I am also an older professional, conservative type (u know, Boy Scouts, church, little leage, whole bit) who plays with my teenage/nonteenage kids.
I will gladly take an incompetent guild of newbs or guild with limited social interaction, but....
...in the 3 years I've played WoW, I have NEVER found a PUG or Raiding guild (I have joined dozens I'd guess) that didn't regualry use some or all of the following in chat/vent: profanity, racism, vulagarity, dope/alcohol, etc. And no one moderates, most just LoL or keep quiet. To complain is seen as drama. I could list examples but I'm sure the WoWinsider censors would explode.
We mock Barrens chat (ur momma! Chuck Norris! yada, yada) but Guid chat/vent is 100 times worst.
I am beginning to think that there aren't there ANY family friendly, rated G (even PG-13) guilds out there (I am currenly leveling Horde on Frostmane having retired my ally on Nerzhul)
DonJuanito Mar 3rd 2008 6:07PM
I know that on Ursin Alliance there is a 'family-friendly' guild called Righteous Few that advertised on the Ursin forum looking for more members recently. I know nothing about them other than their posting on the forum but they may be what you are looking for ?
Quickshiv Mar 3rd 2008 2:34PM
You should start your own guild for just this purpose. Just I think there would be quite a few people that would respond a guild like that.
There is no racial or swearing in my Guild's chat but the f bomb flies free in vent. My guild however is RL friends only so I know they are all ok with it and everyone that vents knows to put on the headphones. If some one says they can't use headphones the language instantly gets toned down.
In the last MMO I played I ran a guild and there was absolutely no swearing or racial language. We were more of a friends and family guild.
We have been discussing letting other people join our small guild but one of the problems we have is that we will have to require that people are 18+ because of profanity. Personally I don't have a problem with adult discussion but I think if your guild allows it they have to ensure that their members are all adults.
Oldbear Mar 3rd 2008 1:10PM
I'm a member of a "PUG" guild... we consider it a leveling guild - full of Altaholics. I got a random invite a month ago - and I have never been in a better guild. We have over 100 characters - again, many are alts. But there is always some one else on. I've added a couple of my RL friends and made some new guild friends. We can help level alts together, or run someone through an instantance (you know they will help you next time), we can share professions and give tips. All the things a good "PUG" guild should be. It may take awhile and a lot of /gquits; but it can be well worth it.
Or spend some time reading the guild names of characters under level 70 or without T4/5 gear - ask them about their guild, offer to help, see if you can get in... It does pay off. I've invited unguilded PUG members into the guild before - they stay until lvl 70 and then go join a raiding guild. But you have them to help out for quite a few levels.
Klope of "Blood and Glory" - Mannoroth-Horde (the good side)
Lucas Mar 3rd 2008 1:13PM
I once got 30 G by just signing guild charters in a day... someone would pay me about 5 G to sign a charter, I would log onto my friends account and collect another 5G. Repeated this three times... Yay for free money :D
Theserene Mar 3rd 2008 1:22PM
'You might even ask them if they want to turn the guild over to someone who is online more often'
Not a bad suggestion - it's how I took over my current guild :)
arcady0 Mar 3rd 2008 2:13PM
Like Omenator - I formed the last few sigs of my guild by spamming to pay for a sign. I took my toon to the Durotar, where new trolls appear, and spammed for a few minutes, got the sigs, hearthed to Org, registered, and kicked. I can't remember if I paid up front or after the fact or half/half. Today the guild is almost a year old and at that one of the oldest on my server (itself only a little more than a year old). Its a casual sort of guild, formed originally from the people I PUGed with in my fist 20 levels.
I didn't keep any of the 'paid signatories' around, though I did offer one a spot, but he wasn't interested, though he asked me if I could help him with his own contract for his main... :)
I do have some unguilded toons. Autodecline sounds nice, but it will still close my auction window, decline, and leave me wondering 'what just happened?' Wht I want is the ability to pre-decline - to make it not possibly for people to even send me an invite if I set a flag as such. Only blizzard could add a feature like that...