Can a shaman tank Karazhan?
Galstaff of Durotan believes so, and put his money where his mouth is, so to speak, by doing it. (Warning, the movie is 20 minutes long.) While anyone can 'tank' Shade of Aran, I was pretty impressed by his tanking of Malchezzar, especially when he admits in the thread (and his armory backs him up) that while he's achieved immunity to critical hits by a combination of resilience and defense, he's still taking crushing blows. He also says he chugs Ironshield Potions which makes sense, as his armor is low for the instance (in my opinion as a tank, anyway) which is not surprising since he's in mail. He claims 17.7k health for the Prince Malchezzar attempt, which is certainly within the ballpark. (I've done it with about 1k less on my warrior, although nowadays I'd never have less than 18.5 k for any boss.)His talent selection shows you the limits of Shaman tanking at this time: He has full Shield Spec, Toughness and Anticipation, giving him the most armor and dodge he could possibly have, but by taking Spirit Weapons (necessary for the ability to Parry, which is essential for tanking) he reduces his melee threat by 30%. This is a great talent choice for a melee DPSer who might get a boss turning to hit him before the tank can pick it up. But for a tanking shaman, it means he has to rely on his spell damage (Frost Shock in particular) as well as Lightning Shield to generate threat, with Stormstrike and Windfury doing the rest of the work. Galstaff also mentions that he had to stack the group with a Shadow Priest to regenerate mana since he couldn't use Water Shield: I'd expect he had to use Shamanistic Rage every single time it was up for both the mana regen and the damage reduction.
Basically, as he himself admits, shamans are the worst 'off tank' with no ability to get enough avoidance to push crushing blows off of the table, so to do this you'd need a ton of resilience on mail (since you're not going to find mail with the stats you need and defense) and some very, very good healers. And as long as shaman tanks require a shadow priest to regain enough mana to tank, it's not going to be a common sight. But as a warrior and shaman player, I liked seeing it. Maybe we could get shamans some actual tanking talents, and they could move into the ranks of the other hybrid classes as being able to DPS, heal and tank? If it's good enough for paladins and druids, why not shamans?
Filed under: Shaman, Analysis / Opinion, How-tos, Odds and ends, Instances, Raiding, Bosses, Forums
Patch 5.3 interview with Ghostcrawler
Mystery of the Unborn Val'kyr
The latest patch 5.3 news
All of the latest Mists of Pandaria news





Reader Comments (Page 2 of 3)
Angus Mar 5th 2008 12:02PM
Just say no to shaman tanking.
Seriously, it doesn't work.
Toughness doesn't give enough, shield spec doesn't and dodge is nice but not going to save a group needing a real tank.
I am all for shaman being a DPS/Healing class. I'd rather see those horrible talents go away and see real talents get put in.
As it is Enhancement has a tie with protection paladins for the worst first tier talents. Redoubt is not something you should depend on and just seen as an 8pt shield spec cost. The extra armor from the other is horrible after a while. We get 5% mana for 5pts compared to 10% int for 5 in the same level. Shield spec is aweful for a dps class.
Make us a DPS class with useful talents in those early tiers and stop making us take every item after the 21st point.
Manatank Mar 5th 2008 1:01PM
Redoubt isn't valuable when a prot paladin is MT on a boss, but it is a big part of their damage mitigation when AoE tanking a large number of mobs (Hyjal trash being the biggest deal).
GamerJunkie Mar 5th 2008 12:11PM
Shammys! Biggest QQ babies
They can dual-wield, sword + shield, dagger, staff, 2handers, dps, heal, now they want to tank.
I think Blizzard is giving them too much variety, the class is losing its identity to all the QQ babies.
Nerf and remove useless Shammy abilities and buff the rest.
Wulfhere Mar 5th 2008 12:41PM
Paldins! Biggest QQ babies!
They can wear plate, use a sword and shield, swords, 2 handers, DPS, now they want to tank. And DO!
I think Blizzard is giving them too much variety, the class is losing its identity to all the QQ babies.
Nerf and remove useless Paladin abilities and buff the rest.
Crypt King Mar 5th 2008 1:05PM
Sorry Wulfhere but your attempt at being witty fails since Paladins always had a protection tree and were supposed to be able to tank. Nice try though but your deflection fails.
Jordrah Mar 5th 2008 12:52PM
shamans cant use swords
Wulfhere Mar 5th 2008 1:07PM
Where's Feral Druid's protection tree?
Enhancement shamans have three tanking talents in their enhancement tree. Give em more for all I care. But you calling them whiners for wanting to tank is exactly the same as calling paladins or druids whiners for wanting to.
Tereth Mar 5th 2008 1:21PM
Yeah, because shammies can totally sword and shield....
No sword. Period.
Hellskreamer Mar 5th 2008 5:08PM
You forgot to mention healing as well.
Slayblaze Mar 5th 2008 12:18PM
Being one of only 3 classes that can use a Shield, I've always wondered why Shaman couldn't tank better than they can. Since they can equip shields, they really need an extra ability or two that makes better use of it.
devilfish Mar 5th 2008 12:22PM
I agree, by having a classes capable of doing all three. You are inventing a sort of Multi Tool that functions better than the original. The JACK OF ALL TRADES IS MASTER OF NONE! They need to remember this premise when doing anything to Druids, Shaman and Paladins.
Maybe I am old school, but I prefer my Chisels to look like chisels and not be capable of drilling holes.
grab Mar 5th 2008 12:39PM
Maybe they could throw a talent in the enhancement tree that you could activate like a defensive stance, but uses wind to make mobs miss and make you dodge more, like a rogue's 15 sec "evasion tank," only longer. Reduce damage and increase threat as well, but make enhancement a tanking tree and change elemental over to the pvp tree. Fix the pvp-flametongue fix/kite-worthless fix they're planning on applying in the new patch.
Good_Idea Mar 5th 2008 12:30PM
>> If it's good enough for paladins and druids, why not shamans?
Because we're supposed to be the DPS hybrid, not the tanking hybrid (pally). At one time we could kind of tank, but it muddied the vision of what Blizz was trying to do with the class, and especially the ENH tree.
I'm guessing now that a shaman tanked Prince, it won't be long before we get priest and hunter tanks now (just like we saw with Ony and Nef before the expansion).
Wisakedjak Mar 5th 2008 1:03PM
Not to nitpick, but shamans aren't alone in being unable to become uncrushable; druids are absolutely unable to reach that status (they make up for it with sheer armor and health), and on fights where the boss is hitting as fast as phase 2 Prince, warriors and paladins are hard pressed to keep shield block up reliably enough to avoid eating a couple in the course of the fight as well.
That said, it *is* just a gimmick here. Blizzard removed the added threat from rockbiter and moved the +threat from earth shock to frost shock, effectively hosing any reliable high-threat generation potential the class once had. Most shaman players, myself included (my original main was a shaman), wish they'd either just finish the job and give us worthwhile talents in place of the deprecated "tanking" talents left there now, or find some way to make it anything but a gimmick.
Without the additional threat from the old versions of those abilities, though, your DPSers are threat capped at an incredibly low threshold- your 1H + WF damage plus lightning shield and frost shock. I can't imagine that you'd be putting out much more than 5-600 TPS, best case scenario. In combination with the shaman's substantially lower mitigation, means that I'd be more inclined to congratulate this guy's healers for being able to keep him upright and lasting through the fights.
Turall Mar 5th 2008 2:43PM
Paladins are the only tank able to achieve crush immunity on prince.
8 Holy Shield charges every 10 seconds. Even a thrash or two doesn't eat through them all.
As long as I stay on the ball and keep holy shield up every 10 seconds, my Paladin never gets crushed.
Not that it matters anymore, I've moved on to MT'ing ZA and Gruul..
Velane Mar 5th 2008 12:45PM
We had a shaman OT moroes last night
William Mar 5th 2008 12:59PM
My Shaman tanked a few instances up to Sunken Temple, but I decided I like DPS better. Awesome that he was able to do it though!
Verses Mar 5th 2008 1:04PM
Well I tanked pretty much everything 'till ST though my lack of +hit really made it difficult, that's pretty much my problem with Enhancement Shamen, though this is taken from my personal experience :P
MechChef Mar 5th 2008 1:14PM
I honestly think I'd enjoy tanking. I do enjoy rogue-tanking pre-bc instances. I put on my PVP set for armor and stam, and basically DOT tank (shiv+deadly poison, garrote, and rupture).
Maybe DK's will have something more appealing than the warrior mechanics.
Matt Mar 5th 2008 1:22PM
cool that he did it, please dont cry for tanking talents, next thing you know the shamans will want to wear plate like thrall and be super overpowered...lets not encourage them!