Prot Paladins display their unrivaled threat generation
Many Protection Paladins voiced their disagreement with my recent post to Hybrid Theory, my weekly column on Hybrid classes. The complaints were many, and the flames burned bright. Thus, I'll clarify my stance a little more. Oh, and the title up there? It's a joke. Seriously.First off, let me say that my recent Hybrid Theory had a lot of sardonic, cynical little jokes. In all seriousness, I would not tell a Balance Druid that I raid with to "go be useful and Moonfire spam something." I don't think that you're viable Main Tanks for a progression oriented 25-man raid, but if you can have fun with something and your raid will actually let you do it, more power to you. That doesn't mean you should advertise yourself as a tank when applying to a raid group, but there you go.
As far as Protection Paladins go, I believe my stance is not wrong, but I overstated the extremity of the situation. No, Protection Paladins are not only brought along on raids to cheer in the background waving pompoms. I did not mean to say Protection Paladins absolutely cannot tank bosses like Lady Vashj or Kael'thas. My intent was to say that in most raids and situations, a Protection Warrior or Feral Druid(not for Kael, obviously) will be top priority.
Protection Paladins obviously can tank things, and I love to see them do it. A Protection Paladin tanking Illidan is awesome. Most raids, though, will look to the Warriors first. Not due to the inability to tank it, or even a gear hump. The lack of safety net on-demand survival tools is, in my opinion, the biggest issue with paladins as Main Tanks in a "post-2.3 world," as it was described to me yesterday afternoon.
Can Protection Paladins tank? Yes. Can Protection Paladins tank well? Yes, many people have proven this. Will they be looked to as the first choice in most situations? Unfortunately, no. That shouldn't stop you, though, and I never meant to imply that it should. I may have let my wry cynicism run away with me, and I apologize for letting it paint my words in a poorer light than I had planned. My stance remains that it probably will take some work for you to find a raid slot, but that doesn't mean you should not look. It also doesn't mean you'll be doing exclusively 'junk' jobs like trash packs. You have a hurdle to jump over, and you'll need to prove how capable you are to a raid.
As the folks over at Maintankadin pointed out, there are a few things I didn't take into consideration for my column yesterday that should be kept in mind. Thanks to the nature of Holy Shield(8 charges fully talented), a properly geared Protection Paladin, assuming there's no lag involved(whoop, got crushed between Holy Shield fading and going back up!), will most likely take fewer Crushing Blows. Against bosses that attack slowly, there isn't much of a difference between Warriors and Paladins, but bosses that attack very quickly? You'll really feel the difference.
Additionally, a Protection Paladin's health pool scales much higher than a Protection Warrior's does. Your on-demand abilities may be lacking, but at equal gear levels, you have a higher starting point, thanks to an extra 16% Stamina from talents.
There's other, smaller things, like fewer parries due to no special melee attacks to be parried, but I think all of that is better off being placed into my column from Saturday to be used as a proper reference for new raiding hybrids.
A friend of mine said something along the lines of, "In a competition between three people, getting the Bronze medal may be a prize, but it's still last place. Nobody likes to be in last place." To make the analogy needlessly complicated, it isn't a matter of first and last place. There's many categories in tanking. You get the Gold in some, you get the Bronze in others. Protection Paladins have one fewer Gold medal than the Warriors do. That doesn't make you a loser. It means you need to work a little harder to prove yourself.
I made some mistakes, but I'm totally willing to fix my inaccuracies if they're presented to me in a civil manner.
Oh, and before I go, I must warn everyone that applying to a raid as a Boomkin tank makes Baby Bornakk cry.
Filed under: Paladin, Analysis / Opinion, Raiding






Reader Comments (Page 1 of 5)
Kanuris Mar 9th 2008 8:53AM
Protadin are actually the single best choice for a boss like Prince Malchezzar. Phase 2 has that nasty Parry and Thrash combo which can deal huge damage to a Warrior and possibly wipe the raid.
A Protadin doesn't even need to melee him in Phase 2 at all.
Kalandrah Mar 9th 2008 8:57AM
TBH, the only encounters I would favor a warrior tank over a paladin tank is on a) magic immune mobs, or b) mobs that silence.
Aside from that, there's no real difference. As for the safety net; Paladins with Ardent Defender take 30% less damage below 35% health. With a tank at 21k health, Ardent Defender starts at 7350. Most paladins can tell you how much damage that 30% has saved and how many times it's saved them from dying.
Also, once you are comfortable with new encounters, warriors will rarely use shield wall / last stand.
Matthew Rossi Mar 9th 2008 12:17PM
I often use Shield Wall and then Last Stand on enrages or soft enrages.
Tell you what: don't tell warriors how we tank, since paladins are so unwilling to hear any criticism of how you do. I know when I use my abilities, you don't.
Corala Mar 9th 2008 1:36PM
If you are comfortable with an encounter, then you aren't in a progression raid and a moonkin could be tanking for all that it matters as far as tank comparison for a progression raid goes.
AlmtyBob Mar 14th 2008 4:21AM
Cool Matt, that's absolutely awesome the way you so boldy (and troll-like) stick up for your class here and then go on to write the longest, most meandering QQ article about your class in the history of WoW. I believe I speak for the rest of the reasonably skilled tanking community when I say:
Up Yours, go roll a hunter or something.
Lanth Mar 9th 2008 9:09AM
All tanking classes have different specialties. Not entirely sure of who's good at what, but it's generally accepted that Paladins are best at AoE aggro (Morogrim), and Warlocks are best at tanking bosses with magic abilities :)
Kaething Mar 9th 2008 8:50PM
Yeah. Different tank classes do better at different things, much like the healers. But people still want to feel like the best.
It's okay Alex, I still like you and will let your prot pally tank for me any day.
innajunglestylee Mar 9th 2008 9:30AM
But what about Shaman tanks? I saw a YouTube of a guy who tanked Kara on his shaman! We're ZOMG viable too! Think outside the box, man!
Kalandrah Mar 9th 2008 9:51AM
> KaelThas Sunstrider in Tempest Keep mean something for you ?
> Good luck eating pyroblasts without those as "oh shit buttons " when something go wrong.
And there you have it, "When something goes wrong". If nothing goes wrong (ie. because you know what you're doing), then what use do you have for Oh shit buttons?
Also, last I checked prot paladins can use paladins, which includes the Phaseshift Bulwark which should be used to absorb the pyroblast.
The thing with Kael'thas though, is that if you have a warrior and a paladin tank there, you will prefer the paladin to tank the phoenix adds. Not because the paladin isn't capable of tanking kael, but because he's just better at the adds than a warrior.
TALKADIN Mar 9th 2008 10:15AM
"The thing with Kael'thas though, is that if you have a warrior and a paladin tank there, you will prefer the paladin to tank the phoenix adds. Not because the paladin isn't capable of tanking kael, but because he's just better at the adds than a warrior."
This show again you have no clue. lol
Warrior tank on Phoenixs + bulwark + SHIELD REFLECT = birds dammage on him is almost a non issue.
And if you do your job never have more then 2 birds up.
"Also, last I checked prot paladins can use paladins, which includes the Phaseshift Bulwark which should be used to absorb the pyroblast. "
lol good luck on Kara. Bullwark on 1 pyroblasts. The problem is there are 3 consecutive :)
Shield bash intrerupt on third ? Good luck with pala tank at this. Shieldwall-last stand-pots/seed rotations to eat the 2nd ?
Good luck as I said in kara.
Heilig Mar 9th 2008 10:22AM
1) Bulwark
2) Bubble -> cancelaura
3) Lay on Hands
Keep feeling superior, I love out-tanking arrogant warriors.
Natoro Mar 9th 2008 10:40AM
You really need to stop this "zomg warriors are only good tanks lol go to kara" crap. Our first Kael kill, warrior MT, prot pally on phoenixes. 2nd kill? Prot pally MT, druid on phoenixes. If your raid is, you know, good, you burn through the shock barrier and the 10 other members capable of interrupting in the raid can easily stop the other 2 pyroblasts w/o any "oh shit" moments.
Tridus Mar 9th 2008 10:52AM
You do have Rogues, right? Why would a Warrior ever have to shield bash the pyroblasts?
This "Paladins make poor MTs" attitude is pervasive at WoW Insider for some reason. The guy who does Guildwatch had the same attitude until he got flooded with videos of Paladins tanking nearly every boss in the game.
Liel Mar 9th 2008 11:39AM
Quit playing WOW and pay more attention at work I said NO SALT on my fries.
Lieris Mar 9th 2008 10:16AM
If you need to take pyro blasts your DPS sucks. Even if you intend to take them there's bubble, nightmare seeds and fire protection potions.
I am a paladin and I've tanked Kael just fine ta :)
Kvark Tankadin Mar 9th 2008 10:30AM
http://files.filefront.com/last+standavi/;9569421;/fileinfo.html
I AE tank karazan and maintank gruul,mag, lurker,leo,vashj,voidreaver, kazzak, doomwalker, and tank all hydross adds, all morogrim adds, all Al'ar adds, all solarian adds, Fathomlord hunter + pet.
guild consider me as guild maintank, and warriors/ferals are my equals. I'd like to see any other tank that can keep VR for the amount of time a paladin can.
imho, there is no better class to Maintank things, than a paladin with good gear.
if you don't, your loss :)
superfrank Mar 10th 2008 11:10AM
I don't see why a paladin tank has any advantage whatsoever at VR.
amasen Mar 10th 2008 11:44AM
Because paladins generate HUGE amounts of threat. Much... Much... more than a warrior. If they want to nearly double their threat, they can pop a flask of binding light. Put on some spell oil. Use a Destruction Potion. GG pally threat. Starts out strong (does not last all day long. lol).
Warriors are awesome. Pallys are awesome. Our guild has a pally MT, and he is incredible... See the thing is... A good player... Is a good player... Warriors and Pallys are both awesome tanks
Elzam Mar 9th 2008 10:48AM
There sure are a lot of damage control posts on WoW Insider these days...
hpavc Mar 9th 2008 6:41PM
The next new thing in paid blogging?