The great Panda debate
by Amanda Dean 
Mar 10th 2008 at 9:00AM
In the comments Censorman said, "I've heard China
I must admit that I also found no law specifically prohibiting violence against pandas in the virtual world. However an entry in China View and several other online publications pointed to proposed legislation in Chendgdu China that would curb exploitative panda imagery. The legislation was prompted by Zhao Bandi's presentation of suggestive panda-inspired stylings made waves during
The article was dated November 23, 2007, and claims to have confirmed the proposed legislation with the Chengdu Municipal Committee of the National People's Congress, in west 's
So it looks like both posters are correct. There is no specific, Chinese law banning killing pandas in video games. In the future there be some official legislation that limits the use of panda imagery in video games in the
Baluki suggested that Panderens could be added to the game but disabled in Chinese copies of the game. Currently in Chinese copies of the game the Undead models do not have exposed bones. The difference between these two examples is that the graphic for bones or no bones is purely cosmetic and does not have a major impact on the game. Disabling or enabling Pandaren characters would probably have major implications for the game. Possibly if Pandaren were replaced with another race such as Naga in Chinese versions of the World of Warcraft, it may work.
Filed under: Fan stuff, Odds and ends, News items, Rumors
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)
torrents Mar 10th 2008 3:24PM
wow if they do that it would be weird
Ron Mar 10th 2008 9:31AM
I currently live in china and i have asked several people about why pandarens arent currently in the game. It boils down to this: The chinese are still sore about what the japanese did to nanjing during world war 2 and Pandas are specific only to china. So what they are saying is this: They dont want to have a chinese-originating animal to be related with japanese arts. The clothes that pandarens wear are styled after the japanese, and so are the katanas which the pandarens use.
johnthorpe Mar 10th 2008 10:28AM
Who gives a shit what the chinese government wants? They're a soul-crushing, freedom-stomping set of thugs who masquerade as thinkers and philosophers. They murder their own citizens and they run down freedom-seekers with tanks. They can pucker up for my dwarven ass.
I understand the profit motive is what drives business, but once in a while it would be nice to see a corporation set aside a small amount of its capital for "Doing the right thing", which in this case would be thumbing its nose at the oppressors. Put the pandas in the game. Better yet, put them on an island, and name that island TAIWAN or TIBET.
Super_Duck Mar 10th 2008 10:42AM
BLizzard cares, the got a lot of chinese customers i'd suppose...
Still there has been panderen in wc3 tft, never heard of that coursing much trouble
imparush Mar 10th 2008 12:01PM
this is stupid, so killing human is not a crime? but when it is panda then...
Moketronics Mar 10th 2008 12:11PM
@Johnthorpe
Those are some pretty harsh criticisms of the Chinese government.
First off, while I will say that they certainly aren't a wonderful model for any country to use, there are a lot of problems, you have to consider who and what has to be governed.
Population of U.S. = about 300 million with illegals.
Population of China = Almost 1.3 billion. (thats 1 billion more then U.S. - lets see the U.S. maintain a stable regime of that many people using their current methods)
Then we can talk about human rights, which is generally the crux of the argument for the Chinese government being some horrible monster.
Who are you comparing them too? If we're choosing the U.S. it also has a long list of human rights violations. From Guantanamo Bay to participation in international tribunals for punishing war crimes... Why should China live up to these ideals of human rights when the U.S. doesn't?
They have started democratizing the lower levels of government in China - and international observers have found the elections to be poorly run, NOT because of official tampering but because in many places the populace just doesn't know how an election should be run, the participants can be as much to blame as the organizers.
Admittedly all the uproar over the Japanese rape of Nanjing and so on seems more to do with diverting public unrest away from pressing domestic, economic and political issues in the national arena.
The main point is that many parallels can be drawn between actions taken by so-called "advanced western nations" - particularly the U.S. - and the various apparently indefensible actions of the P.R.C. Besides, since joining WTO they have become much more transparent and accountable. (also use of death penalty isn't _that_ much higher then the U.S. when looked at from a per capita POV)
Retron Mar 10th 2008 2:37PM
Moketronics: Don't forget the recent report that the U.S. has more of our citizens in prison than China or Russia. That's more in terms of total prison population-not just per capita. There may be some serious issues with freedom in China but at least there seems to be progress there.
Anyway the point a poster made about the Panderen wearing Japanese-style outfits and using katana makes the most sense to me as being potentially offensive to Chinse citizens (not sure if the government would even get involved.)
Ron Mar 11th 2008 12:39AM
@johnthorpe
I live in china because i personally consider it a better, freer place to live. I dont fear police here (be it harassing me, or pulling me over for speeding). I can walk around at midnight by myself and I dont fear being mugged. I never worry about guns, getting stabbed, or robbery. Everyone is honest and things are cheap here. It most definetly is a nice place to live.
Moketronics Mar 11th 2008 2:38PM
Thanks for backing me up Ron and Retron... I read the NYT article about the rising prison population, go 1% of all Americans!
Johnthorpe is clearly uneducated. Where did you learn about China? Fox News?
Besides, no one with any actual "intellegence" would spell "intelligence" wrong or use the word "freer" like that.
lmfao
Michael O'Connor Mar 10th 2008 9:39AM
Personally, I always say it as more of an "unspoken" law than anything official. There may not be any official laws against it, but it's not something that conservative people would want to see.
It's all about the political correctness, right?
Damon Mar 10th 2008 9:47AM
Bout time that rumor finally closed up. Thanks for finally looking into it!
It's true that the chinese originally where miffed that pandaren where dressed up japan-style, but blizzard realized it's mistake. Pandaren where re-designed with a chinese motif in mind. There are even a few official artworks that have a japan-pandaren and china-pandaren version.
Mir Mar 10th 2008 10:01AM
@3
Gief links! :)
Damon Mar 10th 2008 10:09AM
http://www.wowwiki.com/Pandaren
There's a set there. That iconic picture of a pandaren brewmaster originally had a naginata.
... Just struck me that very few probably know what a naginata is.
CN Mar 10th 2008 10:24AM
Well, I personally think the big reasons are: Pandaren's are technically Neutral, and whatever faction they put them on many players would flock too, I know I would probably ditch my 70 Tauren Warrior for a Pandaren alliance warrior in a heart beat.
SpaceDog Mar 10th 2008 10:03AM
Could they perhaps just reskin them for the Chinese market? So that they would just look like bears (Forbolg-esque I suppose)?
Or would they be unhappy to see it happening anywhere in the world?
Seems kind of uptight, really.
MindReader Mar 10th 2008 10:08AM
Interesting topic.
I must have seen hundreds of posts in the General and Wrath of the Lich King official forums regarding the inclusion of Panderans as a new race. It might even be a weekly demand.
But like you said, the prominent rebuttal as to why Panderans cannot be a part of WoW is because of the potential Chinese law forbidding the killing of pandas in video games. The large amount of Asian WoW subscribers, including “mainland China, Korea, Australia, New Zealand, Singapore, Thailand, Malaysia, and the regions of Taiwan, Hong Kong, and Macau.” which add up to approximately 5.5 million, according to Blizzard's last press release (http://blizzard.co.uk/press/080122.shtml) indicates that the gaming population of China, at least, has considerable weight when it comes to the sales of the original WoW and its expansion, The Burning Crusade, as well as monthly subscriptions.
My point is that a possible ban by the Chinese government of the game could very well impact Blizzard’s profits. It is definitely safer for the company to avoid such a scenario and save the headache of adding different skins for the different regions of the world that play WoW. It might even anger the player base of many of these people if they do go ahead and do it. What if a large portion of North American gamers, for example, cried out in dismay when it turned out that the Naga race looked and moved better than the Panderan one?
Not all the people who posted in the official forums, or even in the comments section for WoW Insider advocated having the Panderans as a new race. I even remember seeing several posters that were disgusted at a “cute” race being added. But, that’s probably not a strong point, as many people didn’t like the new races added in the BC and subscriptions were still on the rise.
Though, having the Panderans would be amazing, in my opinion, especially as it brings the possibility of having the Brewmaster as a new Class, too. It will be interesting to see what Wrath of The Lich King and the following expansions will offer besides what they told us.
KingOreo Mar 10th 2008 10:28AM
So it's bad to kill pandas but there's no problem in killing humans?
mkay, will keep that in mind next time i'm in china...
Jim Mar 10th 2008 10:31AM
I think it would be fun...but if I remember from the first Blizzcast, the art director who came up with Panderen basically said they were a joke and alluded to the feeling that they aren't going to be a major part of any Blizzard games.
More on topic, I think instead of being a matter of legality, this is about corporate sensitivity. I know dragons and pandas aren't the same, but when Nike put Lebron James' first shoe in China, they used dragons in the promotional material and it was wildly unpopular. (You'd have thought that after employing child labor in Asia for decades, Nike would have known better.) Kudos to Blizz if they are more sensitive to the culture of their customers than Nike.
Alveredus Mar 10th 2008 10:41AM
IMO, the simplest solution would be to introduce them via a non-gameplay component, exclusively in the west.
Such as a TCG reward that uses a modified Furbolg model, similar to the Ogre suit.
The TCG needs an update to its points rewards anyway and the points system is a much more democratic method of distributing rewards.
Elmo Mar 10th 2008 11:02AM
WoW beeing banned in China would make it easier to fight Goldsellers as they are not even allowed to play the game.
of course it's a pity for all normal players from China.