Build Shop: Warrior 17/44

Every Tuesday (and sometimes Wednesday, when dealing with broken computers), Chris Jahosky contributes Build Shop, which takes a look into one of the many talent specs available to players.
I'm sure some of you noticed that Build Shop went on an unscheduled vacation -- this was unfortunately due to the death of my old computer. My new computer is all set up and ready to go (and plays WoW better than ever), and so I'm now officially back on the scene. There was a lot of talk in the comments from last time about the RiP (Rogue in Plate) build, so this week I'm taking a look at it for those who are interested.
RiPper builds (like 17/44, the one I'm examining) are so named because their DPS potential is quite close to rogues (hence, Rogue in Plate). It's a sustained damage build, similar to a combat spec Rogue, but because of their ability to wear plate (and a shield) have more survivability and off-tank potential. They're quite capable of inflicting incredible damage, and can be especially nasty when paired with a Shaman's Windfury totem.
The Fury tree is utilized extensively for this build -- points are mostly put into Arms in order to grab Impale, which increases critical damage, but it also picks up a few nice talents for tanking and utility.
I'm sure some of you noticed that Build Shop went on an unscheduled vacation -- this was unfortunately due to the death of my old computer. My new computer is all set up and ready to go (and plays WoW better than ever), and so I'm now officially back on the scene. There was a lot of talk in the comments from last time about the RiP (Rogue in Plate) build, so this week I'm taking a look at it for those who are interested.
RiPper builds (like 17/44, the one I'm examining) are so named because their DPS potential is quite close to rogues (hence, Rogue in Plate). It's a sustained damage build, similar to a combat spec Rogue, but because of their ability to wear plate (and a shield) have more survivability and off-tank potential. They're quite capable of inflicting incredible damage, and can be especially nasty when paired with a Shaman's Windfury totem.
The Fury tree is utilized extensively for this build -- points are mostly put into Arms in order to grab Impale, which increases critical damage, but it also picks up a few nice talents for tanking and utility.
Arms (17 points)
- Heroic Strike (3/3) - Reduces the rage cost of Heroic Strike by 3 points. You can use this to dump extra rage provided threat isn't an issue.
- Deflection (5/5) - Increases your chance to Parry by 5%. Useful if you ever find yourself off-tanking, or if you can't position yourself behind a target and run the risk of taking a cleave or two.
- Improved Thunder Clap (3/3) - Decreases the rage cost of Thunder Clap by 4, increases the damage by 100% and the slowing effect by 10%. If your MT doesn't have this, you'll likely be called upon to put it up to help with tanking.
- Anger Management (1/1) - Generates 1 rage every 3 seconds. Most talents that generate rage are central to this build, and this one is no exception. Pick this one up so you'll always get some rage on a consistent basis. Works nicely with Unbridled Wrath, over in the Fury tree, to give you some extra rage.
- Deep Wounds (3/3) - Causes your critical strikes to place a bleed effect on the target, causing 60% of your weapon's average damage over 12 seconds. A prereq for Impale, and also does respectable damage.
- Impale (2/2) - Increases your critical strike damage bonus of your abilities in Battle, Berserker, and Defensive Stance by 20%. This is the main reason to spec into Arms, as this is the only tree with a talent that increases critical strike damage.
- Cruelty (5/5) - Increases your critical strike chance by 5%. Crit is important to this build for proccing Flurry and Deep Wounds, so these 5 points are well spent.
- Unbridled Wrath (5/5) - Gives you a chance to generate an extra rage point whenever you deal melee damage with a weapon. Since you'll be dual wielding, hitting often and fast (hopefully), you should generate a good bit of rage through this talent. Combined with Anger Management, this gives your rage generation a nice boost.
- Commanding Presence (5/5) - Increases the attack power / health bonus of Battle / Commanding Shout by 25%. You'll likely have one of these two shouts up most of the time (mostly Battle Shout if you're dealing damage in a PvE scenario and health isn't an issue), so getting an extra 25% benefit isn't bad. This works out to an extra 76 attack power on the max rank of your Battle Shout, which is roughly 5.5 extra DPS. Worth picking up, since this build is about maximizing damage.
- Dual Wield Specialization (5/5) - Increases the damage done by your offhand by 25%. Offhand attacks typically do 50% damage, so this talent helps partially overcome that penalty.
- Enrage (5/5) - After receiving a critical strike, you gain a 25% damage bonus for 12 seconds or 12 swings (whichever comes first). Also a prereq for the fantastic Flurry talent.
- Sweeping Strikes (1/1) - Causes your next 10 melee attacks to strike an additional opponent. Has a 30 second cooldown, but is potentially devastating with Whirlwind.
- Weapon Mastery (2/2) - Reduces the chance for your attacks to be dodged by 2%, and reduces all disarming effect durations by 50%. A lot of RiPpers have pulled points out of Improved Execute to take this, and it's worth it for sustained damage. Reducing the chance for your target to dodge means more of your hits (and crits) will land.
- Flurry (5/5) - Increases your attack speed by 25% for 3 swings after dealing a melee critical strike. You'll want this up as often as you possibly can, as the benefits of haste can't be overstated for sustained damage. Terrific talent.
- Precision (3/3) - Increases your chance to hit by 3%. Against a level 73, you'll need 9% hit before you won't miss a special (yellow) attack. This talent helps you reach that mark, allowing you to gem for attack power or crit instead of hit. Also helps out your white damage as well.
- Bloodthirst (1/1) - An instant attack that causes damage based on attack power. Also, the next 5 successful attacks after using this ability restore 30 health.
- Improved Whirlwind (1/2) - Reduces the cooldown of your Whirlwind by 1 second. It's not necessary to take both points in this talent, as most Fury warriors are able to get into a nice damage rotation without needing the extra second of time off the cooldown.
- Improved Berserker Stance (5/5) - Increases attack power by 10%, and reduces threat caused in Berserker stance by 10%. Taking this talent means it's generally more beneficial to stack attack power rather then strength, and also grants you some threat reduction. That's great news, since at higher gear levels Fury Warriors find their damage seems to be capped by threat more than anything else. The attack power boost also scales with your gear.
- Rampage (1/1) - Grants an additional 50 attack power when used, and causes most successful attacks to grant an additional 50 attack power. This lasts 30 seconds and stacks up to 5 times, for a maximum of 250 extra attack power. It can only be used after dealing a critical strike, but you should find it quite easy to keep this up most of the time.
That wraps up this edition of Build Shop, but I'll be back again next week. What do you want to see on Build Shop? Send me an email with your questions, comments, or builds and we'll talk shop.
Filed under: Warrior, Build Shop






Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Abhinav Kumar Mar 12th 2008 1:13PM
I am leveling a warrior right now and i am wondering what you would attack with this, Heroic Strike? Isn't that very high on threat? I know slam is good for 2h's so that wouldn't work with dual weilding. And what stance would you stay in? I would think you would be in zerker for the crit and if you are in that, why not get Imp Berserker Rage for the 10 extra rage every 30 seconds. I'm not meaning to attack, i probably just don't understand warriors well enough.
Blake Mar 12th 2008 3:27PM
its a rage dump. meaning odds are you are already having TOO much rage to get rid of. And yes it causes good threat, but if you have Omen and are monitoring your threat, you'll know when its smart to use.
Epoc Mar 12th 2008 1:40PM
this build you don't die if you pull aggro .. but if you're doing you're job properly you won't pull aggro. simple as that .. download a threat meter.
Heroic strike is a high damage rage dump that turns one of your white damage attacks into a yellow special. yes it causes a high amount of threat but if you spec imp zerkers stance (going that deep into fury and not is just pointless) then you also have a 10% threat reduction to your abilities. Trust me you aren't going to pull aggro off of a good tank. I spam all my abilities including HS (by the way it works with windfury too) and don't pull aggro even if I don't have salv.
as far as the imp zerker rage .. its basically not needed. I never have a problem with rage and don't ever take that talent.
also for raiding purposes this build needs to be tweaked a bit. At least 1 dps warrior in the raid should be taking 2/5 imp demo shout and then put the other 3/5 in unbridled wrath for raid utility. the 2/5 imp demo shout will basically negate any + AP that a boss mob will have so he won't hit the tank as hard.
Kaphik Mar 12th 2008 1:23PM
I love this spec for PVE dps. The only thing different I choose if no points in Imp. TC, I put those points into Iron Will, and took some from Heroic Strike and got 5/5 Iron Will. I didn't find myself using Heroic Strike too much when I spec this way. You're going to spend most of your time in Berserker stance. I like to hit my instant attacks as much as I can, I'd throw HS in if I need a rage dump.
The only drawback to this spec is that if you pull aggro, you are going to die. Simple as that. I wait a lot longer than other dpsers to start, and ramp it up slowly. Don't worry, you can still easily top the charts, even with waiting. And it is a lot of fun when the boss is down to 5-7% and you pull aggro, to see who dies first, you or the boss. That point, it's just spam Execute and hope for the best.
Archex Mar 12th 2008 1:26PM
@1 (don't know how to reply)
You live in 'zerker stance, attack w/ Bloodthirst and Whirlwind on rotation, fitting in the occassional Heroic Strike (or Cleave based on some theorycraft out there) when BT and WW are on cd. When in a 5-man and dealing w/ cc'd mobs, have to take WW out of the rotation. I also use heroic strike more vs caster mobs since it doesn't trigger the global cd letting you still use your interrupt (pummel) when the target starts casting. This build is phenomenal for grinding squishy rep mobs too (think zaxxis raiders) - Sweeping Strikes + Whirlwind, with all the flurry and enrage and so on proccing off crits...you can just mow down mobs.
Epoc Mar 12th 2008 1:51PM
remember that as of right now your offhand crits don't proc flurry or deep wounds. Patch 2.4 will fix this.
also when using sweeping strikes cleave is your friend as well for AoE... even in raid settings
oh and lets not forget that in patch 2.4 cleave will no longer break CC so you'll be able to use it near sheep, etc.
MindReader Mar 12th 2008 1:49PM
Improved Berserker Stance (5/5) - Increases attack power by 10%
"Taking this talent means it's generally more beneficial to stack attack power rather then strength"
I'm not sure I agree with you on that point. Much theorycrafting and testing (http://www.tankspot.com/forums/damage-per-second-discussion/32361-dw-fury-guide-4th-edition.html) shows its better to stack strength when you can as attack power does not scale with buffs such as Blessing of Kings. But I guess that's just nitpicking- solid build, though.
Khanster Mar 12th 2008 1:58PM
mindreader what you were saying about stacking AP gems that is COMPLETELY RETARDED because for a warrior unlike a rogue 2xstrength=your ap. Ive always had this spec its just been a lot of variation of it but taht was prior to finding meek's guide. everysince i found hes guide im usually top top 5 in dps
Epoc Mar 12th 2008 2:05PM
uhm .... lets think about this 1 str = 2 AP for warriors so there fore stacking stregth is always better since str scales with buffs and straight AP does not.
therefore Blessing of Kings will up your str ... therefore increasing your AP. Imp zerker stance does not care where you get the AP from it just boosts you AP
STR should always be taken instead of straight AP.
darian Mar 12th 2008 2:31PM
Seconding Epoc.
In a raid situation, which is what this build is designed for, 1 Str = 2.2 AP. That's more AP per itemization point than straight up AP.
So don't make the mistake of gearing for AP over Str.
MindReader Mar 12th 2008 4:49PM
Khanster:
I was quoting the author.... sheesh.
In any case, Epoc sums up the confusion nicely.
Archex Mar 12th 2008 2:06PM
Question I have: I put one point in Prot Tree for Tactical Mastery - my purpose was to help my ability to Off-tank, especially in 5-mans by increasing the threat of Bloodthirst when in Def Stance....any thoughts on whether this is useful or a waste of a point? The tootip doesn't get specific enough on how much extra threat for me to be able to calc the impact this has on my ability to hold aggro when offtanking. Any thoughts?
Epoc Mar 12th 2008 2:20PM
if you're going to put points in that you may as well go with a fury/prot hybrid build for and take the 3 points in defiance as well since it will give you 6 expertise rating (even dpsing from behind you're attacks won't be dodged as much = more dps)
I've also used that build as well and can still push over 1k dps in badge gear/T4.
Epoc Mar 12th 2008 2:24PM
but either way taking only 1 point into this is kinda pointless fill the talent 3/3 if you're really serious about using it to see any benefit from it
darian Mar 12th 2008 2:43PM
Again, I must second Epoc. I'm currently using the following build.
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=LZVV0VgxRVuqofVzoh
You get the tools necessary to hold threat and be consistently uncrushable while maintaining the same level of DPS as 17/44/0.
Goosesausage Mar 12th 2008 2:25PM
Improved berserker stance doesn't benefit more from attack power instead of strength since strenth increases your attack power.
I also prefer 2/2 improved whirlwind. It leads to better ability rotations in my experience and is amazing for aoe pulls. I take a point out of improved dual wield specialization to get improved whirlwind maxed out.
Epoc Mar 12th 2008 6:16PM
with the changes to whirlwind using your offhand for damage as well as being normalized I'd say that you'd be better off actually going 5/5 dual wield spec. 1 point in imp whirlwind is more than enough to keep your rotations steady.
I used to not even use the 1 point in imp whirlwind and still managed to do fine, but with the changes that were made the 1 point is plenty. I'd suggest trying it out you're dps should increase
thebvp Mar 12th 2008 2:26PM
I think it’s important to note that 17/44 is the descendent of the venerable 17/34, one of the most popular raiding fury dps builds pre-BC.
The other popular build was 12/39. I always favored 12/39 for a few reasons:
1) Deep wounds breaks CC. WW/cleave on a sheep = loose mob that can no longer be CC’d. Bad news bears. It also would refresh on every crit, leaving relatively little time to tick (like blessed recovery for priests)
2) Imp cleave was better than heroic strike for dps on raid bosses due to threat.
3) About 55% of your damage came from white damage, not yellow, reducing the effectiveness of impale.
With the move from Tactical Mastery to the Protection Tree, the second tier of arms is now pretty gimp, but recent changes to Whirlwind have made slow/slow weapon setups more favorable, perhaps making impale/deep wounds more attractive again.
jbodar Mar 12th 2008 7:18PM
"1) Deep wounds breaks CC. WW/cleave on a sheep = loose mob that can no longer be CC’d. Bad news bears."
2.4 will ease the sting of this, if the change to Cleave goes through, since Cleave would no longer break CC.
Also, what would (or do) you spec for Fury, post-BC? I'm thinking of respeccing my warrior from Hybrid Arms.
Asswipe Johnson Mar 13th 2008 12:26AM
"Improved Berserker Stance (5/5) - Increases attack power by 10%, and reduces threat caused in Berserker stance by 10%. Taking this talent means it's generally more beneficial to stack attack power rather then strength."
Every time I read this column I see something in it so completely, mind-numbingly stupid that I realize the writer doesn't know what the hell he's talking about and I should disregard the whole thing. Do you actually play WoW, or do you just skim through other talent guides online and slap-dash compile the basic points?