It's Druid's turn for a(nother) nerf
by Amanda Dean 
Mar 16th 2008 at 9:00AM
I'm pleasantly surprised at the minimal amount of crying that Druids are doing over the reduction of Cyclone's range to twenty yards. Sure there have been complaints, but as a whole, the Druid community seems to have been pretty mature about the nerf. Hortus assured us that although the change was left out of the patch notes, it was an intended modification.
The passive response could be because it wasn't cited in the patch notes, but I'd like to think of it as Druids' recognition that all classes will face changes once patch 2.4 is released. Nohealforyou of Wildhammer noted that Cyclone more of a class perk than a core Druid ability. Thus far I have seen no protests staged about the nerf nor has there been the promise of mass exodus from the game among Druid players.
What's fascinating to me is that those who play other classes believe that a ten-yard reduction is not enough to balance crowd control. Jestur of Frostmane suggested reducing the range of Polymorph to twenty yards as well. Should CC be balanced? Cyclone is shorter, but more powerful than Polymorph, but Polymorph lasts longer with the disadvantage healing the target under the spell. Does balance mean that Sap, Fear, Freezing Trap, and all other forms of CC should have exactly the same effect? I like variation.
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Aichon Mar 16th 2008 5:04AM
I think all of the old Druids remember how bad we had it pretty much at any point before 2.0, but especially back before the Druid class makeover. Nowadays, the game is actually really really fun for Druids since we have lots of options and don't feel underpowered by the margin that we once did. We're just grateful that we can actually hold our own now. Anything else is icing on the cake.
A small nerf here or there on non-critical abilities is good for everyone in the long run, so long as the share the love with the other classes too. When they start hitting at core abilities like Lifebloom though...
theRaptor Mar 16th 2008 11:05AM
Yes everything should be the same in arena. All classes will have a DPS, Heal, Buff and CC button that does exactly the same thing. That is the only way to stop the QQ and pointless cycles of balance.
Brasson Mar 16th 2008 1:02PM
Don't forget the mortal strike-esque debuff.
wudielox Mar 16th 2008 11:14AM
Personally, I disagree with all the whining when a class gets nerfed in a minorly substantial way. I half way understood the 'lock crying, because it was central to the way the class played. For the most part, nerfs are just a minor hiccup and will not dramatically impact your ability to reach whatever goals you may have. Call me too trusting of the Blizzard machine. Druids are taking this in stride because they realize it's not a huge deal.
Should all CC be the same? I dont think it should; but it should all be based around the same template. If it is easily refreshable (i.e. you can keep sheeping things) then it should have the negative of healing the target.
Philip Mar 16th 2008 11:15AM
/shrug, I'm rarely outside of 20 yards when I cast Cyclone o being with. I hardly see this as much of a nerf. Other druids probably see it this way, too.
Cyclone is purely a PvP based spell, too. It's too limiting to work well in PvE.
>20 yards would be viable in BGs, and I use it very rarely in BGs. In Arenas, it's not hard to maintain within the new 20 yard range limits. I suspect this isn't going to make much of a difference in Arenas (the real reason for its range reduction).
GryphonStalker Mar 16th 2008 12:25PM
Exactly. Not every druid does Arena. In all honestly I could really give a clefthoofs backside about it. 10 yards makes no difference to how I use the spell rarely in Battlegrounds.
Overall, it's a damn near useless CC and I have no idea why everyone cries so much about it. For the Raiding and PvE perspective. It lasts 6 seconds and suffers from diminishing returns 50%, 25% (6 seconds, 3 seconds, 1.5 seconds). How is that a useful CC when Polymorph can last up to 50 secs for a level 60 mage?
twothing Mar 16th 2008 6:30PM
With the changes on swipe.
The new things the can bleed. (ellemintals, ghosts, exe...)
&
The plus wep damg from sharping stones working now
2.4 is going to be fun for Feral.
Pzychotix Mar 16th 2008 11:30AM
The real reason why the response to this is so passive is the fact that we're just tired. We've had to face four different nerfs this patch.
- PVP set bonus massive nerf.
- Lifebloom coefficient nerf.
- Natural Perfection nerf.
- Now this Cyclone nerf.
There's no more energy left for another uproar. We've accepted the fact that this patch rapes us, and Warriors will still be the kings of Arenas, albeit with a different healer this time around.
Diabla Mar 16th 2008 11:37AM
I sooo agree with you. I not only play a Druid, but a Warlock as well... Between Life Tap and Lifebloom, I'm flippin' tired. So pretty much gonna just roll over and take now :( I just don't have the energy for each thing that comes out in this patch...
amasen Mar 16th 2008 12:09PM
Wow...You really think any of these changes will affect druids supremity in arena? I'll address each of your changes in order
- PVP set bonus massive nerf.
It also received a HUGE boost with a reduction in regrowth by 0.2seconds. Yes 15% speed reduction is a nerf, but nothing minor. You can still run away at 40% speed, a full 25% faster than any other classes talented speed.
- Lifebloom coefficient nerf.
7%. STUF already. This will hardly change PvP. This will change PvE. But it will not destroy Druids. It will take them down a notch from being the best single target healer to still the best single target healer. Eventually when +healing scales to high, this change will be reverted.
- Natural Perfection nerf.
Fully talented you'll take 4/8/12% less damage WHEN BEING HIT. Guess what, druids don't get hit much in arena until their partners are dead. Grats, this barely changes you. If your being Focused Fired, Go bear... Grats you still barely take any damage.
- Now this Cyclone nerf.
Cyclone fix. Fear is 20 yards. So is Cyclone. Now instead of getting to sit far in the back immune to any form of crowd control, you have to come into the game and be susceptible to the one form of crowd control that works against druids. Now when they fix druids so that you can't shift out of a polymorph (but are still immune if you were in animal form before the spell lands), then you will begin to understand what it was like to be everyone else in the game... Chain CC'd
Water Nerf.
Grats, you are still the supreme healer in arena thanks to this. 5 Seconds drinking is an eternity to any class without mobility and the ability to heal over time. You can load up your partner with a full stack of HoT's, go kitty, run, drink, regen and be back in the fight while the whole time your partner was still getting healed. Try drinking for 5 seconds as any class without your Heal over times abilitys and your mobility... Guess what, it won't happen.
As for PvE healing, the only change is lifebloom... And overall, your effectiveness is hardly reduced. You will still be the top healer in any raid (that isn't heavy on AoE damage)
Pzychotix Mar 16th 2008 1:19PM
OH HAHAHAHAHAHA.
0.2 seconds off regrowth cast time? HUGE BUFF?
WOW. JUST WOW.
Get the hell out.
Lifebloom coefficient nerf.
What warranted this PVE nerf? Did druids suddenly start massively outhealing paladins and priests? No, we weren't. A raid can go perfectly fine without a single druid, but doesn't work so well the other way around. Figure that one out. Nerfing for the hell of it is where this one came from.
Natural Protection nerf.
We also can't heal while in bear form. What do you suppose we do while we're in bear? Tank the DPS until we're low and suddenly magically heal everything back to full?
It must be nice to spew things out so thoughtlessly.
Aichon Mar 16th 2008 2:08PM
@ amasen
You might want to check your facts again. The Regrowth buff is not significant for Arena Druids, since Regrowth isn't used all of that often anyway, and .2 seconds is not huge to begin with. It's basically a consolation prize that was cannibalized from one of the old tier set bonuses.
As for the Lifebloom nerf, you're working with outdated information. It's a rather large nerf to the bloom at the end (20%, I believe), not a 7% nerf to the ticks like it once was. The 7% nerf would've hit PvE Druids hard, but would have barely touched PvP Druids. On the other hand, the nerf to the bloom effect is rather large. You're talking about a full couple hundred less points healed now per Lifebloom.
To be frank, you sound like you don't know what you're talking about at all. And again, Druids really aren't complaining about the Cyclone nerf anyway. I really don't see the need to rub salt in wounds when classes get nerfed, no matter how shallow you might perceive the wounds to be.
jrodman Mar 17th 2008 1:10AM
Single best single target healer? Meet paladins.
amasen Mar 17th 2008 11:14AM
While I'm not the best Arena player I do play 3 classes in arena (mage/warrior/priest), with my priest hovering around 1800-1990 and my other two around 1600/1700-1800 (as my friends I play with aren't often on when I am)
In response to people:
Lifebloom: As someone above pointed out to me, the nerf is no longer 7% on the life, but 20% off the bloom. That is in fact a great change (but not a huge nerf). That brings the coefficient from 42.8% to 34.3%. Assuming a druid of about +1800 healilng gear (for arena), that will bring the final tick from 1370.4 down to 1217.4 or a reduction of about 150 (11%).
All in all, a fairly fair change as one of the strongest tactics to countering a druid is to dispel all his HoTs, and with scaling gear a final bloom becomes more and more deadly to dispel
In response to the 2 piece set bonus change:
"You might want to check your facts again. The Regrowth buff is not significant for Arena Druids, since Regrowth isn't used all of that often anyway"
Fact is, druids use this spell in arena. Fact is druids spec for improved regrowth (not all do, but about 50% on my battlegroup spec 4/5 imp. Regrowth). Druids use this spell. They have to. I run a rogue/priest team, and our main strategy is the warrior take down. My rogue opens on the warrior, and I pop trinkets and PI and lay it on the warrior. When the druid pops thanks to our positioning ourselves in a tight space, he will get CC'd within a second or two. With my dispel spam (that prevents ANY hot, or swiftmend), and the constant CC the druid receives at the beginning (Blind, fear, gouge, vanish+sap), the druid is eventually forced to try and get a direct heal on his warrior once he's used his natures swiftness. This is not theory craft I'm stating, but what druids eventually do in every match we have played against them (either win or lose).
With the changes to lifebloom (-150ish off the bloom), druids will find themselves having to use direct heals more and more whenever they face teams with dispels.
As for natural perfection I should have stated one thing first about it in my comments. In 2v2 the change matters not. In 3v3 it hardly matters either way. In 5v5 it is a huge nerf and stupid as that is where druids have very little success. In small scale arena it is very difficult to impossible to lock a druid down, while in large scale there are generally enough available stuns to do so.
"It must be nice to spew things out so thoughtlessly."
As I mentioned above I play with 3 classes in arena, one of which is a warrior who's team mate is a druid I've leveled from 1 -70 with. I love playing this team. My druid took a 4 month break and we he came back we started up arena again (my warrior with 350resilance, him with
Zach Mar 16th 2008 11:33AM
Cyclone is hands down the most powerful CC in the game. It's a spammable Banish effect that can only be removed by ONE item. Range reduction is the LEAST that Blizzard can do to balance it.
Philip Mar 16th 2008 5:33PM
Spammable is a bit exaggerating. If you want to make a proper argument, lay out the proper facts.
You cannot spam cyclone somebody. After the third cyclone, which lasts only 1.5 seconds, you're immune. A druid must wait for the diminishing return time to reset ( somewhere around 5-10 seconds ) before they can cyclone you again.
Given all its limitations currently, range reduction was the *only* thing they could do to this spell. And, I bet ya, it won't have any real impact in arenas.
Charn Mar 16th 2008 11:46AM
I don't PVP nearly enough to cry about getting beat.. i suck and i know it. I do raid as often as I can so I, as i think any raider would think, hate seeing anyone get nerfed. It effects 'my' game in a negative way. I am a hunter and the biggest change I think have gotten in a long time is the removal of deadspace. I don;t see anyone in my raid complaining when i am right up against a boss shooting it instead of half way across the room. Same goes for CC.... anyone want to yell at the mage in their raid because his sheep last too long.. or scream at the priest to shorten up their shackle durations. How we just stop having PVP issues effect the game for those of us that see it as a waste of time. Or how about my raid chew me out because my traps last a mere half a min? I understand everyone likes to play for different reasons. But can we please keep the nerf bat contained in the arena walls please?
Dahk Mar 16th 2008 12:24PM
Look at druid representation in high level arenas. They don't have much to cry about, so I'm not surprised they're taking this so well.
Magnetite2 Mar 16th 2008 12:33PM
A 'class perk'???
Although I don't use it very often (and I don't play arena on my druid), how would any other class like one of their spells (one we get at level 70 too) to be called a 'class perk'?
Yet again, it will affect mostly balance druids, and, to a lesser extent, feral druids, neither of which are represented much in arenas already.
What Blizzard giveth, Blizzard taketh away - it's becoming a druid mantra by now, I would imagine.
Fizzed Mar 16th 2008 12:36PM
"I'm pleasantly surprised at the minimal amount of crying that Druids are doing"
It would be wonderful if Wowinsider bloggers would stop cheering about Druid nerfs. We are mad about it, but as others have said we are tired of fighting the good fight...Blizzard isn't listening.
Cylcone can be counterspelled/interrupted/etc, locking us out of our heals. The 20 yard nerf hits balance druids hardest. To ferals its nothing and restos are shrugging it off. Balance didn't need a nerf.
As a reminder to all, ONE spec of druids is powerful in 2v2. What Blizzard is telling Druids is to heal in 2v2 (or maybe 3v3) arenas or don't play them at all. And yes, I know they are saying that to others (ahem, Shadow Priests). I'm sad for them as well.
Resto loses its strengths in 5v5. Feral isn't so great there and balance is ok. But of course, Blizzard balances around 2v2, even though they say otherwise.
Restos will continue to own in 2v2. These changes really don't hurt them at all. The nerf bat swings wide, but with little accuracy.