Breakfast Topic: Spell pushback
by Amanda Dean 
Mar 23rd 2008 at 8:00AM
Spellpower of Malfurion posted on the Priest forums that spell pushback is an indication that Blizzard prefers melee classes over spell casters. In his thread, the original poster used the example of a sixteen-second actual cast time for a second and a half spell due to spell pushback. This greatly reduced the effect of casters against melee classes. Songbreeze of Dragonmaw echoed this sentiment with the response, "Welcome to World of Meleecraft."
Other posters disagreed. Some stated that many PvE encounters favor casters. Nemarra of Tichondrius pointed out that melee characters have an equal disadvantage at range. Casters also have access to instant spells and abilities such as Blink, Frost Nova and Curse of Exhaustion to help them get out of melee range. Others have access to Power Word Shield and Earth Shield that mitigate the effects of pushback. If you're concerned about spell pushback, you should pay particular attention to how your spec can mitigate it.
If anything were to change about spell pushback, I would suggest a limit to the number of times a spell could be pushed back or to the maximum casting time, like three times the original casting time of the spell. So if you were casting a one and a half second Mind Blast, the maximum time the spell could be pushed back to would be four and a half seconds.Is spell pushback a problem or does it justifiably balance classes?
Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Blizzard, Breakfast Topics, Talents, Forums
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)
Fashigady Mar 23rd 2008 8:21AM
Spell pushback is unbalancing PvP now, virtually every melee class has some way of interrupting spell casts - not to mention rogues and their cloak of bloody shadows! I'll just go QQ in the corner now...
twh Mar 23rd 2008 1:29PM
Except paladins, and no, Hammer of Justice and Repentance are a stun and disorient respectively.
So, except if you're a BElf, which I am not, I've no real way to combat casters.
Nasgoul Mar 23rd 2008 2:03PM
Well to though my opinion in here.. While i do my share of qqing on these forums... this is another spot where i dont think change is needed to the mechanic....
spell pushback is one of the main defenses to casters. its what makes up for armor not mattering.. and let me tell u this i would rather deal with being good at the game, and getting my spells off, than having to worry about how much armor this crazy warrior has...
the only issue i would even talk about is spell interrupts, not pushbacks... when they make u stand still to cast a heal, they shouldnt allow other classes to not let u cast for 10-20 seconds at a time.. depending on the skill and class of the melee that is attacking u.
lastly, speaking as a priest, there are ways to avoid spell pushbacks... disc priest are immune to pushbacks after they get critted if they spec that way, pallys can have concentration aura on... so this topic no real complaints here
Jasonuscg Mar 23rd 2008 8:36AM
Hunters have this disadvantage as well.
Kaphik Mar 23rd 2008 8:41AM
I play a 70 priest and a 70 warrior. I'd gladly support a change to spell pushback if all you casters would support armor actually mitigating spell damage.
Fashigady Mar 23rd 2008 9:04AM
No, a warrior in full plate takes reduced damage from melee, but we (casters in our tissue paper robes) have almost no melee damage mitigation and virtually no spell damage mitigation. Intellect should reduce damage from spells, and even then.... NO.
kellzea Mar 23rd 2008 9:18AM
megh, its how it goes. casters are only suposed to kill mele if they outnumber the mele and stand far apart
Blixkreeg Mar 23rd 2008 9:21AM
Wanting Intellect to mitigate spell damage is no different than a melee player telling you to get more Agility for dodging those melee hits.
Kaphik Mar 23rd 2008 9:30AM
Melee's spell interrupts have cooldowns. Pummel is 8 seconds, Kick is 10 seconds (I believe), Shield Bash is 12 seconds. Tauren Warstomp is on a two minute cooldown. The mace stun proc is random. Casters need to figure out how to avoid melee attacks, just as melee needs to figure out how to get into melee range on casters before getting splattered.
Spell pushback is fine. What is going on is less experienced players are getting themselves some pvp gear, and they think that suddenly because they have a few purples they are automatically going to be unstoppable in pvp. So instead of improving themselves, they take to the forums and complai in a loud and crying voice.
If it is taking you 16 seconds to cast a spell, you either need to get closer to your teammates so they can help, or get better teammates. Ok, except for maybe a Discipline priest, because they are going to have 10 people beating on them anyways.
Kiriy Mar 24th 2008 10:08AM
10 seconds, yes.
All I have to say is this: if, as a caster, you have someone up in your face, you are doing something wrong.
Unundead Mar 23rd 2008 9:41AM
Caster mobs don't have pushback. Inconsistency!
Kaphik Mar 23rd 2008 9:52AM
Mobs =/= Players
theRaptor Mar 23rd 2008 10:29AM
@9 Are you stupid? What does your comment have to do with the parents point? The fact that NPC's don't have pushback is an inconsistency, no one is doubting that NPC's are not the same as players. But in many areas they function the same, so why is spell push back special?
Nightwatch Mar 23rd 2008 11:02AM
For once, Balance Druids have an advantage. Our 4th tier talent, "Celestial Focus" gives Star Fire a 15% chance to stun, and 70% push-back resistance on Wrath. That pushback resistance is very handy in both PVP and PVE. Every caster class should have a similar talent.
As far as armor and spell damage. Maybe we can get an armor kit, or an enchant that would give some spell damage reduction something like a shield enchant to reduce damage and have a low % to actually reflect the spell would be nice, especially for Paladins.
Tim Mar 23rd 2008 11:01AM
I think spell pushback is fair, but casters should get some kind of option that lets them get off the occasional uninterrupted spell, like
-- Blowback (a certain number of stacked melee attacks throws melee out of melee range for a few moments)
OR
a spell dmg version of a mana gem... basically, a little grenade with a cooldown that you have to create... you could attach other conditions to it, like that it can only be used in melee range, and that it is only enabled by a spell interrupted... who knows.
Tenchan Mar 23rd 2008 11:30AM
I never found out ... is spell pushback dependant on the done damage of the hit? If not, it damn well should be.
doyesac Mar 23rd 2008 11:35AM
Considering how easy it is for mages to burn my warrior to a crisp from range, or how easy it is for a warlock's instant dots to kill me (eventually, and hopefully after I get him/her down), I tend to think that pushback is just fine as is.
Thinking that pushback is a problem seems to assume that melee/caster combat has to be balanced around melee encounters -- but combat includes melee AND ranged aspects. Half the time I get kited around before I can close the gap, even with charge and intercept. Even if I trinket out of a deathcoil with my superhuman fast reflexes I am usually far enough away that I am out of melee range and have to close the gap again. And blink! you gave any idea how annoying Blink is? How can I kill you if you are all the way over there!
So, I'll make a deal with all you casters: I'll stop pushing back your spells if you stop kiting me around. Sound fair?
Arya Mar 23rd 2008 12:07PM
So, what class has both deathcoil and blink?
doyesac Mar 23rd 2008 12:27PM
I dunno. All clothies look alike to me. You mean there are different kinds?
Whatever class has deathcoil and blink also has something called Psychic Scream that's really annoying too. And some sort of shield. And some sort of face-melting laser than makes me walk slow.
Seriously though -- all cloth classes have something they can use to keep me at range. If they keep me at range they win. If I get close then I win. Without pushback, then suddenly the clothies win whether I am close or far. I seem to think that make pushback fair, even if it is annoying.
Arya Mar 23rd 2008 12:43PM
Warriors have plenty of tools to deal with casters: hamstring (with no cooldown), charge, intercept and shield bash. Warriors can do as much dps on the move as standing still, have much greater health pools and generate rage throughout a fight not having to worry about running out of mana.