Scattered Shots: Hunter problems and predictions
Scattered Shots is for hunters. 'Nuff said on that topic. The Freezing Trap David was stuck in last week also wore off a little bit, thanks to Daniel, permitting him to write once more without his fingers snapping off from the cold.In the wake of the recent confusion regarding Scare Beast, once again some hunters have gotten to complaining a lot about the state of their class. While on one hand, there are certainly problematic issues hunters are having, it's really not fair to say that the class is broken. It isn't -- being a hunter is more fun than its ever been, and it looks like this class will only get better in the future.
Nonetheless, looking at the problems we do have might give us a clearer sense of where we're going in the future. With more and more information coming out about Wrath of the Lich King, and especially since Blizzard started asking for feedback from hunters, it's worthwhile to have a look at what holes do exist for our class, and how future changes might seek to plug them up.
Mana
Hunters don't like running out of mana in the middle of a fight, but other mana users don't like that either. Are hunters entitled to something like rage or energy as physical damage dealers like warriors and rogues, or are we just being picky? Since we aren't really wizards of any sort, does our use of mana cause more problems than it solves?
One thing to keep in mind is that intellect helps out casters a lot by providing spell crit in addition to mana pool, whereas for hunters it only provides a larger mana pool, often at the expense of physical crit. My wild brainstorming mind imagines: what if hunters had a "focus pool" much like mana, except that it was determined by agility rather than intellect? This way, it would let us focus in on fewer important stats which benefit us in more ways than one. On the other hand, perhaps having to juggle more stats than usual is one of the things that makes choosing hunter gear a more interesting task.
This is a big problem on lots of hunters' minds -- but what's Blizzard going to do about it? It's been a problem since the very beginning, and so far Blizzard's main answer has been Aspect of the Viper. Whether that is enough or not remains to be proven. Wrath of the Lich King may bring more mana-regenerating abilities, but personally I would prefer an overhaul of the mana system, and a replacement with something more hunter-like. Call it focus or energy, pizzazz or chutzpah; it doesn't matter to me, but make it feel more like something a hunter would use, not a magician.
Pet training
The idea behind learning new pet skills out in the wild and then gradually teaching them to your pet is a great one on the surface. The first time you're leveling a hunter it can even be quite interesting to go hunt down the pet skills you can get as they become available. But once its novelty wears off, it becomes a mere chore, especially if you're leveling a hunter for the second time, your heart yearns for something more efficient.
To make things worse, the current system requires that you always keep one space available in your stable for switching out with various throwaway pets, tamed only for the abilities they have to offer your regular animal companions. From an endgame perspective, when people like to have maximum versatility for various situations, the current implementation lacks in elegance as well as efficiency.
We will probably see Blizzard introduce some solution intended to simplify this at some point. If they do it right, they'll likely use a reductionist method to just try and blend it in with other elements of the game. If not, I fear they might try to introduce some entirely new mechanic that just shifts the problem around without actually solving it. We'll have to wait and see.
Pet abilities and versatility
Mania's Arcania recently did an awesome review of the pet versatility problem. Hunters want each species of tamable beast to have its own different pros and cons, each one viable in its own way for various situations. In our wildest dreams, each pet would be like its own little mini-class we could attach to our hunter for a unique hunting experience. From a design perspective, however, designing and balancing all these abilities just for one class could seem like a major commitment to which Blizzard just doesn't have the time and energy to devote.
While I'd settle for Mania's suggestions on a good middle ground, I can't stop dreaming of a future in which hunters really have an awesome array of pets to choose from, as well as an awesome arsenal of tools (from pet gear to pet talents and abilities) they can use to customize those pets to their liking. I tend to think Blizzard is still holding out for that one great day when all pets can really start living up to the vision they originally had in mind, and I'd be surprised if they actually give up on that dream and settle on some sort of compromise. It's much more likely that they'll either go ahead and do pets right at last, or else, sadly, let them lag behind indefinitely, forever awaiting their chance to shine and never really getting there. I know Blizzard's full of creative people, and as a creative person myself, I know how it is when you've got this great project you really really want to get to someday, only to eventually lament that "someday" never came.
Itemization
This is one problem Blizzard is having across the board with all the classes: they've created so many different talent setups that take advantage of so many different combinations of stats that players are having a hard time finding the right mix of items that match their talent build of choice. It's an even bigger issue for hybrids like druids and paladins, but non-Beast Master hunters are having trouble getting gear that appeals exactly to their nature as well.
I think we will see that Blizzard's solution to this is an evening out of the kind of gear required by any particular specialization within any particular class. Just in the same way that some feral druid talents were changed a while back so that cat druids could make better use of the same gear that rogues use, we will see Blizzard making all hunters use more or less the same gear. Items will either be "for hunters" or "not for hunters" -- but then again, it might turn out to be "for hunters and enhancement shamans" instead of just hunters. I don't know enough about enhancement shamans to be sure.
PvP issues
We've covered line of sight in PvP before, and it's still as much of an issue as ever. In addition to that, many hunters complain that their pets die way too easily in PvP (and raiding) situations, and wish that more of their stats carried over to the pet, most notably resilience and armor scaling.
Blizzard may very well buff pets up a bit -- that seems easy enough to do -- but the line of sight problem is much more perplexing. Personally I'd like to see hunters get a long casting time heat-seeking missile of some sort in the expansion -- with a knockback effect for kicks -- just for situations where people are hiding behind pillars.
Talent trees and specific abilities
Many people seem to think that Beast Mastery is just fine, but that Marksmanship and Survival are having issues. Some of the talents seem lackluster and less synergetic than Beast Mastery talents. Likewise, when it comes to more generalized specific abilities, there are many varied points of view. Some people say that traps are not useful enough, for instance, or that their cooldown is too short. Others say that Beast Lore, Tranquilizing Shot, and others should be changed so that we use them more often.
Specific abilities like these are the hardest to predict. Blizzard has their own mind when it comes to tweaking things. I have yet to see any player suggest "Ability X should be adjusted like such and such" and hear Blizzard respond, "okay!" More often they look at the general principles we raise and then apply their own solution to them in a way we'd never have thought of on our own.
Blizzard's unpredictability applies for every issue on this list. We can tell them the problem and ask them our questions, but the answer we get will almost never be what we expected.
Filed under: Hunter, Analysis / Opinion, PvP, Expansions, Wrath of the Lich King, (Hunter) Scattered Shots






Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)
Vivified May 15th 2008 6:26PM
Your insight on the Hunter class is trash at best, stop writing about them.
Fixxgrix May 15th 2008 6:59PM
Your insight on the insight of others is trash at best. Please stop writing about them.
PimpyMicPimp May 15th 2008 6:28PM
I realise that I'm going to be flamed into oblivion for saying this, but it's a risk I'm willing to take:
While no class is perfect and every single class needs tweaking, Hunters included, I can't help but think Hunters are low on the totem pole of classes that really need to be looked at. The Hunters in my guild are pretty awesome and don't really wont for anything. I'm not saying "hunterz r fine l2p", I just don't see them needing OMGFIXNOA status when comapred to other classes (e.g. Ehnancment Shammies, at least for PvP).
Just my two cents. I hope people will disagree with me, but will keep it at least as intelligent as I'm trying too.
Vivified May 15th 2008 6:32PM
Enhancement shamans are not a class... Blizzard has stated that they want to make at least 1 spec Arena viable for every class, enhancement is not the Shaman's. The problem with Hunters is that MM is our "Arena spec" and Blizzard's own arena representation numbers show that Hunters aren't really viable in Arena at all.
Pie Pants May 15th 2008 7:04PM
I play a 70 hunter, and I couldn't agree more. Sure, I could think of a dozen things I'd *like* to see improved with the class, but as it is, I can also think of much more broken classes.
One thing about the article irked me a bit though. Especially "Personally I'd like to see hunters get a long casting time heat-seeking missile of some sort in the expansion -- with a knockback effect for kicks -- just for situations where people are hiding behind pillars."
I've played non-hunter classes too, and I'm well aware that hiding behind stuff is pretty much one of the only defenses some classes have against hunters. The hunters just have to work around it - like any other casters, really.
jrb May 16th 2008 4:56AM
with blizzard more concerned about pvp now i think it's fair to say they'll be fixing any issues we have in that regard, it's just a matter of how and when.
Pville May 17th 2008 10:13AM
I too think hunters are fine. I have a hunter as my main and I love playing him. He's by far the most versatile (solo, group, raid, pvp) for me to play.
I admit I don't play much arena, but when I did play LOS was my biggest problem/annoyance. IF (and that's a big 'if') they want to do something about having more hunters represented, they should add a flat and/or larger arena where hunters would really shine. That way you'd have a 1 in 4 chance of getting a hunter-friendly arena. I really don't see why they have all the pillars and such in the arenas anyway... when I do BG, there's very few intances where the enemy I'm fighting can run and hide... why not in arenas too? Is that too simplistic?.. or am I missing something?
I pretty much have 1 of every class, so I really don't care that much if class X is OP or what have you. I've seen posts where people rate hunters as 'Easy' to kill, and I've seen posts where hunters are hated because of the 'I win' button. I hope the seemingly QQ'ing going on for hunters isn't actual QQ'ing. Yes, every class wants to be the most OP, but please, hunters, /deep breath /relax
If any class has a right to QQ, it's the once feared shaman.
SpaceDog May 15th 2008 6:34PM
While it's true that hunters using mana doesn't really fit, I don't think the way that mana works is wrong for a hunter.
Let me explain. If "mana" were simply named something more physical-sounding... I can't think of anything right now... but anyway, if that were the case, it would seem more fitting.
However, I don't think that the mechanics of mana are inappropriate for a hunter. You get tired as a fight goes on and eventually you can't function as well as you could to begin with.
So, I don't know, maybe you just have to be more open-minded about what "mana" means in your head. A whole rehaul of the system would be pretty horrendous to implement this late on in the game.
Nutteh May 15th 2008 7:00PM
I tend to agree with your comment, but something has to be done.. and as a sunwell raider I find it getting worse and worse in regards to mana.
If you compare the "hunter" gear vs the "rogue" gear in sunwell, your giving up soo much better stats (wtb armor ignore, not haste) for a lot of int.. But what do you do? As mentioned in the article, do you balance your class around ensuring your able to keep up mana, or do you push for the highest dps, I cant see why you would gimp yourself when mana isnt an issue to ensure you dont go oom in long fights.
Until blizzard start improving the mail gear to not be a bandaid for our mana issues (mp5 on t6 loot?) ill be running around in mostly rogue gear
Timothy W May 15th 2008 7:48PM
How can Mana not be wrong for hunters? As I think about it, I think I see your point. To increase Mana, you use intellect. For Casters, that makes sense, because it is also a stat required to increase their chance of a Crit, as stated in the Article. For Hunters, the stats suggested are Stamina, for obvious reasons, Agility, for Defensive, and for ability to crit, and Intellect. The SINGLE Hunter use for Intellect is to increase our Mana Pool. If we could be switched to a "Focus Pool", and Focus was increased by the use of Agility, then we could be self sufficient, and we could leave the Caster stuff alone. Even better, let's call it Focus Mana, so that Mana pots could still replenish it. Of course, we could call it focus, and the pots to replenish it could be Caffiene!! *Duck* However, I think getting a skill to hypermode our Mana regen would not really be fair. We run out of mana, we have Autoshot still going. A Caster runs out of Mana, they are Cannon Fodder.
Krick May 15th 2008 7:54PM
All classes have gear tradeoffs they have to make. As a paladin tank, I'd love to have tons of spell damage for threat (and intellect for the mana to use those spells). But if I go for spell damage or intellect, I have to do it at the expense of proper tanking stats.... defense, stamina, dodge, etc...
I have a hard time feeling bad for hunters that complain that they can't have the top DPS gear AND have tons of mana too.
...
Krick
http://www.tankadin.com/
Fobok May 15th 2008 9:01PM
While I personally don't mind mana as a system, something needs to be done. They've made it so Aspect of the Viper is necessary if you don't want to drink after every fight. Which, really, kind of defeats the purpose of having more than one Aspect.
Cynra May 16th 2008 7:09AM
Actually, there is an added benefit to stacking Intellect as a hunter -- IF you're Marksmanship. Combat Experience increases your Agility by 1% and your Intellect by 3%. You can then further benefit from that added Intellect by choosing to put three talent points in Careful Aim which will increase your Attack Power by 45% of your Intellect. Due to the strengths inherent in the Marksmanship tree, many Arena hunters choose to PvP as Marksmanship hunters and stack oodles of Intellect.
Of course, many people don't consider Markmanship to be a viable raiding build, especially in the light of the Beast Mastery tree's sustained damage and even the Survival tree.
And drinking after every fight is not an issue at all. Numerous other classes do that, especially those that lack the high OO5SR mana regen inherent in specific gear intended primarily for priests, mages, and druids. I have no qualms in doing so at all. However, the issue arises that our efficiency during an extended boss fight is very shitty and we're sometimes having problems continuing to DPS. I agree, however, that we shouldn't have to raid in Aspect of the Viper -- as a fast-attack Beast Master, I'm particularly fond of Aspect of the Hawk myself.
Orin May 15th 2008 6:46PM
You really should include Cheeky/Lactose's analysis of hunter mechanics in any fair assessment of the fundamental flaws of the hunter class.
There has been a lot of great ideas from the hunter community, but Cheeky/Lactose's treatise on the subject is the most convincing.
Its too bad that Blizz continues to completely disregard the feedback and seems intent on attempting gimmicky, band-aid buffs that none of us want.
Nizari May 15th 2008 6:49PM
If hunters want a fix for LoS issues in arena, they should just get what mages get for it: Arcane Missiles. Just give them an instant attack that channels 4-5 attacks, one every second. It might need a CD (i'm not knowledgable enough about hunter rotations/timing to know just how OP this could be), but it certainly would be less drastic that removing all the poles in nagrand arena.
Gordal May 31st 2008 12:38PM
Sadly, the skill you're describing is available to hunters - Volley. While Volley exists, chances are that hunters won't get a targeted channelled shot.
Volley is, also, junk. A channelled AoE with weak damage that requires talents to be remotely useful in combat, and even then its use is limited to, say, killing off another hunter's snakes or finishing off a weak opponent that's wandered into your melee range.
Volley would be a prime candidate for reworking as a targeted shot, being roughly the sister skill to Multi Shot.
pantheon May 19th 2008 4:49AM
My only real problem with hunters is the idea of the survival class being the least useful in pvp. The name is sort of poorly chosen since we're the least likely to actually survive. Anyone with their pvp trinket laughs at the traps and once any melee gets on us we have literally nothing to escape. Don't tell me wing clip is worth a damn cause any other melee has something to slow you down as well. Shamans frost shock, warriors hamstring, rogues sever your damn spinal cord (sarcasm) and paladins have their hammer. A BM hunter can use initimidation to buy themselves a few seconds, an MM hunter can use scatter shot, but our wyvern wont work at that range just like our other shots. Basically, any decent melee = death and I think we need something to give us a chance in those encounters.
Maguro-Llane May 15th 2008 7:16PM
While I agree with the need for more pet abilities, I have to disagree with complaints about LOS. Why should our LOS issues be any different than those of any other ranged class? Are we proposing "heat seeking" spells for Mages, Warlocks, Elem Shams, Shadow Priests as well?
Because I care about the pet abilities issue and I find the LOS issue frivilous, I think we're best keeping them seperate to increase the chance that Blizz will take our pet requests more seriously. I'm also not so sure about the itemization problem. I may be ignorant of the issue, but is there something about AP and Agility that isn't good for hunters of all trees? If it's some subtle difference like the differences of Dreadweave vs Felweave, I would need to have that explained to me in more detail than you've done here. And lastly on the issue of pet abilities, why the hell don't spiders get poison spit like serpents do?
I support Beast Lore being a passive ability.
I support more slots in the stables.
I support faster pet leveling.
I support more pet family specific abilities.
PeeWee May 15th 2008 8:59PM
Mages and Locks already have "heat seekers", they're called Drain Life and Arcane Missiles.
Kyudo May 16th 2008 4:50PM
I support your support statements.