Forum drama leads to legal threats
Thanks to tipster Rick for sending us a bit of strange forum drama that deserves some attention. A user over on the Anvilmar-US server, Demetreus, was accused of stealing from the guild bank and gquitting (along with his friend Morph). Zaknafaine, a member of his former guild HaVoK, said in a post "its just a game...its not like one of us are going to show up at your doorstep and throw you a beatin." [sic]Demetreus took this as a threat, and claims to have contacted his lawyer. Of course, his lawyer agrees with him, and he's now posted as much as he tries to defend himself.
Who knows who is right and who is wrong with regards to the bank stealing, that's not what's interesting here per se. What I find out of the ordinary here is that Demetreus took what someone said as a threat and felt it necessary to call an attorney. In my opinion, it wasn't. The alleged threat was actually just the opposite – a statement that none of this mattered – that it was just a game.
Further, I have unfortunately been involved in some legal posturing that took place over some in-game turned out-of-game harassment, and in that case the number one thing that was told to us by the attorneys was "don't make a big deal about this, just keep it private, don't expose yourself." I've heard that advice before on a number of legal issues, so part of me wonders if Demetreus was told the same thing, and then why he isn't following that (of course, the underlying context here is that he could be making it all up). It is quite surprising to see legal action threatened over forum drama, and for it to be brought up in this way.
However I gather I shouldn't really be surprised by this, given the propensity for the WoW community to create and sustain itself on dramatic forum posts, but nonetheless I find myself thinking, "Really? Over a forum comment?"
Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, WoW Social Conventions, Virtual selves, Guilds






Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)
Selei Jun 2nd 2008 4:08PM
HAHA
I bet a University of Phoenix Law Degree is involved in this somehow...
Mike Schramm Jun 2nd 2008 4:08PM
All I know is, if I ever got sued for posting something on an Internet forum, I'm hiring Andy Griffith to be at my trial.
And yes, I'll have to make sure to find a serious trailer to put him in. Don't make fun of Matlock.
Hurode Jun 2nd 2008 4:49PM
Hmph, I'm calling up Fred Thompson.
Irshalthra Jun 2nd 2008 5:31PM
Agreed Fred Thompson FTW!!
katsuyakaiba Jun 2nd 2008 11:35PM
Agreed!
Buckshot Jun 2nd 2008 4:09PM
Legal QQ
brucimus Jun 2nd 2008 4:12PM
leagal? is that a typo?
Taeous Jun 2nd 2008 4:14PM
Oh good lord. Yet another person who is taking a videogame way too damn seriously. If you epeen is SO TINY that you have to result to legal action for some forum drama...just end it. It's down the road, not across the street. Do us all a favor.
But, to Adam's point, this does seem a bit strange that the defendant (?) would make such a public and big deal about all this. Sort of makes me smell some BS coming off his case.
Lilith Jun 2nd 2008 4:15PM
He contacted his lawyer? I don't buy that for a minute. Remember kids, lawyer =/= police man, and they also won't work pro bono for some kid getting angry over wow drama.
innajunglestylee Jun 2nd 2008 4:16PM
I'd bet my J.D. that this guy didn't show jack to a lawyer.
mensrea Jun 2nd 2008 8:57PM
As would I.
The statement is not even close enough to a "threat" for it to be possible.
Saelorn Jun 2nd 2008 4:16PM
While many people hide behind the "it's just a game" argument, the reality of the situation is that what happens in game does have a real impact on real life.
If I spend three hours in a raid, and someone manages to ninja the item I was after (assume I had the right to the item through prior-agreement, and someone forgot to change the loot settings), then I have just been cheated out of three hours of my life; my time is valuable, as I could spend it doing any number of things, and this person is, in effect, stealing from me.
People have killed in the past over such things. I wish I had the link, but there was a story just a little while ago about someone who was tired of being griefed and had the situation resolved in such a manner.
I guess my point is that people should try and take things a little more seriously, especially in situations where others have a great deal of time and energy invested.
Selei Jun 2nd 2008 4:20PM
This is assuming you are only raiding for loot... that's why the term "loot whore" exists...
It IS just a game man... you're taking it too seriously
chris.dostal Jun 2nd 2008 5:04PM
Really? You're being robbed of 3 hours of your life? Well, I can see that. But did you have any fun at all during this hypothetical 3 hour raid? Or were you just loot-whoring?
If all you were doing is loot-whoring, then why even bother to play at all? Go outside, watch TV, play something else. If you're not having fun, don't pay the $15/mo.
I can agree that some things about interactions on online games and forums should be taken more seriously. Especially since there are some screwed up people out there who take things entirely too far and kill other people IRL over disputes in game.
But before saying that 3 hours of your life were stolen from you because someone ninja'd your loot, take some things into account.
1) Did you get anything from the raid other than that specific item?
2) What else would you have done with those 3 hours?
3) If all you got was that loot, and you would have rather done something else during those 3 hours, why didn't you?
darian Jun 2nd 2008 7:18PM
While I don't buy the whole "I wasted three hours of my life" argument, I also don't buy the whole "You're a loot whore if you care about loot" argument. Having loot stolen sucks hard, whether you raid purely for the loot or for the fun of it.
It's kind of like going on a date. You have a blast bowling or watching a movie, you enjoy a fine dinner, and after all is said and done your date hits you with a tire iron and runs off with your car. It's unarguable that everything you did up until that moment was fun, but that's hardly the point.
Similarly, thinking about how you could have better spent those three hours, or what else you got out of those three hours is pointless. In both raiding and dating it is implied that the parties involved are going to be working together to have a good time. Anything that impinges on that is implied to be a mistake or unavoidable. It is completely natural that when something intentionally destroys that purpose that those on the receiving end are hurt, bitter and angry.
Using the phrase "it's a game", or any of its relatives, as a cure-all to the ill deeds and injustices that occur within the game is both insincere and ignorant. If such measures worked anywhere, half the strife that besets us in real life simply wouldn't happen. People wouldn't have reasons to be angry about the economy, foreign affairs, the mistakes of government or their recent breakup because "that's life" or "life isn't fair".
wyrd Jun 2nd 2008 8:36PM
I love how high and mighty everyone gets about raid loot. Like you dont all want to get the sweet epics just like everyone else. Yes, there are other reasons to raid, but after all the people who claim to not care about the loot, Ive never seen someone in a raid who didnt want to make sure they got theirs.
ILikePvPbuthatePvPers Jun 2nd 2008 4:20PM
Oh sweet! It's Attorney Jack McCoy from Law & Order! He is badass!
Chen Jun 2nd 2008 4:18PM
next, we should see legal action involving a player suing another one because he was "misled" into buying an item on AH that's way way overpriced and slap the seller with fraud
innajunglestylee Jun 2nd 2008 4:20PM
Dear Sir/Madam,
I represent the firm of QQ Moar Nub We So Pwned Joo in Court. I have been retained to sue you for 1,000,000g in connection with the WoWinsider comment above. Suggesting that this individual "end it" is like seriously bad and stuff so I'm calling the police. Oh wait, the police aren't needed for civil suits? QQ Moar Nub. It's not just a firm name, it's our motto. We'll see you in the Shadowprey Courthouse next week kk thx.
Taeous Jun 2nd 2008 4:39PM
lol