Forum post of the day: Just a number
by Amanda Dean 
Jun 25th 2008 at 2:18AM
World of Warcraft attracts a variety of players from all demographics. Players face different sets of challenges based on where they are in real life. Students may face time crunches at some points that prohibit themselves from immersion in the game. Parents have many obligations that may pull themselves away from the keyboard with little to no warning. There are times when big projects at work require extra hours. Some may even go into labor in the middle of a battleground. Somehow, despite our divergent responsibilities, we all come together to enjoy WoW.
Crothiuz of Lethon has found himself in the middle of an age-related struggle. Posting in the Guild Relations forum, he told a tale of how he was excluded from a raid because he was only fourteen years of age. He feels that he has carried himself in a mature manner and it is only his age that has precluded him from running Karazhan with his guild. He was then kicked from the guild while he was offline. The original poster is concerned that age will continue to be a factor in his online aspirations.
Maturity is one of the main themes that came across in the comments of this thread. Although a chronological age over eighteen, twenty-one, twenty-five, or even thirty does not entirely gauge the emotional state of the player, it's a reference point that some guilds use to begin their member searches. In some ways it makes sense to try to be in the company of one's peers, on the other hand this is an arbitrary measure of a persons attitude or ability. Age is not the only source of wisdom and balance.
The other major concern is scheduling. Younger players tend to be more controlled by the demands of their schools, parents, and peers than older players who have more stable schedules. Parents can, and do, at times pull the plug on game play as they deem necessary.
The culture of the guild was also mentioned. Although WoW is a rated T for Teen game, "adult language" and graphic topics often go unfiltered by many players. Everyone's behavior varies based on their company and some would prefer to keep maintain a level of behavior that they recognize is not suitable for younger people in their guilds. Again, age is a subjective way of gaging tolerance.
My best advice to the original poster is to keep looking for a guild that suits his needs and his emotional maturity level. I wouldn't suggest lying about his age, but if he's comfortable in an adult environment, perhaps he should just keep that bit of information private.
Filed under: Virtual selves, Guilds, Forums, Forum Post of the Day
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Cameron Jun 25th 2008 2:41AM
Over vent it would be kind of hard to hide your age if you are so young... unless he is REALLY mature for his age lol.
KyoKenshin Jun 25th 2008 2:43AM
Yeah, I'd just not divulge age if I was worried about it restricting my experience. When I first started playing there was a rogue in my guild that was 11...eleven! Until he told us he was that young I had no idea and he was far more mature than a lot of the 20+ guys in the guild. I think the raid roster should be made based on skill, availability, and maturity. Not age.
Chri Jun 25th 2008 2:43AM
Our guild accepts teenagers as members/officers/raiders. Some teenagers are very mature, and others definitely fit the "wow! phat loot" stereotype.
I can handle the attitude. What I find difficult about playing with teenagers is that you can be 1 hour into a raid, about to do a boss pull and bam! one of our players has to go.
Reddeth Jun 25th 2008 2:10PM
Point taken, but I just want to note that I've had the same issue with adults.
As a parent, I have no qualms about pulling my kid out of a dungeon if I discover he started playing without finishing his chores/homework/whatever. And my wife has no qualms about yanking my chain for the same reasons. :)
Mardoc Jun 25th 2008 2:50AM
It's difficult, I think. I think most guilds try to be as accepting as possible of all sorts of people, regardless of race, age etc... although as a former guild officer I must admit that we have been stung in the past by immature players... and unfortunately these have been players of a younger age.
You hear people berating the "kids" a lot on the forums and in general chat. Whilst I believe it is possible for a relatively younger gamer of, say fourteen, to present himself maturely (and, of course, possible for an older gamer to behave immaturely) people do associate the less... pleasant behaviour we see in-game with these youngsters. There are certainly a few people on my server who I would never have in my guild, based purely upon their actions and behaviour... but I don't know that they are kids... they could just be really stupid older teens... or even older.
End of the day, I try to base it on a person-to-person basis. Spend some time with people, get to know them, and base your opinion of that person on their actions... not their age or any other factor. My advice to our younger friend is to find a guild or a group of players with the same goals, and the same mentality as yourself. If people are going to exclude you purely because of your age... screw them. But continue to act with matiruty, decency and common sense and you will be snapped up by a decent guild in no time.
Hurode Jun 25th 2008 4:46AM
I'm not sure about other people, but online I use the term "kids" or "kiddies" to refer to people who just generally act immature or fit that stereotype. I don't strictly apply it to young players - hell, I'm only 17 myself. I just use the term to refer to anyone who acts like one. It certainly beats "noob".
Tsagadai Jun 25th 2008 3:14AM
I remember in one of my old guilds raiding for the third or fourth time ever and we discovered via ventrilo that our main tank was only 8. It had never occurred to us that he was so young until he spoke. He ended up quitting the guild a few weeks later (because he had to go back to school) but he was a surprisingly competent tank. Age is only a limitation for the egomaniacs who fear being shown up by a younger player; the crude who can't keep the vent conversation out of the gutter; and those who hold other prejudices as well.
Heilig Jun 25th 2008 3:30AM
I'm pretty sure his age won't continue to be a problem. Time has a way of fixing that particular issue.
Siara Jun 25th 2008 3:32AM
Indeed. There's very big difference to our younger players behavior. Some are really acting like kids, but there is also those where you would never believe that their actually that young. Personally I don't care about peoples age, They could be 10, and i wouldn't care as long they know how to play the game and speak friendly to other players.
Lanth Jun 25th 2008 4:49AM
As long as the young raider has proven himself a competent and reliable raider (ie little to no "afk gotta put the trash out"), he should'nt get kicked out because of his age.
The one good exception I've heard is teenagers not being allowed to raid by the guild when they have important exams coming up.
Kila Jun 25th 2008 5:24AM
My Guild is very causal and we do allow younger players to join however on the flip side of this only 1 out of about 20 we might invite seems to be mature enough. One of our best healers is only 16 however he tells us that he needs time to study for exmas or starting collage. That's fine. Hell we have a worse time with immature players using the guild line to talk crap all the time and question the officers of the guild!
Endjinn Jun 25th 2008 9:57AM
It's not just 'maturity' which is an issue here.
One former guild of mine had an 18+ policy simply because guild chat could, at times, be somewhat 'adult' in terms of topics and language used.
It seemed to our GM that a parent or guardian could see some of the material as 'highly inapproriate' or worse...
I'm sure there are laws in some countries/states in terms of the way you interact with people under a certain age - so by making it clear you do not accept younger members (e.g. making them lie on their application in a way that can later be proved), you are showing that you've made a reasonable effort to ensure you members are adults.
Has no-one here heard the Teamspeak recording where a kid is trying to proposition an older female member and everyone is desperately trying to change the topic?
In an ever-more-paranoid world where people believe there to be child abusers/online predators around every corner - having a minimum age is just one method of protecting yourself against possible repercussions I guess.
Gen Jun 25th 2008 10:08AM
Ya but if you're in a hardcore raiding guild and a kid is ready gear/skillwise you have to expect a minimum level of maturity. Besides, I myself being young in this era of awsomeness can tell you that sex jokes , and swearing are nothing. Also, its perfectly possible to join a mature conversation. After spending around 2 years on vent with adults, there's nothing that sets me apart.
Hua Jun 25th 2008 8:36AM
To put it simply, if someone else is in charge of when you can play, when you have to go to bed, or when you can use the computer, my guild doesn't need the trouble. Doesn't matter if it's because you're a kid, or a hen-pecked husband.
Wulf Jun 25th 2008 8:50AM
Guilds should just accept people based on their own merits. I've met plenty of adults in real life and in-game who were far less mature than some teenagers. Age is no reflection on character.
Kyudo Jun 25th 2008 9:21AM
Just to make a note her but...
I'm sure many adults play WoW to get /away/ from the kids, if you know what I mean.
The other thing is--how do you /ever/ have a conversation? I'm pretty sure a teenager talking in a guild of adults about his issues in his classroom or with his parents would do nothing but irritate the older members.
Not to mention, wouldn't that alienate him? Not having someone to talk to... I don't see why a kid would want to be stuck with a bunch of adults--I know that if I were that young, I'd be staying far away from "The Man".
Just my 2 cents.
Daddywarbuck of Farstriders Jun 25th 2008 10:32AM
Its only in modern America teens spend that much time ONLY with people of their own age.
In times past and for many people who work alot in the US, it was quite common for children and teens to know tons of adults on an adult level.
It is GREAT to talk with teens as adults and adults as people. You'd be surprised how much like you a 15 year old is once he realizes you have some essential differences in your life.
Kyudo Jun 25th 2008 11:34AM
A 15 year old won't be able to talk to me about pleasing the wife, what stocks to invest in, nor will he be be able to understand the frustration of paying off college loans.
And I personally, do not care about what grade he got in his math class, or the cute girl sitting behind him.
Your point is moot, as we're living in the /now/, not the years past. Kids of the past are not kids of today. The world has changed, and unfortunately--so has the age discrepancy.
You want to talk about the past? Kids used to work in factories to help support their family. Kids married younger. School violence was at most playground fights, not bring-in-rifles-and-slaughter-your-classmates.
The times have changed. Sorry.
Reddeth Jun 25th 2008 2:14PM
@ Kyudo -
"A 15 year old won't be able to talk to me about ... what stocks to invest in,"
Actually, that 15-year-old is just hitting a key marketing demographic. Getting to know such a person might very well key you in to some good stocks to pick.
Kyudo Jun 25th 2008 2:18PM
Haha.
How pragmatic of you. :P