WWI '08 Panel: Rogues
by Michael Gray 
Jun 28th 2008 at 5:30PM
The big news from WWI so far for rogues is focused around two things: picking up a little AE damage and getting more use out of Sap. Both hints came from Tom Chilton during this morning's WWI dev panel, when he spoke to a large swath of class changes and balance issues.The inspiration for the new area effect damage ability comes from Warcraft's Wardens -- Fan of Knives. As part of Blizzard's attempt to bring the lore and history of the game forward, they look to previous abilities and lore to inform current changes. Fan of Knives seemed like a natural ability to help give rogues a little extra AE damage. While Chilton cautions us not to expect Rogues to become the kings of AE damage...this will may be a welcome addition to our bags of tricks. It could certainly help in a pinch, but we'll have to see how it's going to meld with crowd control powers.
Where Rogues should feel some relief is the additional consideration given to Sap. Chilton's looking for Sap to play a greater role in crowd control strategies, and having it apply to more mobs. To paraphrase, Sap's going to apply to anything with a skull, and a brain to then rattle around inside of it. We may see ourselves sapping dogs, cats, bears, and. . .well anything with a brain inside a skull. So maybe not oozes quite yet - we're just going to have to satisfy ourselves with killing those.
I think a lot of the Rogue information we're curious about will actually come up during tomorrow's PvP section, since it's the Rogue's Arena capabilities that's seen so much forum action lately. Like Mages, we just haven't gotten the same amount of screen time as Death Knights or Shamans. Still, here's hoping we see more soon.
Filed under: Rogue, Analysis / Opinion, Blizzard, News items, Classes, Worldwide Invitational
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
rick gregory Jun 28th 2008 5:48PM
I want the see what they do to make daggers really useful again. And, while the sap change is nice... unless it's possible to apply in combat.. meh. Me, I still want a blowdart - ranged CC!
Warlock Jun 28th 2008 6:40PM
I dunno, the Sap changes are kind of a "so what" thing. They are making a shitty form of CC work on more stuff... doesn't change the fact that it SUCKS, just that now we are hoping more stuff doesn't see us from stealth, or people don't aggro before the sap on more targets.
Kolo Jun 28th 2008 9:39PM
I hate to say it, but ...
l2p nab
Balius Jun 28th 2008 8:24PM
If you can't stealth, you're just a bad player. You have plenty of warning when mobs see you, they turn to look at you, they change stance, they even make a noise. Don't complain about being seen as a problem of sapping from stealth.
A wider variety of sapped targets means more usability for sapping. Sure, a mage's polymorph keeps a mob out of combat for longer, but it doesn't work on undead. Adding some more CC to fights that sheep won't work on is hardly nothing, and sapping helps tremendously in getting through trash even now. Adding more versatility is a big deal, and makes rogues that much more desirable in small group instances.
I'd like to either see proximity damage from bosses disappear or melee DPS getting a damage boost to reflect the additional danger they're in. Adding some AoE to rogues is a start to making melee dps beneficial, but I really think that people need a reason to want to take someone up close and personal, and hope the sweeping changes of the expansion are used to give people one.
Warlock Jun 29th 2008 11:59AM
Sap won't work on Undead either. Unless the latest Alpha build is wrong.
Gerb Jun 28th 2008 10:02PM
"Anything with a brain inside it's skull"...
...That means we can't use it on most players anymore :(
doyesac Jun 28th 2008 10:29PM
And a few minutes of listening to /Trade is enough to know most Players deserve it.
Richard Jun 28th 2008 10:10PM
Screw all of this.
I'd give anything for them to make Eviscerate finally scale properly.
My crit Sinister Strikes should NOT be beating my crit Eviscerates on trash; ever.
The sap changes are nice, sure, but meh.
And seriously! Make daggers comparable to swords on DPS. My Shard of Azzinoth just sits there in the bank, waiting for me to take it out to play.
YPEELS40 Jun 29th 2008 12:09AM
i kinda agree with you, but hey mutilate keeps looking nicer and nicer.
vey_kos Jun 29th 2008 3:51AM
Am I the only one that heard "We are going to make daggers really powerfull in WotlK" ?..
Summer Jun 29th 2008 5:17AM
We heard it, we just don't believe it.
hellshire Jun 29th 2008 8:37AM
Mutilate was buffed to the point where there is serious discussion if it will overtake combat as the new prime dps spec.
Now that Windfury is becoming a buff instead of a weapon buff, thanks to a new poison talent you'll be able to roll with 4 poisons for the price of 2. The talent cut to the chase will let rogues work evis/envenom into their rotations and the 51 point assassination talent is essentially 15% extra damage + an energy refund if theres a dot of any sort on you.
And I haven't even gotten into the pvp dagger stuff in sub...
ben.tomlin Jun 29th 2008 10:55PM
Take a look at the wrath wiki talent trees for mutilate.
mutilate will be the pve form for daggers'
with its new talents it makes keeping SnD up almost automatic, and you get to keep it up by using envenom which is just amazing.
And since mutilate is built upon crit for CP generation then the new crit energy regen will be much better since assassination will still lack combat potency.
my grips however is that duel wield needs to be moved up the tree so that DW and dagger spec can be obtained, and trade something out of assassination into subtelty for oppurtunity, and i guarantee that mut will be THE damage choice for raiding rogues.
The only problems with this is that hit and crit needs to be relatively balanced so that mutilate rogues can socket for crit and combat rogues can socket for hit.
kidsmoke Jun 29th 2008 10:56PM
ake a look at the wrath wiki talent trees for mutilate.
mutilate will be the pve form for daggers'
with its new talents it makes keeping SnD up almost automatic, and
you get to keep it up by using envenom which is just amazing.
And since mutilate is built upon crit for CP generation then the new
crit energy regen will be much better since assassination will still
lack combat potency.
my grips however is that duel wield needs to be moved up the tree so
that DW and dagger spec can be obtained, and trade something out of
assassination into subtelty for oppurtunity, and i guarantee that mut
will be THE damage choice for raiding rogues.
The only problems with this is that hit and crit needs to be
relatively balanced so that mutilate rogues can socket for crit and
combat rogues can socket for hit.
kidsmoke Jun 29th 2008 10:58PM
sorry for the strange double post. my other account bugged out or something : )
Shrama Jun 30th 2008 4:09AM
It would be nice to be able to re-sap already sapped target during combat and without stealth - it would boost PvE CC and it makes sense - the target is already sapped and it can't see us coming to hit him again...
Hudders Jun 30th 2008 5:57AM
I want to be able to apply poisons to ranged weaponry.
Why can we not do that yet? A thrown dagger with crippling or mind-numbing poison would be a fantastic addition to the arsenal.
Loudfiero Jun 30th 2008 7:24AM
Uh...FIX VANISH!
Secondly, I would like to dip arrows, bulltes and THROWN weapons with crippling poison or a new "stunning" poison. This would effect the ammo itself, not the gun or bow so as not to replace a scope.
Hunters, mages, druids and locks can kite far too easily and it would be nice to have a way to slow them down like they do us rogues...especially when you don't have any combo points up to use Deadly Throw with.
This would also give the rogue more usefulness as a ranged dps'er...obviously never as good as a mage to hunter, but atleast a rogue could be quasi-useful when he needs to be far away from melee range due to a dead healer and low health...
LOL, but this is coming from a rogue who likes to do it all. I've tanked most of Sethekk stacking dodge/agility gear...
Dranaerys Jun 30th 2008 8:39AM
No offense, but the defining characteristic of a Rogue is great melee dps, range should never really come into it. We already have deadly throw to slow down opponents from a distance so we can run in and shiv some crippling, but to want to DPS at a range for a Rogue is like asking a to buff mages so they can do decent DPS with a sword.
Real rogue issues are mobility and dagger specs, both of which are thankfully being addressed, though I'd still love to some something like a slowly-filling "sprint bar", so you dont waste 10 secs of sprint when you really only need 3 to move in and out of dangerous spots.
Loudfiero Jun 30th 2008 9:41AM
No, I'm not asking to give it high or even modest ranged DPS, just to make it more useful for when you have to run away from melee range but still want to help out but poisoning mobs...
You also ignore the fact that I mentioned Deadly Throw doesn't work when you get hit first and are kited. Hence, Crippling Poison on a thrown would help overcome that. Ofcourse that's why I'm an engineer, but maintaining an inventory of bombs is expensive...
I like your SPRINT idea....