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All of the latest Mists of Pandaria newsForum post of the day: A crushing blow to Warriors?
by Amanda Dean 
Jul 11th 2008 at 3:00AM
Due to itemization and abilities, Warrior and Paladin tanks currently have a greater ability to avoid Crushing Blows than Druid tanks. In the near future, this may become a moot point. Khurg of Spirestone, a Tauren Warrior, worries that Warrior tanks may become somewhat obsolete with the removal of Crushing Blows from boss mobs and a potential thirty second cool down on Shield Block. He asked "What will be the purpose of defense in WotLK ?" The following response from Rawglrlrgll of Lothar was that the defense statistic prevents critical strikes and still buffs the chance for avoidance.
A discussion ensued about the role of tanks in Wrath of the Lich King. Fungus of Altar of Storms responded that each of the four tanking classes in Wrath will have separate foci. Warriors will be mitigation tanks that rely on evasion at the armor cap. Paladins will have less armor than Warriors, but will continue to AoE tank. Death Knights are slated to rely on resistances for tanking. Druids will become less viable as main tanks, but will still serve as off tanks. This is seen by many Druids as getting "the shaft."
Some suggested taking a passive approach until Wrath is released, but others feel that if they don't speak out now, changes won't come until months after the expansion. From what we've seen of Wrath so far, do you think the face of tanking is about to be changed forever?
Filed under: Druid, Paladin, Warrior, Raiding, Death Knight, Forum Post of the Day
Reader Comments (Page 4 of 5)
bill Jul 11th 2008 10:25AM
I think the part that gets people all in a tizzy is the fact that warriors are the *only* real choice for progression tanking raid bosses -- and that is by GAME DESIGN. That was the design choice made a few years ago by the dev team...it was intentional.
Maybe a prot pally *could* tank that boss just as well BUT he brings off-healing (which is ALWAYS good); same with the druid. What does a prot war offer when NOT MT'ing a boss..maybe keping demo and tclap up. That's it. That's one reason why RL's prefer prot wars. They just don't have any utility outside of being a meat shield.
I sometimes just think Blizz should have had a better class descriptions.
Shealtiel Jul 11th 2008 10:27AM
In the first case, let's dispense with this pointless prattle about how Druids are a "hybrid" class. What is a hybrid? It is a class that can do more than one thing. We can stick different suffixes to that definition, but the basic truth remains the same. By that definition, our "classic hybrids" (Druids, Shaman, and Paladins) are, in fact, not the only hybrids in the game. Priests can DPS or heal. Warriors can DPS or tank. Soon, with the introduction of the Wrath of the Licking, Death Knights will be able to DPS or tank. The only "pure" classes in the game are our DPS friends--the Mage, Rogue, Warlock, and Hunter--none of which can tank or heal.
Don't you dare come to me and say that Druids shouldn't be as good of a tank because they're hybrids. I can apply that same argument to any role for any such hybrid class--that is, any class (including Warrior) that can accomplish more than one thing.
Furthermore, I have very little patience for Warriors in general. I won't deny that there are phenomenally skilled Warrior tanks worth their weight in gold. (Though technically, as a virtual being, they have no weight, but that's neither here nor there). The problem is that the vast majority of the Warrior class--at least judging by the profuse whining I hear--is composed of "Rogues in plate" who either care only for the DPS role or haven't the skill to face complicated tanking scenarios.
I can't believe I'm about to use this expression, but in the min/max world of the end-game, the classic hybrids (Paladins, Shaman, and Druids) are still viewed as nerfed in anything except healing. This is a dinosaur's view of the world. By the same argument against hybrids, they should be lacking in healing ability compared to a Priest. Yet every good raid team knows that a good healing team carries diversity.
In fact, this whole argument is an issue of diversity. Blizzard seems set on having a separate niche for each tank in raid content--which seems threatening to Warriors because progression tanking has been their almost exclusive domain.
More than just this diversity, though, it's the notion that there should be flexibility for raids--and players--with acquiring tanks. Why shouldn't there be four classes equally capable of tanking, yet each with their own speciality? What if, God forbid, the Warrior would love a night off to just DPS? If the Druid cannot tank in his stead, the Warrior's lot is determined. What if, by some stretch of the imagination, the geared Tankadin is unable to attend raids for a week? The guild must forgo raiding in his absense.
As for the elimination of the crushing mechanic, which began this whole discussion, I applaud it. I don't like any gimmick mechanic--be it crushing blows or huge magic direct damage that pretty much requires a shield to reflect--that limits the diversity of tanks and the flexibility of groups when approaching encounters. The ability for more classes to tank effectively--particularly in progression--is a boon to all players of the game. This is not some zero-sum game where somebody else's benefit is to your detriment. That's a childish outlook on life, and it's time that you moved beyond it.
Blondenough Jul 11th 2008 3:18PM
"In fact, this whole argument is an issue of diversity. Blizzard seems set on having a separate niche for each tank in raid content--which seems threatening to Warriors because progression tanking has been their almost exclusive domain"
I think the issue most warriors have is that they are the least flexible of all the tanking classes, its not an issue of jealousy, of other classes infringing on their turf, it is an issue of having diminished importance in one area with seemingly no hints at equivalent compensation in others.
Aden Nak Jul 11th 2008 10:45AM
It IS getting the shaft, from the Druid perspective. If Bearform tanking isn't raid boss viable, and Catform DPS completely undesirable in that same raid, what functionality is there for a Feral Druid? Being the "best tank" for 5-man content is not a niche. That's kind of like saying that Mages should be happy because it's easy for them to kill Hogger.
What this smacks of, to me, is Blizzard continuing to not itemize for Feral Druids - only this time they're not even going to bother to pick up the slack afterward. With three plate-tanking classes in the game instead of two, Druids are likely being marginalized for developmental convenience.
Hell, before Blizzard patched in some leatherworking recipies, the best pre-Tier Druid tanking chestpiece in BC came from a quest in Hellfire Peninsula. And even then, the Heavy Clefthoof was a blue and felt like it until you either downed Mag or (eventually) got badge loot. And at that point, you're pretty much socketing for Defense.
In short, Druid itemization for tanking is pretty much still a mess, and the fear is that Blizzard is just saying, "Screw it! Make 'em tank trash."
darian Jul 11th 2008 10:46AM
Let's consider an interesting possibility, what if there is no defense in the expansion?
The precedent is there, defense has been removed from all relevant talents in favor of dodge. The effects this would have on itemization and even tanking roles would be immense.
The most obvious side effect is that while Blizzard has removed crushing blows, all tanks would be subject to the 5.6% chance to be crit. With defense gone and resilience made null in PvE, there would be nothing to do but suck it up and take critical strikes. Only Druids would be uncrittable with Survival of the Fittest.
So Druids would be the premier physical mitigation tanks, having massive armor and no potential for damage spikes.
This would vastly alleviate the conern that Druids will be getting sidelined in WotLK. No one is going to look down on a tank that can completely avoid nasty bouts with the RNG.
Ravenblight Jul 11th 2008 11:10AM
And you in 5 short paragraphs just reversed roles for top tank position with warriors... something i think people for the most part would rather avoid having one class to be the premier(sp) boss tank
darkra Jul 11th 2008 10:50AM
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A well geared feral druid is running around with 35K armor, 60% dodge at least if you don't downgrade to your stam set you will be rage starved when tanking 5 mans and heroics.
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What you describe is overgearing the encounter. In that case of course, everyone would get rage starved. And honestly, I don't care about 5mans, I;m talking endgame. I'm talking Felmyst, with a 2.5 attack speed, where a dodge or parry leaves me with no rage for 5 seconds, as my whites cannot be counted as rage generation, while a druid's can almost cover him on their own.
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As for warriors getting "the shaft" when every freaking boss stops dropping plate and goodies for warrior you can talk. When you face dead end itemization then you can talk. When warriors have the worst scaling in the game then they can talk. I love how you guys always talk as if you got the shaft when Blizzard bends over backwards to make sure you are catered for.
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Itemization for druids is much better than it was pre-BC. And sorry that my class is item dependand while yours relies on the utility your forms give you. More gear drops for warriors cause warriors NEED gear to compete with other classes.
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> a thunderclap for casters
BS. I have no thunderclap. I've got a crappy bash on a 60-second cooldown.
Your Shield Bash? 12 seconds.
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Check the new talents, it's called Infected Wounds.
Anyway, I think you miss the point... you talk about gear while I talk about utility. I don't know if you raided preBC, but druids that tried to tank were laughting stock, you gained a lot of ground, and have become better than warriors in many an encounter... and I'll give you a quick example:
Illidan. I'm maintanking and we use a druid and a warrior with FR gear for p2. At p1 the druid is at cat for and dpses. At p2 he pops to bear, and tanks one of the adds, taking only slightly more damage than the warrior tank, and creating roughly the same threat. On p3 and onward, he truns again into a cat and dpses, of course combatressing someone if the proverbial sh!t hit the fan. At the end, he has 3 times more dps than the warrior FR tank.
And I wonder... what raid leader wouldn't take 2 druids as FR tanks on Illidan?
This is just one of the many examples I can give you on endgame.
Also note, Blizzard is not unaware of that. They purposely add abilities that require a shield (deaden at RoS, shear on Illidan etc) to force a place for protection warriors in raids.
wild Jul 11th 2008 11:23AM
"Itemization for druids is much better than it was pre-BC. And sorry that my class is item dependand while yours relies on the utility your forms give you. More gear drops for warriors cause warriors NEED gear to compete with other classes."
That's because you don't understand druids at all we are more gear reliant because unlike you we need gear to make up for our build it limitations like paws not scaling past 60. That gear enables you to outpace us in every single category endgame.
"Anyway, I think you miss the point... you talk about gear while I talk about utility. I don't know if you raided preBC, but druids that tried to tank were laughting stock, you gained a lot of ground, and have become better than warriors in many an encounter... and I'll give you a quick example:"
gimmick encounters you will forgive me if I brush off your example. That's like saying because druids can't tank illlidan they are useless. Also take a look at your WOTLK talents blizzard is bloody well giving you everything on a silver plater. AOE tanking, rage from block/parry and much much more. Again you guys bitching and moaning about being outpaced is like a fat kid in a candy store complaining.
resonance Jul 11th 2008 12:12PM
People who think a feral druid does good DPS after switching from tank to kitty midfight are clueless. A tank set will do at best 60% of what a proper DPS set could offer, which gets progressively worse relative to what "pure" DPS class can do. When I can OT an easier add in my DPS set such as the Lurker fight, there's nothing stopping a Fury warrior from doing the same thing and providing better DPS. Easy adds are easy, their worse TPS and damage mitigation aren't noticed.
My guild is working on Illidan right now, and I'm one of the FR tanks. I'm doing a whole 430 dps per attempt, while everyone else is comfortably pulling 1700-1800 dps (people are holding back because FR gear has no TPS stats).
If, for some reason, I could do the fight in my pure DPS gear, I'd expect to do 1200 dps at best, because of Illidan's not that melee friendly on top of my class's poor scaling.
Verit Jul 11th 2008 10:54AM
As a healer I won't miss crushing blows one bit... Nothing makes my heart sink faster than seeing a tank essentially one shot - where there wasn't a thing I could do about it.
Prince comes to mind - end of phase two - things are seemingly ok, tank is topped off, fully hotted and I'm still casting back to back regrowth and all of the sudden boom - tank dead.
Grim Reaper shows the tank being hit back to back in the space of 2-3 seconds for 5k a pop. Doesn't seem especially fair...
Ravenblight Jul 11th 2008 11:52AM
I wasnt ever a fan of Crushing blows myself and thought of it as a poor game mechanic.
I have seen tanks die in 1-3 seconds from consecutive crushing blows (shield block on cooldown) and unless you are either spamming the tank or incredibly lucky (most likely a combination of both) its nearly impossible to Save a tank from that spike dmg.
I dunno i just never found gimmicks like that "fun"
Ravenblight Jul 11th 2008 11:59AM
"In fact, this whole argument is an issue of diversity. Blizzard seems....(erased everything inbetween to save space).... The guild must forgo raiding in his absense.
Extremely well put /bow
"The ability for more classes to tank effectively--particularly in progression--is a boon to all players of the game. "
I think that warriors just feel threatened because for the first time since the game came out suddenly they are being challenged for a role they were in sole possession of for all these years. Most of them cant see beyond themselves though which is where all the QQ comes from.
I think that these changes are for the better for everyone involved as it gives players more options and will also (and i think this is part of Blizzards intent as well) will help with the Tank shortage that most servers seem to be having.
Morcego Jul 11th 2008 4:59PM
Being the only druid tank in my guild, I will have to agree with the previous poster about warrior being the "best" tanks. Which is not necessarily a bad thing (or a good one either).
A good raiding guild needs no more and no less than 2 druid tanks. Same for Pally tanks. It needs no less than 2 warrior tank too, but notice the lack of "no more".
So warrior are, as a rule of thumb, better MTs than druids. So what ? Druids are better OTs. I for one am proud of it. I can OT my target, then switch to cat an help DPSing. Or stop DPSing to combatrez that priest that got killed, innervate him, then go back to dpsing.
Pally tanks can hold much better group aggro, making them specially suitable for trash tanking. So what ? When they are not tanking, they can still buff, cleanse etc.
Both Paladins and Druids are multidimentional classes. They can have other roles when not tanking (even when tank specced). I pity prot warrior EXACTLY because they are the "best" tanks. When they are not tanking, they can just sit and enjoy a beer. To be able to do anything else, they have to go and respec.
If the only thing you want to do is tanking, go roll a warrior. If you are a druid, get used to carrying 2 or 4 sets of gear with you. If you are a paladin, get used to carrying 100s of reagents. Don't get stuck in the "tanking" mindset. You are more than that.
I never had a warrior, and don't plan on having one. They are way too unidimentional for me. While I know great prot and fury warriors, that is just not my thing.
Me ? I'm happy carrying my 3 sets of gear (tanking, dps and healing) on all raids. Since I'm mainly a tank, I will never be top dps or top healing, but I can help supplement whatever is needed for the moment (that "just a bit more" that is often needed).
If you are a prot warrior, understand you will be the best tank for most of the encounters, or at least as good as the other options. If you are not a warrior, enjoy the different roles you can fill with your toon.
Salty Jul 11th 2008 12:19PM
My biggest annoyance with tanks lately has been the dumb jock ‘materialistic’ mentality that your gear is your skill level. Really a tank needs to be doing a lot more than just acting as a meat shield, and getting uncrittable is /just/ the beginning. Hell, getting one tanking set is not even the beginning – you should work on a 5-6% hit-capped, uncrittable, expertise-rich threat set for trash for snap aggro, no misses on taunt, rage gen on weak caster-type mobs (hell for druids even resilience is good for tanking caster type mobs), then a set for maximum avoidance, a set for maximum mitigation and survivability. You should have a DPS set on hand so you’re not useless when it’s a straight 1-on-1 tank and spank. Put all of these sets into Outiffter or Item Rack so you can switch without digging through your bags or with a second’s notice. You should have a heavy compliment of consumables, stam food, appropriate flasks/elixirs, resist pots, free action pots (to make you immune to stuns, knockdowns, etc), nightmare seeds or anything else that can help out.
The tank sets the pace. He makes the executive decisions on kill order and it shouldn’t be any other way. He needs to be aware of every trash mob, boss and its abilities (stuns, cleaves, etc), ready to respond and knowing when to position a mob away from the party, whether you should ask for an OT to build threat for when you’re stunned, etc. He needs to be ready to taunt an uncontrolled mob and hold it, because for whatever reason the CC didn’t work, was afk or if you need any reason at all – you don’t want your healers to die… do something about it. The tank can’t be a keyboard turner and a clicker, he’s got to swing his viewport around and mash two mouse buttons for movement, pounding the living hell out of his heavily macro’d key bindings with rage burn macros (Heroic Strike is your friend), intercept/assist/taunt/shield bash mashkey, stance dancing, etc. He should be able to get 3k threat in the first second.
One of my biggest annoyances is when we’re fighting a trash pack and killing one mob – the main tank has threat and the DPS are burning it down, both of the tanks are wailing on it, but the off-tank is trying to build and pull threat for some stupid reason. That off-tank needs to be whacking on the mob just to generate enough rage so it can grab the next kill target, breaking CC as soon as the 1st is 5 or 6 seconds from being dead so the DPS can just roll right over without threat issues. The main-tank will follow up with #3 and so on, leap-frogging every mob. Dead time for the DPSers is wasted time, wasted procs, and two tanks on a mob is absolutely pointless unless there’s a hateful strikes, split cleaves, stuns, knockbacks, etc. This is what makes a good off-tank – and accept it if you’re an off-tank instead of the main tank… don’t go against the grain of the raid leader’s plan, a good off-tank is smart and helpful, ready to taunt a couple mobs off the MT if he’s getting hit by too many, ready to listen on vent, taunt and hold the next kill target, even if you haven’t been on it thus far, realize that you and him are swapping back and forth between MT and OT for the duration of the pull.
Tanks should be aware of stability in positioning – get your mob positioned fast and keep still - because the melee are running around like coked-up chipmunks trying to figure out where the hell the rear end of the boss is (and not doing very much DPS) or worse, swinging at his front side causing parry-thrashes that can kill you in an instant, getting cleaved or generally just leaving their backs exposed to him to be one-shot with no chance to dodge.
Tanks should not be shy to blow their cooldowns in a pinch. The very dumbest thing you can do is ask over ventrillo (or worse, typing it out in chat – you’re supposed to be doing more important things with your hands) whether you should use your cooldowns… most times you’re dead by the time the question hits my ears. You really just need to stay alive, because a wipe on trash is dumb and unless you’re MTing the next boss, who hits like supernova, your cooldowns are just for that.
Tunnel vision is the worst thing for a tank, staring at the mob’s chest the whole fight is pointless. Swing your camera 180 degrees, zoom all the way out (and use /console SET cameraMaxFactor "4"), Look around, see what’s going on, expect the worst. Holding aggro on a mob is easy, use the other 95% of your brain for seeking out other opportunities to prevent deaths or expedite the fight at hand. Be smart, think of every ability in your arsenal. Check your buffs, are you missing fort? Did your pallies buff your DPS warriors with Salv and forgot to mention it to you to click it off? Is your pally using Crusader in your group instead of devo? Watch Omen, call out when your DPS’ aggro spikes. Be set up to check the combat log for what killed you so you can be a part of diagnosing the issue.
Whatever it is, don’t just show up to the raid in your big metal suit and ask to have a mob put in front of you.
I don’t even own a warrior, but I’ve heard enough bitching from both sides to recognize what makes a good one.
Ravenblight Jul 11th 2008 12:33PM
Did you even read the article?
Beyond that most of what you're saying is true though it has nothing to do with the topic at hand. Most Tanks at least the good ones know all this already
The Max camera things doesnt always work like you may think it does Some bosses visibility is very low no matter where your camera is postioned and the Distance ratio makes no difference (in this case)
Ravenblight Jul 11th 2008 2:18PM
Another thing i feel i should mention about your post
"I don’t even own a warrior, but I’ve heard enough bitching from both sides to recognize what makes a good one"
Easy to judge people when you havent even been in their shoes right? Have you ever even tanked before?
Having heard arguments from both sides doesnt make you a better judge of talent... theres alot of things that go into being a tank that you really dont understand until you have played one. (well for most people anyway)
The most important cooldowns for tank range from 8 min (last stand(warrior)) to 1hr (Lay on Hands(paladin)) (note that shield wall is on a 30 min cooldown) which is why tanks have a hard time deciding when it is ABSOLUTELY necessary to use these abilities.
Most Good tanks make use of it at the right time but i am 100% sure that those tanks have also used them when they really didnt need to, wasting it before they actually needed it becaus ethey thought they had no choice.
Your perspective on tanks seems to be very limited. Most issues (i'd say 99% of the time) on trash when aggro drop is not part of the equation, is because of some over zealous dpser who thinks he/she knows everything about tanking and isnt smart enough to pay attention to their own threat/omen.
A good tank can call out when a dpser threat spikes but in the end the person who should really be paying attention to that is the Dpser themselves, it's not really the Tanks responsibility to make sure that the dpser is paying attention to their own threat.
Dps Threat scales, Tanks threat doesnt scale that well and it's designed that way intentionally.
Basically from your explantion of a good tank they are the ones doing everything well everyone is just sitting back and enjoying themselves. It's explanation like yours and the mentality like that that causes Tanks to go through the Burnouts they experience... you think it is a coincidence that Tanks have the highest burnout rate when the majority of people think the way you do?
It's easy to say good tank should do this and that when in fact it has nothing to do with being a tank in the first place(most of it anyway)...it's about being a skilled player, anyone can make those callouts etc
It's really unfair to expect the tank to:
1) Pay attention to his threat as well as the dpsers
2) Pay attention to all the mobs around him and check if they are running to a dpser because a) they over aggroed b) broke cc c) didnt follow the kill order the only person i think a tank should watch out for is a healer...that is it
3) Paying attention to all their Global cooldowns, while trying to maintain their highest threat rotation
4) Calling out everything on Vent
5) etc etc tec
They arent the only ones in the raid god forbid someone else take on some of the responsibility for stuff going on... i mean it just easier to sit back and let someone else do it...especially someone who already has one of the if not the most important role which encompasses alof of things to pay attention to already.
Salty Jul 11th 2008 6:53PM
I have a feral druid alt who has tanked plenty up through T4 (Mag/KHM/Gruul), though not as progressed as my main, I only brought him off the shelf in TBC when I got the picture from raiding on my main. I wouldn’t have even attempted tanking if I thought I would be a weak link by lack of understanding all of the expectations upon him, making an ass of myself in front of my friends and going in over my head. Even before I brought him back, I leveled a healer and spent a lot of time raiding with him. So I like to think I have experienced most of the game from the three major perspectives and I’m familiar with the triangle of expectations. I have had some fantastic models for really good tanks, and these are the qualities I decided I would pursue and the qualities those tanks look for in others when we need an extra.
Knowing when to use cooldowns is the reason I emphasize awareness and knowledge of trash mobs and bosses. If you’re clueless, how would you know when a 30 minute cooldown is safe to use? You could pop your shield wall, allowing the attempt to recover and spare your raid a 5 minutes graveyard run and re-buff if you knew for a fact that you wouldn’t need your shield wall in the encounters immediately ahead, or if you were wise about the encounter, you might save your cooldown even when it goes south if you know you cannot recover from a loss of a key player. If that death is the difference between taking an extra boss out that night, you should be headstrong about using it at the right time. Or maybe you can count on your raid and find that you can use those cooldowns creatively to shave a little time off the run.
Knowing that a mob is going to stun you and run away for 3 or 4 seconds (though that’s being nerfed soon), can give you the heads up to take a free action pot or call for an OT. Knowing that you may threat-cap the raid on trash, causing a cumulative loss of time over the course of the night, could spur you to strap on some lighter gear to generate more rage, hit capped for lv71s with expertise to ensure more of your hits land though you’ll still want a load of stam and be uncrittable. Maybe even ask another healer to keep an eye on you. This is a proactive solution, and it’s an action you can take upon yourself rather than asking 14 others to change their style.
As far as TPS and zealous DPSers, there’s plenty of room in WoW for dainty tanks and DPSers who haven’t learned to use a threat meter, but not in a raid where you’re working against a timer or trying to get through X many bosses in Y many hours; Zul’Aman bear runs are the gold standard. In T6, a tank’s job is to be cocky and sure of himself, practiced, experienced and hopefully theorycrafted to the teeth. A DPSer should have passed the gauntlet of idiot checks and should be thouroughly familiar with threat meters. Healers should know their strengths and limits and volunteer them readily when given their role as well as when to walk the straight and narrow of their assignment and when to stray for the win. If your DPSers are pulling aggro, act accordingly, if your tank is threat-capping the raid… act accordingly. If you’re doing what you’re supposed to, you should always be doing everything well and if your raid is worth the time so is everybody else.
I said that tanks set the pace of the instance, and this is where cockyness and confidence come into the picture. Nothing is worse than standing around during a raid, 30 seconds is fine, 1 minute is a long time, 2 minutes and you start losing people to smoke breaks. A solid tank can keep everybody on their toes and keep it moving to get through a lot more content a lot faster. If everybody in the raid has their eyes on you because the next pull could be coming at any moment, you’re doing it right. In turn, you should be watching the mana bars of your healers, and judging when you /can/ do a pull, rather than waiting for the raid to top off every time you leave combat and your raid leader to verbally poke you. If your raid sees more bosses, they will reciprocate the effort, they’ll move up to the next pull spot before sitting down to drink, they’ll keep oils and food buffs up for trash, they’ll get used to the tempo and pace themselves for longevity. They’ll feel bad when they screw up and slow down the train, they’ll learn from each other’s mistakes vicariously and push each other to new heights through competitiveness.
At the simple, technical core of the tank-healer-dps equation the goal is to do enough damage to exceed the health pool of your opponent. In this balance of relationships, the tank has two jobs: set the upper boundary for DPS and ease the healing load through ample defenses. The damage dealer’s job is to make good use of that boundary by surfing it closely without exceeding it and occupying as little of the healer’s effort as possible by self-preservation. The healer’s job is to ensure that the upper boundary of DPS doesn’t suddenly disappear through the loss of the tank and that the lower boundary of DPS doesn’t drop below the threshold of success though the loss of DPS.
I know I’m being captain obvious, but I wanted to illustrate that outside of these parameters, raid bosses are mostly gimmicks and are designed to test part or all of this triangle. When everybody is thoroughly skilled and aware of their own capability combined with a little theorycrafting, anything is possible.
Bill Jul 11th 2008 12:58PM
The problem with warriors and tanking isn't that it's only been OUR job for so long, it's that it's been our ONLY job for so long. I'd be happy to turn the tanking reins over to another class, just give us some viability in the arms or fury tree for something besides pvp or raiding
Bill
Heilig Jul 11th 2008 1:12PM
"I'd be happy to turn the tanking reins over to another class, just give us some viability in the arms or fury tree for something besides pvp or raiding."
???
Something else like what? "I'd be happy to not tank, I just don't want to DPS against monsters or other players."
What do you want to fight, the scenery?
Bill Jul 11th 2008 1:46PM
5 mans. If I want to run a 5 man I have to be prot. If I'm playing my hunter I can spec into all 3 trees and be effective. I'll be most effective in the beastmaster tree (given my gear and experience) but I'll be useful nonetheless. The same can be said for my rogue. If I'm on my priest I can spec holy or shadow (never tried disc). I've never heard of a mage or lock being turned down for a group because of their spec, shammies are getting hex and I hear that druids will be able to use root anywhere. Pallies can heal or tank...where does that leave warriors? If we want to run a 5 man we essentially have to tank.
Bill