Encrypted Text: Blizzard called and they want their OP back
Every Wednesday, Encrypted Text explores issues affecting Rogues and those who group with them. This week Jason Harper, the new Rogue feature blogger, discusses the state of the Rogue class, effects of the 2.4.3 patch and the news from the Wrath beta.
I think I've got a pretty big job ahead of me as the new Rogue columnist here at WoW Insider. Sitting here, freshly unwrapped, I know I'll have to both balance the need to fairly represent "real" issues and not get too lost in "rah-rah-rogue" points of view. I'll need you, dear reader, to keep me honest and call-out the unintentional errors or oversights. We're a community and I absolutely want to know what you are thinking, what you love or hate and what you'd like to see me bring to this column that represent your needs.
Like a "do-not-toast-in-the-wrapper" warning on your box of PopTarts, I'd like to point out that any references I make to skills or talents in the Wrath beta should be taken with a grain of salt since they are subject to change at any time.
There are patches and then there are Patches
The 2.4.3 patch, recently released onto the production World of Warcraft realms, introduced a bevy of controversial changes very late in the TBC cycle. All told, this new patch changed (yet again) some very core attributes of the Rogue class, attributes that were introduced in 2.3.0, which were changes from abilities introduced in 1.12.1 during the Rogue refresh. Balancing classes is an on-going effort, but this is a downward-spiral of patch-over-patch changes on things that really make the rogue class what it is.
The Rogue class is an iconic and broadly feared class in the game. As with all classes it can be good or bad based on the play style and aptitude of the player, but the Rogue has many important characteristics that set it apart from the others. Centrally a DPS class, the Rogue uses a combination of short enemy-disabling or disorienting abilities (Sap, Kidney Shot, Cheap Shot, Blind, mace stun, Deadly Throw), bleeds (Garrote and Rupture), and melee DPS with at least one group buff (Hemorrhage). Rogues have very little in the way of ranged attacks, save for a low damage throw and a potentially high-damage, but combo-point centric Deadly Throw.
While it may be tempting to think that the Rogue is just like a junior version of a DPS spec Warrior, the Rogue has no access to essential defense, block or armor stats and is heavily reliant on Agility and Dodge rating to survive direct attack. Rogues are extremely dependent on their talented abilities to escape death from either a PvE or PvP opponent. In other words, once we're in melee range or casting range we require balls-to-the-wall DPS or emergency escape to survive. Full commitment to each encounter is an unavoidable game-mechanic. It is because of this mechanic that changes to both Cheat Death and Sinister Calling (on top of changes already made to Hemorrhage and other talents previously) hurt quite a bit.
A detailed examination of the changes
Cheat Death, accessible with 30 points in subtlety, permitted a Rogue to avoid 90% of any incoming damage (passively activated) when the game-client decides that the incoming blow would have killed the Rogue. The Rogue would then have three seconds to either kill the target (assuming just one target) or use an escape mechanism (like Vanish) to avoid death. Sinister Calling is a 35 point talent that increased agility by 15% (fully talented) and increase Backstab and Hemorrhage damage by 2/4/6/8/10%. Both of these abilities, combined with other changes in Hemorrhage and Sap, make a Subtlety Rogue a primary spec for PvP and Arena teams, and gave a little to PvE Rogues in terms of variety. It also made Rogues the most hated class in organized and world PvP due to the fact that they became incredibly hard to kill, impossible to kite (thanks to Cloak of Shadows), and a general thorn to any cloth wearer who had to suffer the walk-of-graveyard-shame after a four digit Hemorrhage critical.
[Updated for phrasing] There used to be a time when Hemorrhage and all subtlety builds were a laughable build due to the lack of sustainable damage (and the fact that many Rogues used it as a dagger build), and when you're standing in front of a high-dps (e.g. Mage, Warlock, Hunter S-Priest) or high-armor, high-sustain class (e.g.Warrior, Druid, Paladin) not killing them in the first three seconds typically means death for you. At least one major patch ago things shifted back to Rogues being the 700 pound gorilla in the room (750 for locks and 800 for Mortal Strike Warriors). With the most recently changes however, Blizzard has taken us back at least one step and reduced the overall efficiency of Cheat Death and Sinister Calling. Today, Cheat Death uses a complicated formula: 100% avoidance chance to reduce you to 10% health and *up to* a 90% damage avoidance for 3 seconds (modified by resilience). Word on the street is that this change doesn't actually have the intended effect and Rogues are dead before the Cheat Death combat message can be posted on screen.
Another gotcha with the new Cheat Death is that its overall effect is very much modified by stacking resilience. Resilience is an attribute that reduces the change to receive critical strikes and the damage received from critical strikes that land. There has been much speculation on the Official WoW Forums, including a post from Ainsarii on the actual effect. In short 150 resilience or 7.6% reduction in criticals would reduce damage by 30% for three seconds, while a resilience of 433 (or 22.5% reduction in criticals) would buffer you by 90% for 3 seconds, taking at most ten-thousand points of damage during Cheat Death before death.
By making Cheat Death pivot on resilience, which already provides a huge damage mitigation, Blizzard essentially telling us that they don't really want us to spec for it. In fact, many calls on the Rogue forum talk about using those same points for Master of Subtlety, which would increase damage done by 10% for six seconds after coming out of stealth. This is an especially important talent to consider since Blizzard also reduced the overall damage by 5% for hemorrhage with reductions in Sinister Calling.
That's nice but Rogues are OP anyway, right?
You may be saying, "But Jason, Rogues were so OP prior to 2.4.3 in PvP, with talents and abilities that made them too burdensome on the whole Arena and BG circuit. I mean, just look a the escalating number of Rogues on ranked Arena Teams versus, say, Hunters. These changes were necessary to fix blunders made by Blizzard in their attempts to fix underages made in the past. " I'd say, possibly. But I'd also add that Rogues fill a very special spot in PvP and PvE encounters that, I think, warrant them having some special defining abilities. We've got no bubble, we've got no shields, we have no effective ranged attacks, we don't employ any damage mitigation (with the exception of dodge and dodge enhancements via Evasion), we're susceptible to dodge-related counterattacks (a la Overpower) as well as lack of an AoE based stun/fear. My opinion is that PvP spec rogues *need* an advanced escape mechanism that works, even at the detriment of basic 1v1 PvP. Altering that talent, making it resilience dependent and reducing our overall damage output via hemorrhage, is a serious blow.
These changes bring up a few thoughts when looking at the expansion-cycle overall. With level 80 on the horizon, ten more talent points and a raft of new abilities, why would this change come now, on the brink of everything changing anyway? I have a few feelings in that regard.
On the one hand, I think that Blizzard was looking to close some perceived balancing issues, class-to-class, prior to opening up the gates to whatever new changes are on tap. I also believe that Blizzard is looking to differentiate melee classes by providing Rogues with even more specialized abilities (hopefully ones supporting the use of daggers...) and needed to tone down the level 70 abilities to prevent unintentional stacking of effects that make Rogues completely unkillable. Yes, that's right, I'm taking a positive turn on this. From the things I've read, both here and around the blogs, Rogues are going to make a huge return in playability and utility and of course, pure damage dealing.
Filed under: (Rogue) Encrypted Text, Rogue, Analysis / Opinion, PvP, Features, The Burning Crusade, Classes, Battlegrounds, Arena






Reader Comments (Page 1 of 6)
Zor Jul 23rd 2008 11:14AM
one of the original problems was that it was SUPPOSED to mitigate 90% damage, but was later stated with red faces it was at 99%, making you impossible to kill with a healer......impossible.
no other class could do that.
i agree the resliance thing had me scratching my head
btw, i have a full sub spec rogue, dagz mind you ( cant shake the nostalia)
Dominace Jul 23rd 2008 5:38PM
You might want to get that right, it was only 99% when two killing blows happened at the _exact_ same time, usually due to lag or insane luck.
Frat Jul 23rd 2008 11:39PM
sub daggers is an awful spec
Nathan Jessup Jul 24th 2008 8:05PM
Most rogues will admit that cheat death prepatch was in need of a fix. But this wasn't it, imo. As for the 5% on hemo? Making you wear pvp gear for cheat death is enough of a damage nerf for me, the 5% is overkill.
(Silly rogues with t6 4set eating poor clothie face)
Tech Jul 23rd 2008 11:20AM
The nerf to Cheat Death was completely necessary.
I love how you put rogues as a 700 pound gorilla and locks at 750 pounds. This is craziness, locks have been consistently nerfed and are now just an average PvP class. There numbers have been severely dwindling in high ranked arena teams while rogues have been constantly rising. And any sub rogue with at least some skill will beat a lock (or any other cloth wearer) every time unless they are severely out geared.
I hope there are more nerf's on the horizon for rogue's in PvP, but I hope that Blizz can figure out how to balance them without destroying there PvE viabilty.
tilarin Jul 23rd 2008 11:32AM
so basically you want to kill us rogues easily in pvp without losing our DPS in your raids?
Tech Jul 23rd 2008 11:38AM
Easy to kill... no
A chance to kill... yes please
TOYBREAKER Jul 23rd 2008 12:04PM
Ditto...talk about cake and eat it too.
epsilon343 Jul 23rd 2008 12:25PM
Oh c'mon... I'll be in a BG and suddenly be stacked with 4-5 DoTs from a lock who then prevents me from healing myself (Elemental Shaman) with their pet constantly hitting me. QQ some more...
I do agree that Rogues need some work. Like someone else mentioned, Rogues get to pick and choose their battles by just stealthing and finding someone like myself DPSing from outside the mosh pit. By the time I can stun him with War Stomp, I'm already down below half health. Like it or not but Rogues are almost always fighting in 1v1 matches just because of their nature: guerilla warfare.
We all know Blizzard doesn't balance based on duels but I think they need to look at the way people play the class and see that that's how Rogues always seem to operate.
grofer Jul 23rd 2008 11:19AM
Yes, but rogues are effectively invisible and can choose which fight to open with a first strike with instant CC and on which ones to pass with the ability to vanish out of a fight which doesn't go their way. Talk about cheap :)
jxm91082 Jul 23rd 2008 11:50AM
LOL vanish.... I wish that really worked. I'm not to worried about PVP being that I raid. What I'm tired of is the fact that Rogues should be the best single target dps in the game and the fact of the matter is we are not anymore. Equally geared hunters and warriors in the higher end raids are ahead of us DPS wise. Now beta is pumping up our dps by changing the buff mechanics of other classes(ie. windfury totems) but at the same time increasing those classes that are still on top with the same buffs. The marginal difference will still be the same in Wotlk as it is now. Hope Blizz can get it together.
Our job is simple. DPS, DPS, DPS and I wish we were king of the hill again with that
Bysshe Aug 15th 2008 11:01PM
@ jxm91082.
This is absolutely true and one of the reasons why I have forsaken my rogue main. Rogues sacrifice everything for their DPS: they simply can't do anything else. They can't buff other party members, they can't heal themselves, they can't conjure food or water, they can't shorten the CD on their hearthstone, they don't have a travel form, etc., etc. People talk about Vanish like it's this IWIN button, but it's no more an IWIN button than a mage casting Ice Block or a pally bubbling.
All rogues can do is kill things and open locked boxes. So every time I see that Blizzard is implementing more nerfs for the rogue, or adding another fight that is range-DPS friendly but melee-DPS unfriendly, I die a little inside.
Matthew Rossi Jul 23rd 2008 12:47PM
Funny, mages say that exact same thing, except its rogues they say are overpowered and have too much DPS and that they want to be king of that hill.
Guess the grass is always greener.
Eternalpayn Jul 23rd 2008 5:18PM
jxm, what are you talking about? L2DPS? In every raid I've been in (which is remarkably few, I'll admit) I have been the most undergeared DPS, and come in second or third on the charts, only to be beaten by a caster. I've never had a warrior or hunter, even better geared then me, do better DPS in an instance than me.
Driphter Jul 23rd 2008 6:15PM
Ah but if you were to list the things that rogues do outside of dps and what mages bring to the table you'd dispell the many myths they make. They all sound like a herd of sheep. Oh and I like the game Portal.
~Driphter
Rob Jul 23rd 2008 11:25AM
Yeah no offense to the rogue community, but I think most other classes would agree that rogues are very strong in their trademark suits. They do the most melee dps, typically the most raid dps, and are very hard to deal with in PVP.
I'd like to see weak PVP classes like hunters get more buffs while strong PVP classes get less buffs and even it out somewhat. It's disappointing to go into arena or BG and know you got creamed not because of your skill but because of your class and what gear you are wearing. That to me isn't fun. (Then again I'm of the 'PVP is broken' camp).
festerin Aug 1st 2008 12:06PM
OMG... did someone say Huntards are in need of PVP buffs? LOLOLOL
As far as rogues go, I hsave leveled this toon from the beginning of BC, and since that time we have been nerfed in EVERY patch since BC came out. BC itself killed the dagger rogue in PVP, so we switched specs, and they nerfed HARP, So we switched to the SUB tree and they nerf HEMO TWICE in a TWO MONTH PERIOD
Meanwhile every other class has received a buff and now ret pallies and fury warriors can hold there own in the DPS world of PVE... yeah, we are COMPLETELY broken now
Notice how no one coplains about a warrior hitting for 3k every 3 seconds or the stuns? Or mages and warlocks with 5k crits that is acceptable too? so bottom line here is if you don't play a rogue STFU you have no clue
Rob Aug 1st 2008 12:47PM
QQ more please. Rogues are the melee huntards of WoW. How many people who actually know how to play the game are rogues? Very few. They are completely OP in PVP. Once you've been around a while you'll figure out that everyone hates rogues, except rogues.
Oh yeah, notice the dps charts? Rogues are always on top. Notice the Arena charts? Again, rogues on top.
Best to remain silent and appear foolish than to open your mouth and erase all doubt.
valisil Jul 23rd 2008 11:26AM
I personally don't mind the changes to cheat-death, it was OP and needed to be nerfed, maybe not as much as it was but meh. It's the changes to Sinister Calling that really annoy me!
Brien Jul 23rd 2008 11:27AM
Blizzard's mistake wasn't cheat death, it was that they've given rogues too many ways to avoid being kited and the number one ability for that is shadow step, which was of course showing up with cheat death builds.
For any ranged class to kill a rogue, they have to kite the rogue. Now, of course, rogues should be given tricks for avoiding being constantly kited, it isn't fair that any ranged class can completely shut them down.
The problem is that blizzard has made it too easy for a rogue to keep you in range, where they completely destroy any ranged class in the game. Even if you're so lucky as to trinket out of all the slowing/stunning effects they're stacking on you they ususally have at least 1 combo point for a deadly throw, which just reslows you.
Any class that has to kite spends most of their time just trying to get away long enough to even bother attacking. Blizzard needs to reevaluate how many slowing and stunning effects and the ease of use of those slowing and stunning effects they're piling on rogues.
Most of the dps in this game is ranged dps and rogues own every last one of them and its almost not even a fight most of the time. Its just a rogue destroying them while they try to run away just to get a spell/attack off. Not good design. Blizzard needs to more carefully balance rogues so that they're not being constantly kited with no chance of winning with the fact that ranged classes need to actually have a chance, which they mostly do not have right now.