Raid ID stolen? Blizzard says report it.
by Matthew Rossi 
Aug 13th 2008 at 1:00PM
Apparently the new policy on raid stealing is to report early and in detail. Blizzard poster Belfaire, in a thread entitled 'Raid Harassment' explains in response to a post about a couple of people using a gullible guildmate's trust to snag his raid ID by 'asking for help on quests' and then wiping them repeatedly on Illidan attempts. Seems that now, if this kind of thing happens to you, (I once zoned into MC to find that, instead of half done, it had been cleared up to Ragnaros by another guild that had just accepted one of our mages as a member... he brought our raid ID with him, so they decided to take advantage of not having to do the first three bosses.)The change in policy may not make much of an actual difference in some situations... if someone's wiping your raid on boss attempts, the GM's probably won't be able to act before your raid is done for the night... but it's miles ahead of the 'there's nothing we can do' policy that's been enacted in the past. After all, it is possible for GM's to teleport jerks off of the Isle of Quel'Danas when they're making the badge vendor impossible to reach, so maybe they'll start porting griefers like the ones in Ironhide's post. I can only agree with poster Podric, and Belfaire himself, when they say that it's about time for this change.
Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Odds and ends, Raiding, Bosses
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
Jim Aug 13th 2008 1:07PM
Terrific, really. I hope this is a sign of less tolerance for griefing and jackassery in general.
Lab Monkey Aug 13th 2008 1:13PM
Alternatively you could /gkick your 'gullible guildmate' for being an idiot.
luchifer Aug 13th 2008 2:40PM
Gray area:
We started a fresh timed ZA run, we asked in general for 2 more people (again: fresh, timed ZA) and we invited a lock and a pally to complete our group. Anyway, the lock entered first and then he realized he was saved, thus saving us to his raidID, then he leaved party. As a consolation, we found that he didnt killed the last 2 bosses, so we did.
Punkenjoy Aug 13th 2008 1:21PM
A friend was in a T6 guild doing BT. They had done almost everyboss and they were trying to down illidan for about 2 week. One day, when they wiped all night on that boss but they almost get it. One of the guild member who was probably piss about the wiping all nite, nobody know but he asked the #1 guild on that server if they wanted to do illidan during the night. So next day when the raid was going to BT they got a big surprise.
that put a big punch in the face in that guild and resulted in a lot of drama
Jim Aug 13th 2008 1:25PM
Also...a few pages into the thread, Belfaire says:
"We're also asking any victims of mass guild bank theft, regardless of permissions the person may have had, to report it to our Game Masters for review. "
Vinna Aug 13th 2008 2:53PM
yeah, we had our guild bank jacked by someone (who obviously knew us) pretend to be an officer, got the alt guilded and promoted.. then jacked the bank.
Took about 2 weeks but we got all the items that were taken back (they mailed them to the GM since we had already refilled the bank) I knew it would take a while to get the items restored but over all I was really pleased with the gms handling of it.
Desvelra Aug 13th 2008 1:35PM
Belfaire now say that guild bank ninjas can now be auctioned!
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=8765581586&sid=1&pageNo=3#44
"Sure. We're also asking any victims of mass guild bank theft, regardless of permissions the person may have had, to report it to our Game Masters for review.
We won't be able to help all victims, but there should be an increasing number of actions against those who abuse their withdrawal privileges to hinder guild progress."
Rational Aug 13th 2008 1:44PM
We had an interesting situation in one raid. The raid leader led five people from one guild into Kara with four pickups plus himself, but they only killed one boss and couldn't finish. Then a few days later he had a pretty major falling-out with the guild leader, so the next party he led into Kara on the same raid ID had no members from the guild that had participated in the first run.
I was a member of the second run, and we completed the dungeon and killed every boss. So: Armchair lawyers, please tell us, was the Raid ID stolen or not? What exactly constitutes a "Stolen" raid ID?
larva Aug 13th 2008 2:01PM
Similar gray-area situation.
I got invited to tank a H. Mech. with 4 members of another guild. Only 1 of them had Omen installed, and there was often situations where they would pull aggro and get themselves, or all of us, killed. They wouldn't give me leader so I could mark (fine, whatever), and they rarely talked with me (I assumed they were talking on guild chat or vent.)
Anyways, we killed the first boss, but wiped on some trash just after. I suppose that was enough for them, so they told me to "L2Tank" and kicked me out of the group. So... I recruited some guild mates, got the group into the instance and finished the instance before they could.
Daddywarbuck of Farstriders Aug 13th 2008 2:08PM
"I was a member of the second run, and we completed the dungeon and killed every boss. So: Armchair lawyers, please tell us, was the Raid ID stolen or not? What exactly constitutes a "Stolen" raid ID?"
I think if you kick someone you invited beforehand, (Or replace him), and they take your raid ID, you're losing your raid ID is a case of "what goes around comes around". Especially if you don't handle it well. I think this is a *great* incentive for people to learn better people skills in wow. I don't mean this as a license to be a jackass, where you wipe the raid repeatedly, then steal the ID, but, I do mean this as a caution to tread gingerly when there is an issue.
If >=75% of the people 1> Go to a raid from a group, and 2> Have a known, and disclosed plan to the rest, which gives first priority to those in the raid already, then its their raid ID and they should be consulted with before continuing on. If the plan falls through, the Raid ID is open game.
However, if you start say, kara, and you call it at midnight, if there is no defined time/place to finish it disclosed to all people, I actually think you're SOL if one of the people decides to finish it. Out of decency they should invite people in the original raid to come when they start it up, but they are as much locked to that instance as the larger group that started, and disclosed to no plan to finish it.
If you're a group and you provide resources to all attendee's of the raid (pots, flasks, etc), then its your raid. If you don't, its everyones if you don't meet an above condition.
If you're in a 5 man, there is no such thing as stealing a raid ID. Even if its the daily heroic or whatever.
I personally give a wide berth on this sort of thing, and err on the side of not being a jackass, but I think many more proactive people than I are perfectly within their rights to "steal" raid ID's that haven't had their proper care, organization and human decency applied to them.
However, if you don't provide largess (Organization, planning, a light hand, and valuable raid consumables), I don't think its your ID to have stolen. Its everyones ID.
=-=Daddy
Rational Aug 13th 2008 2:26PM
@Daddywarbuck: 75% is seven and a half people, hehe.
Vinna Aug 13th 2008 3:03PM
I think if its a pug it's kinda up in the air as to who's raid ID it is, on the other hand, if it's a guild run with maybe a pug or two person, it's pretty much considered that guild's ID. So if one of the people the guild pugged went in with other people and finished it, I would consider that stealing the ID.
Now if people in the guild finish it with out the other guild members who were in the group I think it's more of a guild issue. Take it up with your guildmaster.
Bad thing about kara now a days as it's been changed, as in you used to not get saved even after bosses were downed until you actually killed a mob, now you get saved the second you step foot in the door if a boss has been downed. And you may not know its half clear until you get in there..
Manatank Aug 13th 2008 2:08PM
I really like the idea of punishing griefers with a teleport. I'd love to see something where they get teleported to one of the most remote areas of old Azeroth with a debuff that lasts an hour and prevents them from: hearthing, teleporting/porting, being summoned, and mounting. That'll teach'em, and it isn't quite as draconian is a ban.
Please allow us to send all of those jerks who spam trade with guild recruitment messages to somewhere, far, far away.
As an aside, advertising your guild as a "friendly, helpful guild" and then cursing at people in trade who ask you to advertise in guild recruitment doesn't make much sense.
Yell-O Aug 13th 2008 2:33PM
So now GMs will be babysitting fools?
I find that unnesesary.
Daimon Aug 13th 2008 3:31PM
This is nothing but great, about time, I've had several raids ninjaed, luckly none a 25man important raid. We got once in mt old friends guild a pally invited to KZ, he stated he wanted the mace from prince, we did well until curator, where we wiped stupidly but called the night, next day the instance was cleared.
In another sethekk hero run, a mage from a major guild left the party after a wipe, then while the rest went to summon my lock, the mage invited a full party to finish it while we had ppl in the instance!!!, we reported him but again a "helpfull" GM did what they do better, nothing. good thing was that my mates never left the instance so he couldn't finish it; the jerk even manage to provoque pulls to the ppl inside. We stayed until 2am just not to let him get away with the prank. FTW
Jaynitan Aug 13th 2008 3:35PM
THe case of a NON stolen raid ID. . . . First ever ZA run where after abotu 3 hours we finally downed the bear boss, after that me and many others swapped toons and invited guildies until eventually every lvl 70 that wanted a 2 slot hex bag was able to go and get the map for the quest. It was a two guilde colaborative run and we kept passing members of the other guild with their friends, I guess we were able to have two or more raid groups of people with the same ID in the same raid at the same time, granted no more than maybe 5 players at any given point.
We didn't down bosses or anything else but we DID help a lot of people get soem G and a nice bag.
And the timed part of the instance was shot anyway so . . . who cares!
dan Aug 13th 2008 3:50PM
I've been raiding since vanilla and I have *never* had a raid id "stolen." Never. Does this genuinely happen a lot with other people?
Vixen Aug 14th 2008 3:33AM
I don't think this is such a grey area:
A couple of months ago, I rejoined an old guild of mine.
Since I hadn't been apart of the guild in literally about 2 yrs, I app'd and was put on initiate status. There was another person, a priest(who was a terrible priest, but I digress) whom was also an initiate. She had been part of a Kara run that night before that wasn't finished. The following night, they we supposed to continue, but the raid leader couldn't log in due to RL stuff. This priest was so frustrated that she was going to sell the raid ID to a PUG. However, much to her dismay, she didn't see an officer's alt on and got booted the following day.
As a side note, I thought she was being melodramatic. Not like Kara was going away and we farm the place once a week, so it was pretty asinine.
Esk Aug 15th 2008 5:28AM
My first encounter with a stolen ID was back in the Aq40 days. After killing twin emperors, a vendor became available to exchange a special token into an imba epic item (token which could drop from 1st boss).
At that time, only 2-3 guilds were killing twin emps on our server, thus making the token exchange vendor available. However, plenty of people from the server had tokens from killing the first boss.
To our surprise, one day we found out how one of our guild sold the raid ID to another guild, so their players could come and complete the items. Turned out his guild loyalty had a price in gold!
***
The second stolen ID I know of is from TBC, and was a lot lamer. That guild was wiping on Lady Vash. So the GM of the guild together with 1-2 officers of his choice gave the ID to the #1 guild on the server, for free, as long as they were allowed to tag along. The rest of the guild members knew nothing about it.
Ofc when they found out there was a big drama, and the GM + guilty officers tried to motivate it as "we were trying to learn the tactic so we can do it with our own guild.. " :)