The Art of War(craft): The pointlessness of PvP in early Wrath

Of course, this comes after repeated Heroic runs, the clearing of Naxxramas, and the extremely easy reputation grind thanks to the new tabard system. Overall, it's a phenomenal gearing system... for PvE. On the other hand, the delayed release of Honor-bought PvP items and mid-December start of Arena Season 5 leaves PvP enthusiasts like myself out in the cold.
With the Honor cap restricted to 75,000 even at Level 80, playing any Battlegrounds or Wintergrasp results in Honor sloughing off into the nether while PvE players can continue to accumulate and spend Emblems of Valor and Heroism. On the other hand, because there are no Level 80 rewards available for purchase with Honor yet, it has become pointless to PvP specially if you are at the Honor cap. This doesn't make any sense to me. I don't want to grind Heroic dungeons for my gear. That's not where I have the most fun. I enjoy playing Wintergrasp and the new Strand of the Ancients Battleground, but unlike PvE players, I get significantly lower returns for my efforts.
This became excessively apparent to me when fellow guild members who hit Level 80 at about the same time as myself began to gear up significantly faster -- with Marks to spare for PvP gear. The new system forces PvP players to grind PvE content in order to stay competitive in gear accumulation. It takes about the same time to run the Culling of Stratholme and defend in Wintergrasp. In the former, you get reputation (with a tabard), a shot at blues and an epic, as well as collect Emblems of Heroism. In the latter, you earn Honor you cannot spend nor stockpile beyond 75,000 and Wintergrasp Marks of Honor which aren't currency for anything in the game at the moment.
Strand of the Ancients is a fun, quick Battleground that gives decent Honor for the time investment although again, if you're capped, there's nothing to spend that Honor on. You also get Strand of the Ancients Marks of Honor which is only usable as part of a quest turn in to get even more Honor which PvP players don't really need at this point. There's no reputation associated with Strand of the Ancients, either, so I don't understand why tabards can't be used to champion a faction's cause within a Level 80 bracket Battleground.
The relative ease by which PvE players get geared up is a very good thing. It's good for the game and the player base. The tuning down of PvE content has allowed greater accessibility for players, but the PvP grind remains the same. PvP rewards -- should they remain the same costs in Beta once they go live -- are exponentially more expensive, so even if Honor gain is faster at Level 80, the rate at which you'll get PvP gear remains the same.
That's another thing. Honor gain is much faster at Level 80 than it was at Level 70, but the Honor cap remains the same. This cap used to be roughly twice the cost of the most expensive Honor item in the game, but Deadly Gladiator filler pieces will cost over 60,000, leaving little change for any other items once PvP gear is finally released on live realms.
Contrast this with the plethora of PvE gear available through Emblems of Heroism and Valor, reputation gear, and a player doing the PvE grind will be significantly geared up come Season 5 compared to a player whose main passion is PvP. I know, PvP in World of Warcraft is mainly an afterthought. It's a disappointing realization considering how successful the itemization through PvP model Warhammer introduced.
World of Warcraft is still a PvE game. I know that. But there just isn't any way for a PvP player to remain competitive with a PvE player when it comes to gearing up in Wrath of the Lich King. In fact, it's quite the opposite. Players grinding 25-man raids may soon purchase Hateful Gladiator gear without having to step inside an Arena if the vendors open up the way they did in Beta. Players who didn't participate in the battle for Wintergrasp can freely enter the Vault of Archavon and walk away with loot.
In fact, the only way to obtain Arena gear prior to the Arena season is through doing the Vault of Archavon, and players don't even need to PvP to do that. They can simply wait until their faction has control of the zone. A player who participates in the battle for Wintergrasp gets little beyond the sheer fun of playing one of the best features of the game at the moment. Like I said, Wintergrasp Marks don't mean anything right now.
Furthermore, Honor can't be spent for PvE gear. There's no point in playing Battlegrounds or Wintergrasp for Honor until December 16, and by then PvE players will have caught up in gear and even Honor accumulated because of the cap. I'm forced to do an instance even though I'd much rather be in a Battleground or in Wintergrasp.
Ironically, it's also faster to farm Stone Keeper's Shards while doing instances when you control Wintergrasp instead of doing some PvP. Players who have never done Wintergrasp easily get the 50 or 100 Stone Keeper's Shards Achievements without even knowing what the Shards are for. On the other hand, players who actually fought in the battle don't get any bonuses. The game sometimes bugs that players don't even get credit for the win. It's happened to me several times that I don't get to complete my Victory in Wintergrasp daily quest because the game is bugged.
The sad fact is that, right now, PvP is pointless. Doing Heroics and raids is the only way to go. I know that the items will become available once Arena Season 5 starts, but why the long wait? A small delay prevents players who have stocked up their 75,000 Honor from getting ahead in the gear curve, but given the ease of the endgame right now, a mere week of running Heroics wipes out that advantage.
Don't tell me to run Heroics. That's not what I want to do. I want to PvP. The problem is, it's a waste of time right now. I've burned maybe tens of thousands of Honor because I'm already capped, but there's nothing for me to buy. It's sad, actually. I would like to say that Wrath itemization is a resounding success -- and it is for the most part, but in the early going it's been something of a failure for PvP.
The crafted Resilience sets are pretty cool, but they are superior level items and PvE easily gets ahead in itemization with the ready availability of both levels of Tier 7. In fact, with the slow accumulation of Arena points and ratings, it's theoretically much faster to get Arena gear through the Vault of Archavon. If vendors in Dalaran start selling PvP gear for Emblems, it'll be faster, too.
Right now and for the past weeks, PvP has been pointless. It would've been nice if it were possible to level from PvP, but it's a distant idea that was only sparked by the Warhammer experience. Will it ever make it to WoW? Maybe. But it's too late for this leveling period. The best thing for any PvP fanatic right now is to grind PvE and accumulate Emblems. It's kind of sad to see that on an Arathi Basin weekend, there are no games on. Until December 16, at least, and until more people hit Level 80, PvP won't be anywhere near as rewarding.
Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, PvP, The Art of War(craft) (PvP), Battlegrounds






Reader Comments (Page 1 of 5)
Frummer Dec 8th 2008 2:08PM
Go quit for AoC or WAR, already, and leave those of us who enjoy a primarily-PvE endgame alone.
holyground Dec 8th 2008 2:24PM
Why can't you just acknowledge that there are always gaps in blizzard, instead of saying go quit if you don't like it.
This post was well reasoned. The only reason i do wintergrasp at all is so I get the buff to pick up the shards in my heroic runs for the heirloom items and mount.
To the pvpers out there:
I sympathize with you. I'm sorry your honor is evaporating, and I know it isn't fair at all, once you compare your situation to PvE. However, The long wait is in line with Blizzards projection. Remember, you're "hardcore" if you're level 80 by now.
I'd expect everyone and their grandmother to be 80 by the 16th. This gives them time to maybe farm some of that res gear.
Not that T7 won't rip them apart. Just remember, it's season 1 all over again.
Core Dec 8th 2008 2:24PM
@frummer,
That's such a stupid thing to say. WoW has one of the fastest combat systems going in MMO's, and i dont think he should have to settle for a lesser game just so he can enjoy a decent PVP system. Warcraft offers PVP aswell as PVE, so i don't think it's unreasonable to strive for PVP to be balanced in the game, as it would be pointless for it to be there otherwise.
dpoyesac Dec 8th 2008 2:28PM
Um...
The OP wasn't saying Blizz should nerf the PvE endgame but should instead buff PvP. Fixing the problems Zach (correctly, if polemically) pointed out wouldn't change your PvE endgame at all.
Tanglebones Dec 8th 2008 6:05PM
I believe the entire problem is a result of several seasons of QQ from the "hardcore" PvPers about casuals and PvEers getting "welfare" epics from PvP.
Apparently, most PvPers believe that to get decent gear for PvP one should not have very much fun while getting squished repeatedly. If this article is correct, these PvPers should get lots of opportunity for that come S5.
zcandymanz@hotmail.com Dec 8th 2008 10:05PM
/signed
I cant agree more with author. There is nothing for me tro do as a pvper, i did all the city raids and got my mount, maxed out on honor points and almost done with SotA tokens. I Wish we had one set of blue lvl 80 pvp gear.
I've been doing pvp but after doing a raid/instance more than three or four times i get sick of it. I WANT COMPETITIVE PVP!
Leejin Dec 8th 2008 2:13PM
"Until December 16, at least, and until more people hit Level 80, PvP won't be anywhere near as rewarding."
Well DUH!!... It's a month after launch.... you expect Blizzard to introduce insane PVP items when hardly anyone is level 80? I can't help but read this thinking, omg...this guy is ridiculous. Remember when people in Arena Gear kicked the living shiz out of people in Sunwell Gear?
WNxSajuukCor Dec 8th 2008 2:16PM
+1
Clevins Dec 8th 2008 2:29PM
Yeah, though I actually agree with the article's points. A 75k honor cap is silly given the pricing of certain items and having the people who won Wintergrasp not get any bonus over those of us running instances for the shards seems silly.
Imagine if Naxx wasn't available for a month because, after all, people won't need to run it until then (Yes, I get that there has to be enough players for Arena, etc... it's an analogy)
Ryan Dec 8th 2008 5:04PM
Your an idiot Sunwell gear was for PVE Gladiator gear is for PVP so duh PVP gear > PVE gear in PVP.
Dah Dec 8th 2008 5:28PM
This logic only works if the PvP items are clearly superior to PvE items for PvE content and are easier to access. Otherwise it fails. Considering that they could have allowed accumulation of toned down PvP gear as a reward for doing PvP content, I don't think this argument has any merit.
Leejin Dec 8th 2008 5:33PM
Wow, I'm just saying that it generally was a lot easier to get the PVP gear. I've been playing the game since launch and I've always just had this idea that PVE gear should be better that PVP. I mean, I think the guys who spend months and months progressing through a tough raid should be rewarded with better gear then someone who can grind out honor for a week straight.
Mr42 Dec 9th 2008 6:12AM
@Ryan: it's not been so long a go that PvE guilds had to farm arena for weapons, so PvP gear > PvE gear in PvE
and i gotta say i kind of agree with Leejin. Given proper difficulty for encounters, PvE gear should be at least slightly better (heck, at least for PvE purposes) than epics you are guaranteed to get from playing 10 games a week
Moody Loner Dec 8th 2008 2:17PM
Well, you get familiar with and practice in the new BGs.
And you get to stockpile a bunch of Marks for when they are worth something.
Think strategic, not tactical.
Butnick Dec 8th 2008 2:20PM
OMG, I got about three paragraphs in and realized this was just a huge QQ in the form of a novel. Does anyone have to approve these articles before they get published? Are we supposed to say "there, there, I know it's tough, just hang in there buddy" and give you a tissue because you had to wait a month to PVP because you stockpiled honor? Sorry but no sympathy hugs from me.
Aler Dec 8th 2008 2:20PM
The best reason to play PVP is because it's fun, and you enjoy doing it. Honor and marks are the icing on the cake.
Bean D Dec 8th 2008 5:48PM
This is EXACTLY how I feel. Hell, I play a lousy Holy Priest nowadays at 80 and I still go to the BG's because it's fun. F-U-N. Key-word there.
Sure getting splattered by every other class that breathes hard at me is not fun, and not even close to heal-throughable, but at least I get to get in my vehicle and tear things up for a while before the Retadins and DK's come over to ruin my fun.
I don't BG for gear and I severely dislike how Blizzard has tried to tack on a whole different game/gearset with the whole PvP facet.
Go to Wintergrasp for fun. Do SoA for fun. PvP for fun. All that really matters is that I'm healing my friends who are killing Alliance ;-)
Sharkhunt Dec 9th 2008 9:53AM
This, This, This.
If you don't enjoy PVP, then don't do it. The gameplay is its own reward. If you don't enjoy PVP, you don't need special gear to have a miserable time PVPing in.
Also, Early wrath PVP isn't pointless at all. Now is a great time to get to face off in the open world PVP dailies, to spend time in the new BGs, and to get in some practice against (or with) as many Death Knights as possible ahead of the next arena season.
Peekaboo Dec 8th 2008 2:21PM
"The sad fact is that, right now, PvP is pointless."
The sad fact is, this post becomes pointless in 1 week.
So you have to wait a little bit to get something out of PVP, relax it'll be here soon enough. Blizz wants you to quest and enjoy the storyline for a couple weeks....
Norad Dec 8th 2008 2:23PM
TLDNR