Ulduar and Blizzard's "hard modes"
by Mike Schramm 
Jan 2nd 2009 at 1:30PM
We're only a day into 2009, and we've already got an update on one of our predictions. Vaneras has appeared on the EU forums talking about Ulduar's difficulty level and he says that yes, it will make a PTR appearance, and yes, it will be hard, but probably not in the way that we'd expect. He says that Blizzard is pleased with the way the "Sartharion with no drakes" worked, so they're planning to expand on that idea in the upcoming raids, by including more "hard modes" and more achievements, with "an increase of reward level if successful."So the odds are that we'll still see Ulduar's normal mode downed within days if not minutes on the live realms -- it won't actually be "hard" in the sense that the guilds with high level gear won't be able to plow right through it. But there will likely be multiple challenges within that are very hard, and achievements that will likely reward special gear or titles that will take guilds a while to do. This probably won't satisfy most of the really hardcore raiders, but we've been over this one -- Blizzard would rather have the majority of the playerbase play these raids, and since challenges and achievements don't take as much development time, that's what the minority of really hardcore players will get.
Of course, as with everything, we'll have to see how it works out -- Blizzard is clearly trying to make sure everyone coming to these raids finds what they're looking for in terms of a challenge. Ulduar itself might not be as hard as we predicted, but if Blizzard really ramps up the "hard modes" within the instance, it could be a while before we see anyone able to topple all of the challenges in there.
Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Odds and ends, Raiding, Wrath of the Lich King
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 5)
Sagretti Jan 2nd 2009 1:38PM
Nowhere in Vaneras's comment does he state that Ulduar won't be harder in general. He simply states that they're adding more special "hard mode" stuff as well. His statement that they will be limiting the raid's appearance on PTR seems to show they want to keep it somewhat of a challenge.
hold up Jan 2nd 2009 2:13PM
True, it doesn't mention the difficulty directly but he did mention the OS encounter. And if you've done Sarth you know that completing it with 0 drakes up is a complete joke.
I predicted that they would do something like this. It allows casual players to experience the game while giving the "hardcore" players something extra to go for. Most high end players complain that it isn't difficult enough, but as a high end raider myself I actually like it. We can go in and try the encounters on hard mode and then when we get bored we just kill it on normal mode. Like after spending 2.5 hours wiping on 3 drakes to silly people dying in void zones we knocked down a drake and then one shotted it as usual.
It's like playing WoW with cheat codes to make the game easier. Plus, now that we have everything on farm we can do Naxx in 2 hours and the other 2 in another hour or two and then we can go out and, as another commentor put it, get some "poo-nanny".
Thanks for the free epics blizzard! And thanks for giving me my life back
peagle Jan 2nd 2009 1:39PM
Personally I like this approach, though hopefully there will be a bit more to it than just "how many bosses/mobs can you handle at the same time".
As for "satisfy most of the really hardcore raiders", how about Blizzard address the fact all realms on servers more than a couple years old can't play any 25-man instances due to unplayable lag?
Chronnick Jan 2nd 2009 4:54PM
Seriously?
Robert M Jan 2nd 2009 1:39PM
As a non hardcore raider, this scares the hell outta me. Can you imagine the day when the hard core raiders clear a raid and it's subsequent achievements and are then forced to go out into the real world for a Starbucks, movie, or some poo-nanny?
/gasp
Charlie Jan 2nd 2009 7:43PM
Hey! I take offense to that. You'd be suprised how many "hardcore" raiders raid on have 'lives'.
I mean i raid tues, thurs, sun, and im only from around 6 to 11.
If i get my shit done (read: School, work, other responsibilities) i ussualy close my comp, grab my wallet, and walk downstairs to the bar on thursdays with my friends.
I hate the stereotype that everyone who is hardcore doesn't have a life. It's silly.
Kassu Jan 2nd 2009 7:58PM
^THAT.
There is nothing casual about raiding. Nothing.
Those "hardcore" whiners can't wrap their mind around the fact that some people have some form of a life, hell, it need not be a life but just a sense of moderation when it comes to playing a game.
None of the raid encounters consist of running in and 1-shotting everything in sight. Difficult is not fun, it's frustrating as hell. Thanks to WotLK, I might have a chance of actually seeing the endgame content and I'd be damned if Blizz ever takes that away because of some whining bunch of basement lurkers who think they're hardcore for sitting behind their computers for 10 hours every night.
QQ, =)
Kassu Jan 2nd 2009 8:00PM
My post was directed to Robert M
Charlie, maybe you're just not hardcore enough then?
AlmtyBob Jan 2nd 2009 8:33PM
I hope you mean 1-shot as in 1-hit because a lot of raid encounters are being completed in one attempt by undergeared/underskilled players that really shouldn't be. Please don't read that as elitist statement I mean it like this: My guild is mostly a leveling guild of people with some BC raiding experience (most of us had completed or mostly completed T5). The third week of the expansion we attempted Naxx-10 with a group of us that had just barely hit 80. We managed to down 9 of the 15 bosses in one attempt that week. Most people in the raid still had a few greens, no one was using flasks, and we were a melee heavy group with bad composition. There's something wrong with that. If that wasn't bad enough, it just seemed to get easier when we hit the 25 man version. Figuring it'd be harder, we got a good composition up and asked everyone to bring buff food (though not flasks). Again, it was just a steamroll straight through.
What most of us "whiners" are concerned about is that nothing matters anymore. There is absolutely no reward for taking the time to learn to play your class well when a random PUG of undergeared players can down the 25 man bosses. There's no incentive to find the best gear for each slot, no incentive to go for rare-quality gems, no incentive to bring consumables, no incentive to enchant your gear when a group of somewhat-fresh 80s can complete every encounter in the game with relative ease. As a tank, I no longer care about striving for better gear since after two Naxx-10 clears our healers and I had all the gear needed to comfortably complete every encounter in the game regardless of DPS.
Lastly, please stop with the hardcore stereotyping. I work 40+ hours a week and actually leave my house a few times a week to go out with friends. Even pre-LK, raiding took about 1.5 hours of prep (doing dailies/making food/etc) and 8 hours of raid time per week. I'm sure anyone who has an 80 right now puts in about that much time per week. The difference between the raiders and the casuals is that the raiders occasionally take the time to read up on their class and talents, splurge for the better gems, download the few necessary mods, and spend the whopping 2-3 minutes per boss to read up on what color fire we should not be standing in. Most of DON'T sit in a basement all day eating Doritos surrounded by by crazy charts and calculators.
Robert M Jan 3rd 2009 1:59AM
There currently is little casual about raiding, but it doesnt mean that it ahs to remain that way. Casusal means that you can work on a raid, to me anyway, that you can work on a raid a couple nights a week, and hope that sometime before the next raid is available, to have cleared it.
It doensnt have to be about clearing any of the current content in hours, days, or even the first month of release.
You can still solo with much less than that, so why not enjoy the journey? I am not casual in terms of information, but I am casual in terms of little desire to be the first member of a raid to clear anything. You can take the game semi-seriously with regard to your role in a raid, but not take it so seriously that you only go out on Thursdays.
Plastic Rat Jan 9th 2009 9:52PM
@Robert M
Ah yes! The awesome argument that because you take a video game seriously you are not getting sex. Thereby also inferring that A) Sex is one of the most important things in this life and B) You, unlike them, are getting lots of it.
A lot of hardcore's are a lot more well adjusted than the casuals running around with their sense of entitlement. The average hardcore has to have a bit more ambition than the whiny casual who expects handouts for everything. Usually that kind of ambition translates to a decent career and family life.
Personally, I see it as more of a case where the guy who expects everything in the game to be given to him on a silver platter without any effort to translate that to real life. As we know, real life kicks a lot harder than WoW.
So who's REALLY living in their mom's basement and not getting any "poo-nanny"?
T Jan 2nd 2009 1:40PM
That is good news. The hardcore raid crowd needs to be told no every once in awhile. Its nice to see that Blizzard has a sufficient player base that they feel comfortable designing the game for an audience other than the hardcore raiders. For once, it appears the majority will actually have their voices heard over a very vocal, and in many cases, unreasonable, minority.
Kakistocracy Jan 2nd 2009 1:44PM
I'd like to see Blizzard put in a boss that is effectively unbeatable, just to keep people happy. I say "effectively" because it has to at least seem like it may die if they try something else.
Tim Jan 2nd 2009 1:55PM
I like the "Bonus boss" idea, although in order to keep the average player satisfied I would need to A: not give out anything particularly unique power-wise, and would mostly be a bragging rights fight, and B: not be important lorewise.
Unfortunately, at that point you wind up having the Omega/Weapons from the FF series floating around Azeroth for no particular reason.
Or maybe they should through in a "Wet your pants" difficultly level on the raids.
eillind Jan 2nd 2009 2:01PM
"The CASUAL crowd needs to be told no every once in awhile"
fixed =D
steve Jan 2nd 2009 2:24PM
I think this is simple economics. Spending a lot of money to create content that only a fraction of your player base can access just isn't good business. And, Blizz has been going in this direction for a while. I'm sure many of the folks reading this article have been playing long enough to remember the long attunement chains when BC first came out? Over time, attunements were either lowered or dropped completely and with the introduction of ZA and the timer, we started to see them put the "gate" inside the content (e.g. you have to do it fast and efficiently) rather than at the front (with a long and arduous attunement chain). Now we can see more timers in the Northrend content, tons of raid and heroic achievements, and the new three-drakes mechanism. More of the player base gets to see the content, but Blizz can still reward players through titles, mounts, and additional loot.
AlmtyBob Jan 2nd 2009 4:09PM
Bleh. I'm not a particularly hardcore raider, but this makes me sad. They built in a perfect compromise with the normal/heroic version of each dungeon, and then they just crap all over it by making BOTH modes cakewalks.
I had really, really hoped that Ulduar would be different. Give the so-called "casual" crowd (though in any non-MMO game the vast majority of casuals would be considered hardcore in terms of time spent) the 10 man scenic tour raids and give the players who would like a challenge a brutally difficult 25 man raid. The casual players always whine about how they can't dedicate time to acquire the gear or skill that the hardcores can, yet somehow they find a casual guild that can get 25 people together at once who can't dedicate time to the game. How does that work?
Eisengel Jan 3rd 2009 1:27PM
@Kakistocracy
Well, if the boss is killable at all, they'll get a lock with T5 and just tank the boss while the lock cranks up +dmg procs. If you recall a lock did that on the Sons of Allisarj around the Dark Portal in Azeroth a little while back and found out what the WoW damage cap was... something a bit over a million DPS as I recall.
Liel Jan 2nd 2009 1:43PM
So with limited PTR access I wonder if the hardcore guilds will be able to proclaim 48 hour clears.
Mastique Jan 2nd 2009 1:46PM
Yes, agreed. There are so many different types of players though. The PvP'ers, the Raiders, the PvE'ers and mixtures of them all. The "hardcore" members of those groups are the ones that tend to complain to anyone who will listen about how the game *should* be, because that's the way they want it to be.
It will never be all things to all people, but I think by throwing each sect a bone on occasion keeps folks coming back. I absolutely love the game. Of course there are things I would like to see different, but I won't stop playing because of it. I will stop playing when its no longer fun to do so. But, I am rambling now, and will digress. Hardcore, SHMARDcore. =)