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All of the latest Mists of Pandaria newsBlizzard polls for the toughest Heroic instance
by Mike Schramm 
Jan 17th 2009 at 11:00AM
Blizzard has posted a poll on the forums asking what players think is the toughest Heroic dungeon in the game. Unfortunately, they don't say much else besides that, so guessing the reason why will be up to us and our commenters. They want to make sure Ulduar is tougher than Heroics? They want to look for particularly tough mechanics for future instances? They just enjoy seeing players have a tough time of it? Your guess is as good as ours.
Loken is notorious as a tough boss in Heroic mode, but his Halls of Lightning only makes second place, right above Ahn'kahet and its tough fights of Jedoga Shadowseeker and the insanity-inducing Herald Volaj. And it's worth noting that as of this writing, Drak'theron, The Nexus, Utgarde Keep and Violet Hold have a total of zero votes among them -- apparently everyone agrees they're easy as-is. But right there on top sits everyone's least favorite drake-riding instance -- The Oculus, with all of its drakey goodness.
Unfortunately, this may not help Blizzard -- I doubt many players would be really excited if they re-used the "drakes" mechanic in a lot of future dungeons, as the difficulty there lies in playing a completely different game rather than using the abilities of your character that you're used to. But It's an interesting poll anyway. What instance are you finding the toughest in Heroic mode?
Filed under: Polls, Analysis / Opinion, Odds and ends, Blizzard, Instances, Wrath of the Lich King, Forums
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)
Muse Jan 17th 2009 11:05AM
Some places are harder to DPS. Others require better tanking. Some are nightmares for healers. "Easy" and "Difficult" comes somewhat relatively on-average for all roles.
Kassius Jan 17th 2009 4:42PM
everyone has a hard time in the Brann event in HoS. i'm surprised no-one mentions this one, has it been nerfed? haven;t gone in a while but thats a section that requires everyone in the group to have major skill
Megamanxlink Jan 17th 2009 11:11AM
Personally, I think there aren't hard heroics, just a few tougher boss fights than some. Loken sure is a pain but he's cake when you get his timing down. I look forward to the new content.
Elmo Jan 17th 2009 11:14AM
Still never did Occulus, maybe thats a good thing then...
I think Azjol Nerub also deserves a nomination, Anub'Arak can be quite a bugger for a pugger
Niko Jan 17th 2009 11:15AM
if you pugg all are hard, if u do it with guildys all are easy
Dragoest Jan 17th 2009 12:11PM
I pug are not that bad.. everytime one of you guildys join an non guild run that makes him a pug.. and that would make him fail?.. but when he runs with you guys he can't do wrong?.. bah.. I've seen just as many failed pugs as i do g runs.. and I clear most every run.
I heard this once and maybe you should hear it too...
anyone can be a good player when everyone dose just as they should... BUT only Great players can pull a win when the shit hits the fan and everyone dose their own thing.
I'm prot.. I can make sure I have aggro when no one follows the mark order or when a pat runs into us in the middle of an AOE burn.
I also have a healer.. I keep everyone up when the tank can't hold aggro and takes hit's like mage
as DPS... hold off a mob till the tank can get it.. I might not be the top DPS but i help make sure the run gets cleared with out a wipe.. any meat head can DPS... but the one getting an re-invites are the ones that know how to assist the tank and CC the mobs going after the healer.
StoNe Jan 17th 2009 3:47PM
I can't help but laugh...I'm in an end game raiding guild which only has two more objectives left...
10 man Sarth with three drakes, and 'The Immortal...' title for heroic Naxx.
Yet for some strange reason, I seem to have more success in PUGS than in Guild runs on my server. I think it's because guildies are used to all dps, heals and tanking being over geared and over powered. Yet in pugs, there is more precession and people paying attention or 'happy' to be playing.
In answer to the poll....0 are hard for skilled groups, but I personally believe all heroics and 10 mans should and are puggable, there for, Occu is harder for pugs, as is UP gauntlet if the dps don't have gear.
Dave Jan 17th 2009 11:24AM
Loken is a big "overthinker" check. The proximity DOT is a red herring. It's meant to confuse people and make them do the exact opposite of what they should do, precisely because of that aura.
The easy strategy is to BE CALM, everyone stack on Loken, stack on the tank and DO NOT MOVE. Just heal through the lightning storm, heal through the DOT and pop all your cooldowns in order to max out your DPS on the fight. If you can bring a Shaman or a Hunter for the nature resist that'll help make it even easier. Loken actually doesn't have a lot of HP or Armor. You probably need to be to the point where you're not wearing any greens in your gear and maybe an epic or two from other heroics, but it's not like having full T7.5 epics are going to change your luck in the instance if you don't understand that it's a strategy failure causing your wipes. Running and spreading out is disaster and yeah you may get lucky every once in a while, but a broken clock is right twice a day too. Do it smart, don't over think it, win the game.
Cyanea Jan 17th 2009 12:48PM
This.
Balius Jan 17th 2009 1:22PM
Alternately, you can do the fight the way the game intends and just not suck at reacting to the fight. Then you aren't forcing your healer to heal through massive spiked damage and you're not relying on overgearing the place to survive the encounter.
Loken is a litmus test to discover bad players.
Dave Jan 17th 2009 2:08PM
see that's the thing! It's not spiky damage, it's predictable damage with a 4-second cast time and you know what's going to happen and how much damage is going to go down in a fairly precise range. The encounter actually intends for you to predict the damage, top off and heal appropriately rather than try to dance around and generally be silly. That's what the aura is screaming at you, but you're listening to the DOT and the storm with their false cries of "run away you fool".
You only make it more difficult for everyone when you move around like headless chickens in the Loken fight. Once you've done the fight a couple of times and know when the damage is going to happen, how much it's going to be and how to stack your heals or start spamming the AOE heals, you're going to nail the thing in around a minute. If you try to do the running around bit, you lose a lot of DPS, you stress the heals out mana-wise and effort-wise AND you run the risk of missing a heal on a DPS and wiping the whole thing when the healer runs out of mana since you can't deal enough damage before the healer runs out of mana since essentially they're chain spamming heals the entire fight.
Try it sometime. Watch in amazement as you clear the fight in a minute and a half, get the achievement and nobody dies.
Heroic HoL is an EASY 30 minute clear once you've got the gimmicks down and it's definitely my favorite daily run when I can get 4 people who aren't scared ot running it to go.
Balius Jan 17th 2009 2:37PM
I have the achievement, we don't wipe or die, and the paladin healer I run with says it's a remarkably easy fight, which I tend to agree with while playing either tank and dps. Mana's not an issue, and if you're not eating the nova the healer shouldn't be getting too terribly stressed from a low damage AoE tick on a group bunched up together.
The only way I can see running out of range of the nova being a problem is if the group scatters in five directions and has to regroup after every nova, instead of coming up with a plan ahead of time.
I'm sure that planning on eating the nova is better than being caught by it unaware, but it's certainly worse than not getting hit by it at all. If you're overgeared but the group is unable to react to Loken's castbar, simply standing there and forcing your healer to do all the work is certainly an option. There are, however, very easy ways to do the fight without relying on a healer to keep the party up while they pit Loken's HP bar against the healer's MP bar. You can simply not take the damage in the first place.
StoNe Jan 17th 2009 4:00PM
Nah mate,
Try doing it as intended and move...difference is, don’t suck at it.
Just shows your knowledge of pugs, the aoe tic can hit for more hp than what the dps can have at times.
I have been in this with peeps with really shit gear...it's an easy 2 minute fight.....just fucking MOVE when you're supposed to.
If you disagree and say just sit through it...
A) you have only played with people that are all in epics or..
B) you're the kind of player that can only kill Kingdoms when there was a LoS bug
It shits me when people try to convince the pug to "Hey...there is an easy way to do this....Everyone stand on yer head, jump three times, and run into the aoe and it works well"
zzZZzz....give the proper way any day....just don't suck at it.
Yakuko Jan 17th 2009 4:01PM
As a Paladin healer, I've found it easier to just have me stand outside from the group with Beacon on myself, while everyone stacked up and move out of the nova together. I have yet to try just stacking up and eating the nova since it is predictable damage and by now most of us should have enough hp to not get oneshotted by it. However my lack of aoe heal makes me weary of trying it.
Apoc Jan 17th 2009 4:54PM
The problem with Oculus isn't just that it's long and boring (it is), but the fight mechanics involving the drakes pretty much negate whatever gear you do have. It doesn't matter at all for those fights. In fact, when I get on a drake, I do it in the nude. It makes no difference at all, and if I die I lose no durability.
This is a retarded mechanic imo, and the drakes should at least scale with your gear I think. The Oculus is by far my least liked heroic.
Dah Jan 17th 2009 11:32AM
Sad thing is that the only reason Occulus is hard is because people are tossed onto vehicles that they have no experience using unless they've done the instance before. It's not really hard in the sense of challenging your ability to play your character.
komamura Jan 17th 2009 3:06PM
Agreed, occulus isn't hard at all, it's just long and boring as piss
jaxson_bateman Jan 17th 2009 11:36AM
I've done plenty of heroics - predominantly in the first month of Wrath while they were still fresh and I was still working on Glory of the Hero.
Here are my thoughts:
*Hardest trash: Ahn'Kahet
*Hardest boss: Loken; purely for being quite unforgiving of lag or slow reflexes. To be honest, none of the bosses are very hard.
*Most revealing encounter: Eregos. It will show you who picks up things fast, and who doesn't.
ayalafatalis Jan 17th 2009 11:45AM
Id say Utgarde Pinnacle. It might not be difficult, but I havent been in one group that could clear it...
*facepalm*
[Meteorite Whetstone], you ill be mine one day. Oh yes...one day...my...precious...
Steven Shull Jan 17th 2009 11:45AM
Dave, good analogy with the clock. I've just recently joined an endgame guild so I finally have guild members to do some of the harder dungeons with but PUGs are almost futile in a lot of heroics because people don't know how to pay attention. Even on Nexus runs you'll find people who ask you to sheep a target then they'll aoe and ask why I'm not sheeping things.