A plea for Divine Plea
Blizzard is going to swing the nerf bat and it's going to hit Divine Plea. With the intended changes to mana regeneration mechanics in Patch 3.1, where Spirit will be nerfed to curb mana replenishment in raid scenarios, Paladins stand to be unfazed. Spirit isn't a useful stat for Paladins, so Blizzard is looking into raising the healing penalty that comes with Divine Plea, a spell intended to help Protection and Retribution Paladins recover mana. Even with the 20% healing penalty, Divine Plea gives Paladins such phenomenal mana recovery that they don't think twice about using it. Used in conjunction with Avenging Wrath, the penalty isn't even an issue. See, that's a problem.Blizzard wants the decision to use Divine Plea to be a tough one for Holy Paladins, not a no-brainer. Needless to say, Retribution Paladins and their 5k mana pool use it every time it's up. But when a Holy Paladin with 20k mana can recover 25% of their mana every minute, it's kind of an obscenity. So Blizzard is going to nerf Divine Plea by raising the healing penalty to 50%. Some people think this won't be enough to stop Holy Paladins from using the spell every time it's up, though. Rohan over at Blessing of Kings thinks the spell should not have a healing penalty but be canceled when the Paladin casts a healing spell.
It's an interesting idea, but it also doesn't make too much sense. He says that while 50% healing penalty isn't going to stop players from using the spell, he's afraid Blizzard might over-nerf the spell into uselessness. But if Holy Paladins can't heal through the duration of Divine Plea, that's kind of nerfing it to a 100% healing penalty, isn't it? You can remove the buff yourself, anyway, so that'd work like the cancelation he talks about. So how do you fix Divine Plea so that it becomes a strategic choice rather than be a natural part of a Holy Paladin's rotation?
The way I see it, Blizzard should stop looking at healing penalties and instead look at casting time. Prior to 3.0, a Holy Paladin's biggest weakness was that her bread-and-butter heals had a cast time. This punished healers during mobile fights, especially in PvP. When talents like Infusion of Light and Judgements of the Pure paved the way for crazy 18k heal bombs in less than 1.5 seconds, everything changed.
What if Divine Plea read "You gain 25% of your total mana over 15 sec, but the amount healed by your spells is reduced by 20% and casting time is increased by 100%"? A casting speed penalty might make the decision more critical in an environment where landing a heal on time is sometimes more important than landing a big heal. At any rate, we'll have to wait and see how Blizzard tunes this without nerfing the spell to uselessness.
Patch 5.4 patch notes
Virtual Realms feature revealed
The Proving Grounds are coming
The latest patch 5.4 news





Reader Comments (Page 3 of 4)
zerocoolhack Feb 9th 2009 1:35AM
this arena stuff is getting really tiresome. why not just make it function different in pvp?
Hagu Feb 9th 2009 1:39AM
I very reluctantly could see why they would nerf DP. But don't forget that the reason we have DP is that unlike the spirit based healers we don't have two million OOC MP5 (soon to be nerfed to under a million.) I may be exaggerating a bit there.
I have two huge issues.
1) I am back on my pally healer due to having played an 80 warlock. So I am extremely skeptical of Blizzard changes.
2) I spent considerable amounts of my time to get the in-game gear to play the WotLK INT not MP5 spec. I could not use my level 70 gear so that was not a problem. But if I now need to replace gems and especially the Greatness trinket, then I would be so frustrated. What is the point of working for something if it's just going to be devalued by the next developer whim???
@turkeyspit - how about a glyph that keeps DP the way it is but reduces your mana to zero if you Arena/PvP. I agree I have zero interest in PvP and thus resent any changes I must endure because of it.
AxisOfJustice Feb 9th 2009 1:57AM
A lot of you are missing the point. The point is not that it is too overpowered per say, but it should be used more strategically. Devs doesn't want this ability to be macroed to FoL; something that is used everytime the cd is up.
Bossy Feb 9th 2009 2:38AM
Despite having 1900 healing, PUG's do think twice when they take on a Holy Paladin on Heroics.
Now this nerf again. What to do against certain NAX bosses where healing is spammed?
Guess what, I am respeccing DPS for good.
Another healer less, I hope the majority of Holy palas think like this.
It should create a NICE shortage on healers (so EVERYONE will be even more frustrated).
Forget PvP arena's also. Back to the bottom of the lists those pala's.
God why am I even playing this game???
Greench Feb 9th 2009 10:24PM
I am agree, patchwerk is one that needs spam for all of the fight and pala is the best class for it
twh Feb 9th 2009 4:05AM
Increasing the Casting time? That's even worse than the 50% healing penalty. There are ways to change it so the whole class won't suffer, but this isn't one of them.
Tietra Feb 9th 2009 3:33AM
It's fair to say Divine Plea isn't a holy paladin's solution to mana regen. Despite them saying they don't want to tinker with Illumination, I strongly feel they should because it is one of the core talents to the spec. We are theoretically after all, a crit-based healing class and our mana regen should definitely tie into that. Illumination as it currently stands is an inadequate means of replenishing our mana or else we wouldn't be having this issue with Divine Plea in the first place.
Gothia Feb 9th 2009 3:46AM
This is getting so tired - its healers vs. blizzard since wrath. You don't see Dps or Tanks getting class PvE abilities nerf'd so why are they nerfing healers? The penalties for doing you class roll is ridiculous - if your content is being trivialized by the healer that is because your development is trivial. Instead of updating content i.e...more hit points...more this...and more that...NO - that is too hard lets BEND the healer over instead.
Choice #1 - let me go out and try to heal this raid or instance that blizzard doesn't want me to succeed at.
Choice #2 - WoW, my DK does mad dps.
SCREW HEALING...AND SCREW YOU TO BUZZARD!
Another Holy Pally Feb 9th 2009 4:39AM
Why not change DP for Holy Pallies in PVP if its such a problem there and leave it be for PVE with maybe just a longer cooldown? Let us all have a shot at Ulduar before you trivialize us as main tank healers and sideline us with cries of /oom again in longer fights or situations where we end up as the only healer left standing. I'd prefer the cooldown to be twice as long rather than some new nerfed effect gimping my ability to keep the tank up (ie slower cast speed, etc). If they eff it up too much I'll just take it off my spell bar completely. Maybe that is what they envision for us. Nerf the healers.
Don't we healers generally get blamed more than anyone else for wipes? "where were the heals?"
We pally healers are especially greatful for our distinct lack of anything useful in the AOE heal department. Glyph of HL ain't near enough for 25 man AOE dmg imho.
Well at least with Dual Spec I can go back to Ret to blow off some steam. /lol /kek
Just my 2 cents worth.
Bob Feb 9th 2009 5:12AM
I find that the only time I really have to worry about mana, even without using divine plea, is when I'm forced to spam holy light. Once the fight is done I use divine plea to help top up after the fight. Sure I use divine plea during some fights, never in use with avenging wrath, and it does seem that I rarely go oom, but to be fair almost none of the other healing classes seem to be having an issue with mana either.
We are great single target healers, and in some cases can do double duty and heal one target and help with a second using beacon, but we have very limited raid healing. Only one instant cast with a 6sec CD, no hots, no multi target heals, our small heal in good gear only heals for 3500 non crit at 1.5sec cast(unmodified by haste), and our big heal hits hard, but has a much longer cast time. Healing fights like Patchwerk are what we can do, healing Sapphiron can be a nightmare, and trying to heal through multiple ice tombs on Kel'thuzad is almost impossible. We have our place, as do all other healers.
If they want to nerf divine plea they will, and if they do, I hope they give us an instant cast, a hot, or even a judgement that can be used on players. Sometimes it is difficult to switch to a mob, cast a judgement and then get back onto the target you need to heal, and in raids there are many times 3 or more paladins, as only 2 judgements of any use, why not give us a judgement for friendly players that returns mana from heals on that player, increases the effect of heals done to that target, or even combine two things and have the judgement turn 50% of effective healing done by the paladin to that target into a hot. Just something you can do when you see someone needs some life, toss a judgement and a flash heal and they get 3500(300mana) up front with a nice 1750(200mana) HoT on top.
DanH Feb 9th 2009 6:39AM
I appreciate the developers' desire to make the game more strategic, but I'm not sure you can really add strategy with a simple nerf or buff.
It's always going to wind up working one of two ways. Either the healing penalty is big enough that it's not worth using until you run out of mana, or it's not and it's worth using every time it's off cooldown. Either way there's not much actual *strategy* involved. There's likely to always be an optimal point to use it.
As an alternative (and again, I know very little about Healadins) could DP share a cooldown with a bunch of other important-but-secondary Healing abilities (Holy Shock, Divine Favour, Divine Illumination etc). That way it's still there as an option, but using it locks you out of other options (which, I'd argue, is pretty much what strategy is all about).
Logarth Feb 9th 2009 6:54AM
One word..
Patchwerk
Guess us pally healers are screwed there now eh? I hope all you other healers can keep up or have a few disc priests to carry the weight since we'll be OOM even before halfway to enrage timer.
Shiianna Feb 9th 2009 3:10PM
This.
shisho2k Feb 9th 2009 8:16AM
How about:
Divine Plea: Mana regen by 25% over 15 seconds, 20% heal penalty, and each holy spell (or certain types) reduces the duration by 5 seconds.
Then I had an evil thought. What if the debuff was applied to the target you were healing while it was active. I can see it now!!!
Deadly. Off. Topic. Feb 9th 2009 1:46PM
I can see a dead target.
Angus Feb 9th 2009 8:21AM
I don't get these mana regen nerfs anyway.
They changed tanking so it was FUN.
Prior to that you had to worry about resources (rage, mana), your threat, being almost no help to the raid, and if you were able to tank the upcoming boss.
Now rage/mana is almost a non-issue. (mana still is, and this will hurt my tankadin even if they don't see it)
Threat is awesome as I can hold it well as long as I do my thing.
My DPS is half that of a good DPS, which is better than 20%.
Every tank can handle every boss with only small hiccups.
Healers are still in niches, still have glaring holes in what they cannot do, and are required to watch their mana now?!
Healers are harder to find for a reason. If they had given them a revamp like tanks, it would have been different.
cartman Feb 9th 2009 10:17AM
Thank you Taladan, you are absolutely correct.
Tychon Feb 9th 2009 11:36AM
It's wrong for pallies to think that druids and priests get MOST/If not all of there mana return from spirit. In a raid inviroment (Me as a Holy Priest) do not get most of my mana back from spirit, It's nice to have on my gear, but I would rather have more intellect for replenishment I have no MP5, so my in combact mana return is about 296 full raid buffed. OOC its 1k, the problem with that is. besides some fights in naxx where i can AFK which are the only fights that I could consistantly use the 5SR. Almost all healers use int for there mana regen used with replenishment than any other stat.
So people need to get there facts straight. Fact: HOLY Pallies using DP every single time its up is pretty over power, and Blizzard knows that it is and trying to think of a way that it wont nerf the other trees for a paladin.
mana regen is getting nerfed, the only mana regen a pally has is from crits, mp5, intel, DP, glyphs maybe something I over looked. In that respect what if they nerfed pally crits? you would never hear the end of the crying (I would cry too) nerfing DP is nerfing the lesser of 2 evils in my opinion.
Greench Feb 9th 2009 10:24PM
OMG, blizzard is touching pala again?? i don't like the condition that we paladins had during TBC. We were just bufferes, but now we can compete on healing meters and DPS meters.
The thing is by increasing casting time paladisn will focus on haste rating. We will use some kind of trinket that increases the amount of haste rating with like 500.
But if they nerf paladins as they did in TBC..., I think I will stop WOW.
Holycry Feb 10th 2009 6:06AM
I'm a holy pally and this change will be a real problem for me. I'm pretty sure i'm not alone in this case. I explain :
Before WOTLK mana regen was mainly from crits (and not only 60% of the mana) and MP5. Since WOTLK divine plea give us another way to get back our mana. While using this spell each minute its a huge source of mana.
So what i did when i see that ? I remove all my MP5 gear and/or bid only on plate healing item with haste/crit. So today i have about 600 haste, 2100sp,40-50% crits and 0 MP5.
I'm almost never oom and have a very nice casting time with all this haste.
Now they decide to nerf DP. As a pally i'm mainly a tank healer. Do you think its possible to have 15 sec every minute with 50% less healing on the main tank ???? No we will do very bad tank healer in this case.
So what now ?
Do i have to ask to the others healers to replace me every 45sec while i get back my mana ?
Do i have to rebuild my entire set with MP5 ? Yeah three month of naxx/os/maly for nothing....
Or do i have to return on my priest, forget my pally because like usual, priest are buffed and pally get nerf.
Oh btw i forget, this nerf is coming today i see on the 3.0.9 patch notes but WHY other mana regen nerf (for pally/druid) are not inside also ?
Also they waited 3 month before to nerf CoH/WG. They waited less than one week before to nerf our Holy Light glyph.
Blizz why so many hate against holy pally ??!!!!!