The Care and Feeding of Warriors: You Will Be Forced To Conform

In short, I went from ecstatic to that sinking feeling you get when you realize that lovely Everglades condo is in fact just swamp. I'd just told everyone how awesome this change was, and here I stood on test with less AP than I had on live. Was it a huge loss? No, about 70 AP or so. But I still felt that lovely combination of chagrin and slight anger that comes from not only being wrong, but being wrong and finding yourself worse off than you'd been.
To be fair, the change to 20% has brought the AP back up to close to where it was. My warrior on test is lacking a couple of best in slot items that I've picked up since transfering him, which means that to compare them I have to take off bracers and neck and look at the AP from there, but we're talking a 20 AP drop now. The real issue is buffs like Blessing of Might/Battle Shout and procs like Berserking. On the other hand, Blessing of Kings, Gift of the Wild and Horn of Winter/Strenth of Earth just got better for us.
Now Ghostcrawler has waded into the fray, and what he says confirms it: this change is purely meant to force warriors away from wearing leather.
"There is a good chance we may change the Improved Berserker Stance effect from 15% Strength to 20% Strength to make up for all the AP that gets thrown around in buffs, enchants and consumables.
There are also more rings etc. in Ulduar with Strength, and more leather with Agi instead of AP.
Adding 2 more ranks to Armored to the Teeth is also possible, but that would probably be too big a change for 3.1.
We want plate to be the best in slot for warriors, not leather."
To be honest, my first reaction was incredulity. You've made gear throughout the game. You know what stats it has. You know how you design it. How could you have ever been surprised that warriors were choosing to wear leather over plate? You itemize the leather better. Why else would we wear it? DPS warriors don't wear leather because we secretly want to be rogues or druids. We wear it because it gives us the best possible stats. Yes, those are iLevel 226 gloves. There are no iLevel 226 plate DPS gloves. There are no plate gloves as good as those gloves. I'd be a fool not to wear them just because of the material they're made out of, and even after the patch the slight dip in AP I'll suffer compared to plate options won't balance out all the positive stats those gloves give me. I'll be wearing them until clearly superior ones drop in Ulduar.
Furthermore, and Ghostcrawler knows this, leather generally has a better spread of stats than plate does as far as DPS is concerned. When asked "Why is there a narrower distribution of stats on plate? We're drawn to leather because the stats have a better spread. Why can't this approach be adopted for plate? What's the concern?" the response was:
"The root issue is that on the leather we tend to add Agi or AP as that additional stat. The problem is that armor with both Strength and AP is a little silly, and plate with Agi isn't that useful for warriors. So we don't actually have another stat to split. "
Now, the fact that I saw this change and got excited at first colors my reaction to it now. Strength should be good for warriors. And almost all DPS warriors would rather wear plate than leather or mail, and this change definitely puts more oomph onto plate since plate generally has strength. If there are more rings with strength so that we can minimize the amount of straight AP we have to add to our gear, we'll just stack strength and stick to plate. It's certainly one way to solve the problem and it does exactly what they're setting out to do... with some serious pains for those of us who itemized our characters based on the rules as Blizzard had previously provided them to us.
The problem is that this change comes in at the same time as the Titan's Grip change, so that warriors effectively get kicked twice for doing what anyone in our position would do: use the best gear available to do the job. I mean, currently the best 2h weapon in the game has AP instead of strength. I have to say, I doubt I'm going to stop bidding on AP 2h weapons and putting Berserking on them... I'm just going to be angry that I can't get a strength enchant option instead of an AP option.
It's great that Ulduar has more strength rings, really, but that doesn't do anything for us going into that content and suddenly facing both a flat damage reduction and an AP nerf that we can't counteract even with all plate gear, since our AP to bracers enchant has no strength alternative, our ap to gloves enchant has no strength alternative, and our various weapon enchants (Berserking, Massacre) have no strength alternatives. Our best in slot tinket is now Greatness by a country mile, there's not really any debate possible. Grim Toll's looking better than Fury of the Five Flights at this point, I'd definitely consider a Greatness/Grim Toll combo to be about as good as it gets for warriors. An effective 320 AP, with no Imp Zerk bonus, vs almost 50% armor reduction? Greatness provides 216 AP before it even procs and 720 more AP when it procs in 3.1, if there was any debate between it and Fury, that's been settled decisively.
Ghostcrawler even admits that this change means that Arms warriors are still free to wear leather over plate. "7) We realize this change lets Arms off the hook... for the moment." And I guarantee you, as long as a leather piece provides more DPS, it will be worn over plate. Period.
So what's the final countdown here? Well, my analysis is as follows:
Ultimately, this was a change that had to happen if Blizzard doesn't want fury warriors to wear leather gear over plate, (We generally don't choose mail over plate unless we're wearing some trash blue and an epic drops that just destroys it) because there doesn't seem to be any move towards making plate itemization comparable in terms of stat spread to leather. Plate will almost always have four stats (two direct stats and two equips that boost crit, hit, expertise or what have you) and leather will almost always have five. In order to move us away from prefering well itemized leather pieces, Blizzard is changing Improved Berserker Stance so that, like Ret Pallies and DK's, warriors will prefer strength. In the long term, as more Ulduar gear drops and we can get more strength on our DPS gear, this will become a buff for the class.
As we roll into Ulduar, what it means is that the gear you have now effectively resets with patch 3.1. Not only that, because to be honest the AP decrease you're going to see will be minimal at best (right now it's like 20 AP depending on how much leather you're wearing... if you're mostly in plate you may not even see a decrease) but it also changes the way fury interacts with buffs and procs. Trinkets you may have spent a lot of DKP on are suddenly significantly less good. The enchants on your weapons will provide less of a DPS boost. Your neck/cape options are almost certainly not as good, and unless you have two of three DPS rings in the game right now with strength on it one of your rings also isn't as good.
Had this change been in the game before everyone got their Naxx gear, it would have been heralded as a buff. Has this been part of the launch for Wrath we all would have shrugged and paid attention to strength over AP while gearing up. If plate was as well itemized as leather it never would have been an issue in the first place. If we had better strength options for enchants you'd hear almost no discussion of this change now. Because this is a change dropped into the middle of an already nerfing patch for fury, however, what is a long term buff becomes highlighted as a short term nerf. Frankly, I'm at the point where I'm just closing my eyes and bracing myself for that big wave coming in off of Praxis.
What other changes are current in store for us in 3.1? Well, I'm glad you asked, if only to get me off the subject of how much DKP I paid for that Sarth trinket. (It wasn't cheap.)
Arms
- Shattering Throw will now reduce the armor on the target by 20% for 10 sec or remove any invulnerabilities. (Old - reduced armor AND removed any invulnerabilities)
- Bladestorm will now instantly Whirlwind up to 4 nearby targets.
- Juggernaut now affects both Slam and Mortal Strike
- Improved Berserker Stance now increases strength by 4/8/12/16/20%. (Up from 3/6/9/12/15%)
- Improved Defensive Stance now increases Physical damage caused by 5/10% for 12 sec. (Old - melee damage)
I've now written two posts about Imp Berserker, you just managed to hack your way through this one. Do you really want to hear more from me about that? No? Good. Quite honestly, neither do I.
The change to Improved Defensive Stance means that you'll get more damage out of your Thunder Clap and Shockwave. It's a good change, especially combined with the change to Defensive Stance itself. Since you only deal 5% less damage in D-stance as of 3.1, getting more damage on your TC and Shockwave when you Block, Parry or Dodge gets even better. It's a very nice piece of news for tanks concerned about AoE threat.
Thus endeth the post. I'm off to mutter under my breath about believing in rainbows and unicorns too soon. To play us out, commenter Jaxtrasi sings about plate gear. Take us home!
Filed under: Warrior, Patches, Analysis / Opinion, Odds and ends, News items, Talents, (Warrior) The Care and Feeding of Warriors






Reader Comments (Page 1 of 4)
Aracross Mar 27th 2009 1:14PM
The bladestorm change is a buff.
When you use it, instantly whirlwind to 4 nearby target, and then it starts the actual bladestorm.
Is one free and insta whirlwind, nice.
Matthew Rossi Mar 27th 2009 1:28PM
But it instantly whirlwinds NOW.
Friday_Knight Mar 27th 2009 3:58PM
No, not nice you numbskull.
That's how it works now. Nothing is changing. Those damn target caps really need to be taken off.
Please at least TRY to know what you're talking about before posting.
Olicon Mar 27th 2009 5:14PM
I'm sorry, I still don't get it.
So basically you get another Blade Storm Whirlwind in as soon as you Bladestorm someone. Then it's a buff, right?
MacGayver Mar 27th 2009 6:52PM
Nonono! There is no change. It is just a tooltip clarification. The original tooltip suggested the first swing was not a simple whirlwind and therefore hit everything around it. It now clearly states that all swings are whirlwinds.
Nothing changed. Pass on the joint.
Jaxtrasi Mar 27th 2009 10:17PM
I wrote a song about this a few months ago. No, really. It's not a rickroll. It's a song about warrior gear.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPW8nXAEIBk
Jaxtrasi Mar 27th 2009 10:19PM
Oops. Shouldn't have clicked that "confirm" link.
Cthulu Mar 27th 2009 1:16PM
my warrior will love more tanking threat damn FFB mages.
Ramminar Mar 27th 2009 1:16PM
Uh, it was just a tool-tip change for bladestorm, you can stop crying.
Matthew Rossi Mar 27th 2009 1:27PM
Yeah, that whole two lines I dedicated to it. If you're going to tell me to stop crying, at least go after the 1200 words I wrote about Imp Zerk. Sheesh.
Jon Do Mar 27th 2009 1:18PM
Unfortunately, such "make it up as you go" changes as this Improved Berserker Stance change do not inspire much confidence in the designers, and their communication, and the continuity of their design. The gap in Strength enchants / gear shows that this is something relatively new, and if there is a lack of Strength enchants / gear in 3.1 it would be a glaring deficiency in the overall design.
Linearity Mar 27th 2009 1:41PM
Welcome to the world of the Retadin! Currently, strength is the best stat by far for retadins, but it makes gear very frustrating.
"What the crud, why do all of these necklaces and cloaks have AP and agility? Where's my strength!?"
Maybe now that more classes thirst for strength they'll make more offset items that have it.
Heilig Mar 27th 2009 2:06PM
I just don't get why they feel the only stat spread alternative they have for plate is Stamina. I don't need 150 stam on my dps chest. How about we take 50 of that stam away and give me 35 hit rating instead? How hard is that?
GC says plate with AP is silly, but doesn't say why. What's wrong with putting one scaling dps stat and one non-scaling dps stat on the same piece? They already do it with leather and mail, that's why we like leather so much. What makes plate so different? Personally, I think they could get rid of gear problems like this by doing away with the rating system and just using raw stats and common sense. Not hitting very hard? Get some strength. Not making contact very often? Get some intellect and learn how to use your weapon. Hitting hard, but not with the right technique? Get some agility and increase your crit percentage. The game started out that way since it was based off the old Diablo 2 mechanics, but they have just made it too specialized now.
Of course physical DPS classes want leather. There's not a ton of wasted itemization, it's geared toward straight dps with zero survivability. Duh.
If Ghostcrawler can't find something else to put on plate besides strength and stam, he really needs to step down and let someone with a little more imagination take over. They have tons of dps options, they have just chosen not to use them.
Ircasha Mar 27th 2009 3:08PM
"Maybe now that more classes thirst for strength they'll make more offset items that have it."
Unfortunately it looks like they are planning on adding these items in Ulduar . . . which does jack squat for anyone not ready for that content. Everyone else is looking at a nerf due to poor itemization until then.
Erin Mar 27th 2009 1:46PM
As a Fury spec'd warrior, I feel like I've already had to defend my spec. People just assume that because I'm a warrior that I should be tanking... that my DPS won't be as high as a rogue or a hunter, and that makes it harder for me to get invites to groups.
Currently I'm topping most DPS meters with about 3K DPS with 10 man buffs and 3.5K DPS with 25 man buffs. I can hold my own against Rogues, Hunters, Mages and whatever other DPS class thinks they're so great. However, I'm afraid that after 3.1, with it's looming TG nerf and short term AP
erin Mar 27th 2009 1:46PM
(continued...) AP
erin Mar 27th 2009 1:48PM
(apprently I can't use the 'greater than' sign in a comment... opps. Here is the full post)
As a Fury spec'd warrior, I feel like I've already had to defend my spec. People just assume that because I'm a warrior that I should be tanking... that my DPS won't be as high as a rogue or a hunter, and that makes it harder for me to get invites to groups.
Currently I'm topping most DPS meters with about 3K DPS with 10 man buffs and 3.5K DPS with 25 man buffs. I can hold my own against Rogues, Hunters, Mages and whatever other DPS class thinks they're so great. However, I'm afraid that after 3.1, with it's looming TG nerf and short term AP v. Strength nerf, that I'm no longer going to be able to hold my own against these classes... which I'm worried will limit the amount of groups I'll be able to get for Ulduar.
I 100% agree that if this change to AP v. Strength would have been rolled out back in November then I would already have the gear to work with it. Throwing this change out mid-expansion is a mistake, as least in my eyes, and is significantly going to reduce the viability of Fury Warriors in PvE.
Since WotLK I feel like I've been kicked around by Blizzard. First they introduce the DK, which might as well be called Warrior 2.0, and then the continual nerfs came. The only glimmer of hope I've seen so far in this expansion was when they removed the negative cost of TG in the last patch... but now they're putting one back on.
Warriors, as of now, are being pushed into a second class tank/second class DPS role, and it's making it harder and harder for Warriors to be viable end game PvEers. Why get a Fury Warrior when you could have almost any other DPS class giving the same DPS output? What sets the Fury Warrior apart? Why have a Prot Warrior when you could have Pally or DK who can heal themselves, or a Druid with 45K health?
Blizzard needs to take a long look at the PvE game of warriors and decide where we fit in, and which roles we should excel at, because as of right now, the warrior class as a whole isn't standing out in a way that would make a raid leader say "we need a warrior".
zappo Mar 27th 2009 1:46PM
Looking at the bigger picture of where Ghostcrawler is coming from, I agree with the stance they're taking. Warriors are balanced around their items they use being plate. When you have rogues, warriors, hunters and druids all running around with the same gear then suddenly class balance gets a lot harder. This at least seems to be a proactive approach to making sure things don't get out of hand, even farther into this expansion when it would probably hurt even more. Should Blizzard have figured this out before the launch of Wrath? Yes, but it's been 4 years into this game. This sort of thing shouldn't come as a surprise.
Coldbear Mar 27th 2009 1:56PM
Entire post just screams QQ.
You're not entitled to have your gearing priorities stay consistent throughout the entire game.
Are you seriously wanting us to believe that other classes' loot priorities won't change as well in 3.1?
So you spent some DKP on some gear and now wish that you'd spent it on something else. Quit crying and learn to adapt.
Not saying that your post doesn't have some good points, it just reeks of a sense of entitlement and class bias.
If the worst thing you have to worry about is that your enchants don't come with Strenght instead of AP - then you've GOT IT PRETTY DAM GOOD AS FAR AS YOUR CLASS IS CONCERNED.
Matthew Rossi Mar 27th 2009 2:03PM
Where in this post did I say anything about us being entitled to our gearing remaining static? Was it when I said that this was a long term buff to the class? Was it when I pointed out that plate itemization is in fact bad, which is why we often choose leather items, and that this change is basically necessary to make the design goal of getting warriors to use plate DPS gear? I'm curious. Since you seem to have read some other column, maybe you could provide some insight on what the column you read had to say about these things. Did Matthew from Universe B have any ideas I've missed?