The state of Engineering in 3.1

The relevant forum thread has grown to over 1300 replies and more than 50,000 views, suggesting that while Blizz might be satisfied, much of the Engineering community is not.
In fact, many are threatening to drop the profession and take up Jewelcrafting, which is something I hear about a lot. Of course, if your profession is really, honestly inferior to all others, then why is everyone trading up to the same one?
Pass through the break for a list of the upcoming changes, the major gripes, and a comparison of Engineering to other professions in order to put this all into perspective.
Upcoming changes in patch 3.1:
- I hope you like Gnomeregan, because you'll be able to farm it for the schematics for Lil' Smoky and the Pet Bombling, which will be a vast improvement over the previous method.
- Reticulated Armor Webbing will add armor to plate gloves.
- Springy Arcanoweave enchant will turn your cloak into a parachute cloak and grant 18 spell power.
- Flexweave Underlay will also grant 15 agility.
- Nitro Boosts now grant 16 critical strike rating in addition to the speed boost. Activating the boost while holding a PvP flag will cause you to drop it, similar to how a Paladin bubble does.
1) Gnomish and Goblin specializations are too similar. In addition, switching specialties carries a ridiculous penalty.
While this may be true, it is actually true of every profession that has specializations. Blacksmithing specialties were primarily useful in BC, while Leatherworking specialties arguably were never any good.
Alchemy specialization is still viable, and Tailoring cloth specialization helps one produce a bit of extra fancy cloth, but neither of these specs are gear-oriented.
Of course, now that the two specializations are not particularly important, there is no reason for the harsh penalty applied to changing it. Whereas other professions merely lose the special recipes, Engineers lose their entire profession, and have to start from scratch.
2) Ulduar, for all of its machines and vehicles, really should connect with Engineers.
I'm not sure that I can argue this one down. On the one hand, it would be insane to give Engineers some sort of leg up in this raid encounter, especially since Blizzard is trying to stay away from causing players to feel forced into any particular profession.
On the other hand, there are enough Engineers that granting them some special skills might be viewed as akin to something like Replenishment, where the developers could assume most raids will probably have at least one Engineer there to assist with repairs or grant some sort of buff to the group.
At the very least, there should be some new schematics, an Engie-only quest line, a special trainer, or something else that is just for you guys.
3) The profession is good for PvP, but useless in PvE.
As many of the commenters on the forums pointed out, there is more to the game than PvP. I would also like to point out that there is more to the game than raiding.
I don't think that any one profession gives us quality goods for RP, PvP, PvE, questing, leveling, achievement or reputation grinding, etc. Alchemy provides us with dungeon/raiding consumables. Leatherworking, Blacksmithing and Tailoring give you gear that you can use right up until you start to raid, and no further, and their PvP gear is generally inferior to what you could get by simply spending a weekend in the BGs.
This doesn't mean that you don't have any PvE benefits, as you offer repairs and vendors, and even mailboxes, which are extremely helpful. With Ulduar on the horizon, it will be even more important, given the size and length of the encounter, and the fact that we're about to enter a phase of wiping and learning.
You do have some enchants, such as haste to gloves, that really are quite viable for several class-spec combos in PvE encounters.
4) Pets, goggles and other gadgets haven't been updated to be relevant to level 80s.
The devs have always been slow on this point, and it is definitely something that needs to be done.
5) There are plenty of things that could be added or updated that wouldn't exactly be putting Engineers ahead of anyone else. What about new transporters, flares or seaforium?
I completely agree with this.
6) We want better PvE epics and item enhancements.
At the moment, no profession can create epic gear that is actually worth making, at least not if you can get into Naxx, a raid encounter that is currently easily PuGable.
As for item enhancements, adding a method for attaching some of an Engineer's many gadgets onto existing gear was a long time coming. Still, it would be nice if they had one or two unique enchants, aside from the diminished bonuses that have been applied to many of the existing ones.
Since the belt buckle was given to Blacksmiths instead, Tailors can enchant their own cloaks (although my Tailor has no use for any of them) and offer thread for pants, and Leatherworkers have armor, bracer and leg kits, it would be logical at some point in the future to give Engineers something as well.
The main problem may actually be that your existing enhancements overwrite traditional enchants and other item enhancements. While this might work out for PvP, having +18 spell power to a cloak isn't as competitive as some of the other available enchants, although again, a few of the enhancements are actually superior to other enchants for that slot.
Because some of your enhancements are quite viable for PvE, and ideal for PvP, I don't see this as a make-or-break point, especially since the enchants offered by other professions are, for the most part, available to you as well.
Notable points
Despite the show of discontent on the forums, many Engineers are actually quite satisfied with what their profession has to offer, and indeed, are looking forward to a couple of the 3.1 changes. This group includes several of the Engineers on staff here at WoW Insider, and I tend to agree. While I believe that every profession currently has holes and items in need of updating, when put into perspective, Engineering is quite comparable.
It may be that Jewelcrafting is the single best method of making money through a profession in the game, but that would indicate an imbalance as a whole, rather than a direct comment on the state of Engineering.
How do you feel about all of this?
Filed under: Enchanting, Patches, Analysis / Opinion, PvP, Jewelcrafting, Features, Buffs, Enchants, Forums






Reader Comments (Page 1 of 7)
Lex Mar 31st 2009 11:03AM
Same thing with tailoring tbh. Most of the hardcore raiders have switched to jewelcrafting because min-max-(dps)wise tailoring sucks.
Macbook Mar 31st 2009 11:48AM
May be true in live, but in 3.1 the tailoring cloak enchant will be equal to 77 spell power (forgot where I got the math), making it one of the most OP profession-enchants ever.
That's the reason why I am officially keeping Tailoring (I thought of dropping it for JC).
Macbook, http://Moonkin.info
Scott Mar 31st 2009 12:52PM
For any cloth wearer (priest, mage or lock), Tailoring + JC is in my opinion, the best combo. Not only will the 3.1 cloak enchants provide a nice dps/heals boost, but the JC-only gems provide that little boost to your gear.
tagashi Mar 31st 2009 1:41PM
After 3.1, even tailoring will have better DPS boost for my hunter than engineering does. WTF? It will be even worse when they figure out how to get rid of consumable ammo. I really want to switch because of the inferior DPS bonuses engineering brings to the table. It's almost like they didn't even try!
Xtremecow Mar 31st 2009 11:14AM
Am I the only one that thinks Engineers should get a discounted mecho-hog?
Radiophonic Mar 31st 2009 12:03PM
Nope.
Salty Mar 31st 2009 12:19PM
I’d love it if they made a BoP bike with no passenger component and a dramatically reduced cost of vendor-bought mats.
Plastic Rat Mar 31st 2009 10:37PM
Nope, been complaining about this for ages. One of the few cool things in Wrath that could have justified Engineering, and what do they do? It's not iconic to Engineering, it's simply iconic to whoever has the most gold.
How many Engineers do YOU know that are making gold left and right with the profession?
The whole thing about the chopper BOE and price pisses me off like no other.
Davros Mar 31st 2009 11:09AM
Something of note for engineers is that the engineering belt tinkering stacks with the belt buckle. This means you can aoe stun machines while having the extra gem in.
Worcester Mar 31st 2009 2:51PM
Good to point out. I actually had forgotten that.
Personally, I'm pretty happy with my Engineering. Then again, I've always liked it.
I think one thing it really needs is a viable way to make money. The new Potion Injectors were a step in the right direction, but I actually never sold any. And I'm a good salesman. We need a consumable that is useful to many and not too expensive to make. Perhaps a generic injector that can be used with any potion? Some other suggestions...
A permanent repairbot. Even if it has a long CD, it's better than having to continually grind for Outlands materials. I've been in several dungeons where a bot would be useful, but I haven't been to Outlands in months.
New Combat Pets. These were fun at lower levels. Just a small edge, nothing game changing.
A quieter flying mount. Seriously, can I get a glider or at least a Stealth Package for my Copter!
Battlesuits or Siege Vehicles. I just discovered the Jumpbot quest in Icecrown. Wouldn't it be cool to have that available all the time? These enhancements would need to be expensive, and each should have a fairly short time period of use, 5 minutes or less with at least an 8 hour CD.
atomicstrawberry Mar 31st 2009 6:18PM
@worcester:
Why would you need to go to outland? There is a repair bot that takes Northrend mats (10 Saronite bars)
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=40769
HunterFromTheStart Mar 31st 2009 9:46PM
Amen on the quieter mount, just spent gold to get the other one. Was messing up my phone.
As far as profit, has anyone checked out the Mote Extractor lately? Love that thing!!
Siusy Mar 31st 2009 11:16AM
As an engineer, I picked up my trade more for the fluff than the practical use. I took up leatherworking for my practical side. As much as I love my hog and my copter, I would love to see updated level 80 gadgets and pets to add to my collection of toys. That's not saying I wouldn't love to see something practical come out of engineering, but we all know a lot of us took it up for the cool gadgets and gizmos. :P
SaintStryfe Mar 31st 2009 11:38AM
the problem is even the "FLuff" isn't fun any more. I never minded doing less damage with my profession. I hated the fact that there was nothing NEW with it.
tanknspank Mar 31st 2009 3:45PM
When I took engi it WAS practical, but that was back when you could use it to reflect spells, run flags, stun foes, drain mana, and blast them with a death ray.
Jack Spicer Mar 31st 2009 11:12AM
I'm not going to argue that you can't make money with Jewel crafting, but it is no where near as lucrative as it was in TBC.
BitterCupOJoe Mar 31st 2009 11:28AM
Agreed. I make far more money from blacksmithing, enchanting and inscription than I do jewelcrafting. That's not to say that JC isn't profitable; for the price of 5 minutes a day I can make 200g selling dragon's eyes, and that's great. But that's once a day. If I want to spend a little time farming, I can make 3-4 times that in an hour with one of my other professions, depending on luck.
Daniel Mar 31st 2009 12:33PM
I don't think you can talk about the money making aspect of the professions without talking about the horrible way that Bliz manages the economic aspects of the game. If there is one true, really hard core complaint about WoW, it's that almost no account is ever taken about the in-game economic impact of decisions.
On my server, in Classic WoW epics were selling 500-700g. In TBC they were selling 2-3 times that between 1500-2000g. In Wrath, epics are selling between 3-4 time that at 6000-9000g. That not merely incredible inflation, it progressively worse inflation.
On example is the way Wrath has nerfed TBC gathering professions to the bone. Adamantite ore is selling for 13g while thorium ore is selling for 60-70g. Sure it's the law of supply and demand, but its simply crazy when ore that in-game is supposedly more valuable (it takes a higher skill and and a higher level to mine) actually goes for a 5x less than less valuable ore. Even silver ore goes for much more than a adamantite.
So I really don't want to hear JC and Engineers cry. Stop being so narrow-minded and realize that problem isn't with just your professions, it's that the developers don't care about the impact of their decisions on the in-game economic: they never have and they never will. It's not what WoW is about.
Starforsaken Mar 31st 2009 1:14PM
To Daniel. Your point doesn't work or you've never really been a miner. Mining adamantite is easy, it's almost everywhere in outlands and you can use a flying mount, something that's hard to live without when you've tried it.
Thorium can only be found in a few zones in old WoW and you have to use your normal mount which is a pain. And let's face it, you level a lot faster from 48 to 58 than 58 to 68, so you'll spend less time in old WoW (where thorium is) and there's no point staying there once you can go to outlands, so the window of opportunity to mine thorium/truesilver/etc. is a lot smaller. You can't really blame that on blizzard since I doubt they'll either allow flying mounts in old world and no one wants a longer grind from 48 to 58, so you're stuck with those prices.
As for the epic prices, I guess it depends on your server. On mine, the mats are selling for more than the epics I can craft on my BS/JC/Tailor/Engineer (got a lot of alts). The cooldown on titansteel should've been much longer because those bars went from 450g to 80g in no time, and stuff like titansteel destroyers sell for around 800g.
Anyway, long story short, you got it all wrong with your rant about economics. As for me, I like engineering a lot, even if we don't get enough changes. I love my mote extractor, my repair bots are a huge time saver on progression raids, and I still sport my googles + hands enchant. Oh and when I'm in a hurry, that mailbox is pretty cool (though the CD should be shorter) and those teleports are useful when guildies need help (though we' d need more portals).
I'm keeping engineering for sure, and hopefully we'll get more stuff in 3.2 : )
ninjasuperspy Mar 31st 2009 11:13AM
I said this on mmo-champ and I stand by it.
Some guy says something, and I respond thusly.
I agree with you, and this is from somebody who dropped Armorsmithing for Engineering when they released that fantastic Force Reactive Disk (Which I never did get). My basic point being that the Boot Tinker and the goggles are OK starting points, but need work to be really competitive. The cloak enchant is a big letdown. I was hoping for goggle upgrades in Ulduar. The place is full of Titan tech, so a Titansteel Goggle Tier 2 wouldn't be out of the question. It seems they are holding off on that or not doing it at all.
But then I was waiting for most of BC for an upgrade to the Dragonling (or any of the combat "pets": Sheep, Harvest Reaper, etc), Discombobulator, Reflectors, EZ-throw dynamite, Mind Control Cap, Deep Dive Helmet, Shrink Ray, Death Ray, Cloaking Device, Target Dummy, Flash Bomb or Universal Remote. Effects drop off after level 60 and we don't get a replacement? Thanks. Would it have killed them to give us a Fel Cannon, Mini-Fel Reaver or Khorium Nether Dragon? A Discombobulator that turns a player into a Broken? Where are my crazy whacked out trinkets that fill up a toolbox with something that isn't more motes or Ichors of Undeath? I'd like gem slots on the trinkets, but I'm not greedy. One gray slot no socket bonus.
Things I would like to see for Engineering:
* More of the stuff I just mentioned. Skip the Broken Transmogrifier, make the new one turn your target into a Mechagnome. Add more gimmick grenades. For instance, a Blight Bomb that releases a short acting cloud of yellow poison as Drakuru does when you fight him. I loved the Arcane Bomb, upgrade that.
* A daily quest system. Something where your trainer (Goblin or Gnomish) in Dalaran gives you a mission to upgrade an existing recipe. Like so: "I'd love to make a Gnomish Cloaking Device that worked up here in Northrend, but the wind whips through you when you are cloaked. Bring me two Cloaking Devices, one cloak of any type and five arctic furs." We can either end it there or add a second step where the quest guy hands you the device and asks you to test it a few times. Boom. Daily quest. That wasn't so hard. Repeat with existing engineering devices and ore/leather/gems from Northrend. You get GEEK (Or MEGA) Inventor Commendations. You spend them with your guy to get upgraded engineering stuff.
* Modify the failure system: from here on out, things only fail if you have below a determined level of engineering. Yes, non-engineers can use engineering gadgets. Keep the Goggles BoP, I do like an "Engineering Badge" but every dang thing you make shouldn't be engineer only. Especially with the death of ammo somewhere on the horizon.
* Clean up the recipe list. There are what, three "Misc" headings? I can't find a thing in there without that wide profession window add-on.
* Faction Recipes. I want to grind faction with people for things other than Arcanums and the odd bit of plate armor. Holy Hand Grenade from the Argents is almost a no brainer. An upgraded flame thrower or dragonling from Wyrmrest. A weak Warstomp-style Boot Tinker (+AP Passive) from the Sons. A weapon tinker (Gyroscopes that increase +hit and Dodge?) from the Knights of the Ebon Blade. I'm making this up off of the top of my head as I am typing this.
In short, passive buffs from the tinkers are good. These bonuses (bonii?) are barely acceptable. If there are upgraded versions, that is great as long as they don't drop from Arthas. This profession still has a long way to go until it is even half as useful to the player as any of the non-Gathering professions.