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All of the latest Mists of Pandaria newsDedicated dual wield tree for Death Knights a possibility
by Alex Ziebart 
Apr 7th 2009 at 7:00PM
A few days ago, Bornakk responded to yet another thread regarding dual wielding for Death Knights. I read it, shrugged, moved on with life, but I found myself digging up the thread again because I started to warm up to the idea Bornakk put forth: They're considering (that's the key word here) "something like making the frost tree the dual-wield tree" and letting the strikes hit with both weapons like Mutilate and Stormstrike.Bornakk says balancing both Dual Wielding and 2Handers in each talent tree has been exceptionally challenging, and I think we've seen that firsthand. Talents aimed for one build make their way into another, and things quickly get out of hand. Turning one of the trees specifically into the Dual Wielding tree (whether it be Frost or Unholy or whatever) is something I can get behind, even if it runs counter to what they've been trying to do with the talent trees since the Wrath beta.
Allowing all three talent trees to tank and DPS depending on point allocation isn't that much of a stretch, but I think that trying to make them great tanking trees, dual wielding trees, and 2H trees does stretch things a little thin. Having one dedicated Dual Wield tree along with dedicated 2Hander trees would probably make the individual specs stronger overall in the long run.
I admit that it would probably suck to be the Death Knight that loves the 2Handed Frost play style and gets that pulled out from under them because it became the dual wield tree, but I still can't help but feel it would be better for the overall design of the class. Assuming they can keep Dual Wielding and using a 2Hander roughly equal as far as DPS goes, anyway.
Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Death Knight
Reader Comments (Page 3 of 3)
Liltimmy Apr 7th 2009 11:17PM
That's how it's implemented now, with Nerves of Cold Steel (http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=50138) being the only true DW talent, and it's in the second tier of Frost. Having the talent this high up has allowed for the tri-spec DW builds that have been really successful with appropriate gear.
So if they did scatter a few DW talents around the top tiers of all specs, you would continue to see people speccing into all three trees, rather than just one, which seems to be their goal.
jdryner Apr 8th 2009 11:12AM
Yeah, I saw that the DW option is in the 2nd tier of the Frost tree. Do you think it would be better if it were an option that you decide when you create the DK, or better yet, a free class power?
- Coldmeiser (Human DK, Drenden)
turkeyspit Apr 7th 2009 8:18PM
Nice to see Blizzard is catching up to what the community has been saying since..oh I dunno...Beta...
Heaven Apr 7th 2009 8:22PM
They'll make it so people can DW tank.
You can all relax. They will change a few things here and there, and they'll make it so people have more options. It'll be strange and it'll be new but it'll be OK.
Chances are they'll change Frost Strike to hit with both weapons, and that's it.
sneakums Apr 9th 2009 1:46AM
i think its BS. as if they weren't OP enough, an attack similar to a rogues Mutilate or an enhancement shammy's Stormstrike is retarded. they're completely capable of dual wielding well right now.
shoxwave Apr 7th 2009 8:59PM
the end of fury warriors. delete the toon now!!!
Mersu Apr 8th 2009 9:34AM
Noooo!!! I just got my Titan's Grip!
Malagarr Apr 7th 2009 9:34PM
I've been starting to think along these lines as well. I believe it's possible to make DW more viable for Frost without hurting 2h Frost, though. If Frost Strike was adjusted to hit with both weapons, and a talent was implemented that caused Obliterate to hit with both weapons, that might solve the problem with DW dps.
Of course, they could just scale strike percentage damage on weapon speed instead, but I guess that could get too complicated?
I really enjoyed DW DPSing on my DK. Even with the nerfs coming in 3.1 I plan on keeping a DW build for DPSing. But I really hope they find a way to keep DW DPS viable for DKs.
Wulfkin Apr 7th 2009 9:42PM
As long as it doesn't mess up my frost tanking viablitiy, sure, why not? Hell I'd even take DW frost tanking. Just as long as I can frost tank.
Kibre Apr 8th 2009 3:11AM
IMO Merciless Combat rank 2-Your Icy Touch, Howling Blast, Obliterate and Frost Strike do an additional 12% damage when striking targets with less than 35% health. In addition your Obliterates and Frost Strikes hit with your Main and Off-hand.
Merciless Combat is deep enough to say keep going frost, two of the abilities are deep frost so you want Frost Strike for sure for your Talent, and Howling Blast mainly for AoE damage, because now dual wield DK's are droppin' obliterates like their hot. 0/44/27 type builds can still be used, Howling Blast is no longer a MUST as we still have Unholy blight at 21 in Unholy as well as Pest and Blood Boil....
I think I solved this?
Haven Apr 7th 2009 11:25PM
In fact, as a zealous 2h-hater and dw-lover, I would agree to that change... partially. DK class design this far allows flwxibility which was unheard of before in WoW. I actually pity the warriors beause their playstye is tightly bound to their specs - wanna tank? - here's your 1 tanking build, over. Wanna dw - here's your dw build, you don't need more.
I don't know why people hate dw-ing DKs so much and why they had so little love from devs. In a perfect world, each tree would have deep talents that bring dw on par with 2h without perversions like trispec we had to take to make our dps even competitive to dps in any oof 2h builds.
As of 3.1, dw-ers get a huge slap in the face because we will actually be limited to Unholy - and it's still unclear whether it'll be worth it. Is it REALLY that hard to balance 2h and dw damage, anyway?
Vorenus Apr 7th 2009 11:59PM
This is gonna suck for me if it happens, I'm the Frost 2-hand DPS death knight. I wouldn't mind DW'ing, I just have to get the weapons for it.
Gigaw Apr 9th 2009 4:00AM
Just make it so we can dual weild 2h!
We are the "Hero" class after all.
How long does a DK have to spend both in service of the Lich King and fighting against him to get "You can now dual weild 2h's! Now kick the Lich Kings ass!" appear on his screen?
Jyotai Apr 8th 2009 2:01AM
Just as long as they don't make it unholy.
I happen to like unholy tanking, but I dislike dual wielding enough that even my enhance shaman spent a year and a half without it. Just do not like the look of a dual wielding toon.
Personally, I could do without dual wielding DKs, but well, guess they've gotta keep that crowd happy too.
bigbadbeasty Apr 8th 2009 7:18AM
Overall I am not a fan of DW'ing Deathknight, particularly those attempting to tank. Personally I think that 'if' they choose to make one tree DW it should be Blood.
DW is poor for tanking (many of the reasons have already been mentioned), the Frost tree is the one with the most mitigation talents, making it a primary tank solution. Mixing these would seem unwise.
As Blood is without a doubt the worst tanking tree, perhaps it would be better to chuck the DW talents in there.
But tbh, as long as I can remain Unholy 2H tank, I will be happy.
DeathPaladin Apr 8th 2009 11:47AM
"Blood is without a doubt the worst tanking tree"
Sartharion and his 3 friends disagree with you.
Joelock Apr 8th 2009 7:18AM
nowhere did they say if they made frost the 'dw' tree would they remove or change the talents that allow it to be a 2h dps or tank spec....
you guys are all crying so bad about change, change is a good thing, go look at where classes started out in vanilla wow and look at where they are now. DKs dont have 4 years of tuning under their belt, anyone that cant handle some class mechanic shifts here and there needs to stop playing their DK asap.
cougar3429 Apr 8th 2009 11:53AM
I think blood is more apt to be a DW spec, as it's used more for leveling. It would fall better in line with the other classes that have their melee dps spec for leveling such as Shaman, Warriors, ret Pallies, etc. The same rules would apply to it, where heart strike and death strike was used by both weapons. The DK would have a dps/leveling build, tanking, and pvp builds. This would be more like the other classes.
DW-Awesomeness Apr 9th 2009 2:58PM
I think this is a completely awesome idea. Buffing duel-wielding is a changed and something that two handed users would have to get used to but it was also never stated that Two-Handed dps frost was taking a nerf... so just complaining about it now is the same as saying two-handed sucked before.
Put into regards also that people have been complaining about the 'nerf' to howling blast and how much damage frost lacks, but now that it is semi getting dps back, and especially for duel-wielding which was taking the biggest nerf from it... people are complaining again? That makes no sense to me but okay... It's not like they said "hey let's move Howling back so they can get both that AND Unholy Blight".. or well, before this turns into a rant...
Idea, For It... 2hand dps, same as before, DW yaaaay we can actually keep up again?