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4-24-2009 @ 12:37PM
@ Trogdor7"If you didn't know what you were doing, you could get carried through Naxx 25, die on every fight, and come out with a few best in slot epics. In 10 man, it's much harder to carry people, assuming the people doing the carrying are actually in 10 man gear."It's a false assumption to use Naxx25 as an example of this problem. The reason Naxx25 was easier than Naxx10 in a lot of places were due to scaling issues inherent to larger raids (a larger buff pool, the scaling efficiency of group heals in a 25 man, poor design of boss abilities relative to 10 man raids, etc.) and Blizzard has already admitted several times that this was a mistake that they will not repeat.If you've been in Ulduar at all, on both settings, you'll notice that the encounters are noticeably more difficult on 25 man and, in particular, more demanding of good raid coordination, which Blizzard finally realized is the weak point of larger raids and the best way to adjust difficulty vs. larger raids. However the people who have found 10 man to be considerably easier than 25 man also will have tended to overgear the instance (read: bringing Naxx25 gear to Ulduar10). Unfortunately, I'm one of these people so I can't comment on the difficulty of 10 man in 10 man appropriate gear. However given the level of difficulty even in 25 man gear I suspect it would be appropriately difficult for mostly ilevel 200 geared raiders on 10 man."The solution, to me, is to maintain the gear disparity, but lower it. Instead of having gear be a full tier (13 itemlevels) apart, they should be somewhere around 7."This is exactly how Ulduar works."If having to organize 25 people is the reason that 25 mans have better loot, why does anyone but the raid leader (and class/role leaders, etc.) benefit from that? If your job is just to show up, you didn't put in any more effort showing up to a 25 mand than to a 10 man."Not true. It's incumbent on every member in a (serious PvE) 25 man guild to maintain good raid attendence as that guarantees a steady flow of boss kills because the raid leaders don't have to teach a larger pool of players how the encounter works. That's much harder to do with 25 people than it is for 10. It's also harder to keep the depth on the bench that you need in a 25 man guild, but if you *do* have enough then the pressure to compete on each individual raider is also higher. If the guild is consistently downing bosses, then all members are doing a good job. Raiders are forced to coordinate with a larger number of players in 25 man groups, which in the current iteration of 25 man raids is naturally the way these encounters are built to scale in difficulty.So it is more difficult to "just show up" to 25 man raids, at least if you want your 25 man group to succeed. Yes, the opportunity to carry people still exists, and will always exist because there are parts of encounter design that simply cannot be changed to maintain the same level of difficulty for 10 people as much as 25 people without making the encounter frustratingly hard or impossible for the 25 man group. However with Ulduar I think Blizzard has found a good balance between the difficulty of 10 man vs. 25 man.
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