Should every class be a hybrid?

Should this be the case? Or should the remaining four 'pure' DPS classes... the Rogue, Mage, Warlock, and Hunter... be given the same 'hybrid' flexibility as the other six? We've seen great changes from the old days especially with the release of Wrath of the Lich King bringing real viability for hybrid classes to fulfill whatever role they spec and gear for, especially with tanking and healing: each tanking class can perform the MT role, for instance, although each can be said to have strengths and weaknesses to some degree in certain aspects (Warriors and Druids struggle with AoE tanking compared to Paladins and DK's, for instance). Some healing classes excel at group healing, others at tank healing, but all should be more than capable of solo healing a five man and all are valuable in raids.
Where this breaks down is in the case of DPS. Since there are no classes that can only tank or only heal (how would a 'pure healing' class ever solo anything? Heal themselves until the mobs got bored and dropped their loot in frustration? Go team cleric indeed) it's not seen as unbalancing if all the tank classes are at parity or as close as is possible with different abilities and different encounters. After all, even if there are four classes competing for your role you can always choose to respec to a different one, or at least that's the logic usually seen. But since the DPS classes only DPS, and can't respec to a different role, you have to give DPS classes a small edge as DPS so that they won't get swamped. After all, only four classes can tank out of ten, and only four classes can heal out of ten, but all ten can DPS. You need to give the pure DPS classes an edge if they're going to stay worthwhile.
The difference between hybrid DPS and pure DPS classes in Wrath was deliberately reduced. Whereas before, the pure DPS classes were expected to always be on top and be well ahead of other classes, now it's expected to be close so that a skilled, well geared player of a hybrid class should be able to put out competitive DPS especially when compared to a less skilled player of a DPS class. This does, however, lead to the idea that we're still seeing a hierarchy here: if you choose one of the four 'pure' DPS classes, and are as geared and skilled as a hybrid player, you should almost always have an edge on that player.
Since WoW abandoned the idea that there was one tanking class and two classes that could offtank or trash tank, and abandoned the idea that there was one main healing class and three 'also rans' that can heal if there's no cloth wearing healer available, it seems to me that it's time to abandon this last vestige of the old design. There's no reason that the choice you made at level 1 should help or hinder your DPS automatically any more than it should hamper your tanking ability or healing ability. If you choose to be a DPS player, you should be on as close a playing field as Blizzard can maintain while still keeping the classes flavor distinct and mechanics independent. But how to go about this?
Give all classes a secondary role at the minimum. Paladins and Druids will of course remain the ultimate hybrids, with the ability to fulfill all three roles in a raid, and perhaps Shamans can gain tanking viability too, but more importantly the four 'pure' classes will be given a role that fits their flavor and abilities. Since of the four DPS classes in question we have two pet classes, it's not hard to imagine Hunters and Warlocks becoming Tank/DPS with a revamp of the Beast Mastery and Demonology trees. But what about Mages and Rogues?
One possibility would be to break the trinity of DPS, tank and healing up in some way. We already see this to some extent as the physical DPS vs. magical DPS argument, or the ranged vs. melee one, but there's also the concept of mezzing/debuffing that other MMOs are more distinct about. WoW has this in the form of CC like polymorph and sap and debuffs like Curse of Elements or Blood Frenzy, but these tend to be stripped down in current play. In the current edition of the pen and paper Dungeons and Dragons game (which heavily borrows from MMOs) there are four roles, defenders (roughly analagous to WoW tanks), leaders (effectively the game's 'healing' classes), strikers (the damage dealers) and Controllers, who specialize in damaging or inconveniencing groups of mobs and fit into the mezzer/debuffer category.
Both the WoW Rogue and Mage could fill this role. You could spec to be a pure damage dealer with minmal crowd control and debuff options, or spec into talents that increase your ability to slow/root/ snare and weaken your enemies. Mages would by necessity be the stronger at area debuffing/mezzing while rogues would specialize in single target, which would probably mean they'd need stronger debuffs and more ways to apply them. In order for this to work, of course, we'd need to move away from AoE tanking as it currently stands: in effect, mages and rogues would assume some of the burden for controlling and debuffing groups of adds to keep them from swarming a group that is currently the role of the AoE tank using Thunder Clap, Swipe, Consecrate or Death and Decay. In a way, it would be a step back to the days when a five pull in Blackrock Spire meant three mobs would have to be CC'd. As such, I don't know if it would work in the current game, but the game has changed in the past to allow classes to gain new roles, it could do so again. Abilities like Tricks of the Trade point to one way we could allow rogues to help AoE tanking by giving their threat to other players.
In the end I wouldn't expect any such sweeping changes anytime soon. We already have a lot of classes in World of Warcraft who can do more than one role in a group, it's possible that's all we need.
Filed under: Druid, Hunter, Mage, Paladin, Priest, Rogue, Shaman, Warlock, Warrior, Analysis / Opinion, Odds and ends, The Burning Crusade, Death Knight, Wrath of the Lich King
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Reader Comments (Page 4 of 10)
Alaw Apr 30th 2009 2:36PM
^THIS
I was going to make a snarky statement about it but your much more appropriately worded comment covers my feelings on the subject.
malovane Apr 30th 2009 2:47PM
@26 MMO's really borrowed more from MUDs and just added graphics to the existing open-world text based rpg system. MUDs certainly pulled heavily from D&D at first and branched out from there. However, the current generation of D&D, 4th edition, very heavily pulls from the MMO role based system of tanks, healers, mezzers, and dps.
4th ed D&D warriors and paladins work as tanks.
Clerics and Warlords as healers.
Rogues, rangers, and warlocks as dps.
Wizard as the mezzer.
The entire 4th ed system is very MMO-ish in its design. Encounter powers and such could very well be buttons on an action bar. There certainly wasn't as much of a focus on those rolls in 2nd or 3rd editions of D&D. All you basically had in those systems were dpsers and meat bags who still generally did just as much dps. At the very least, the roles weren't as hardlined as in 4th ed.
Omestes Apr 30th 2009 3:22PM
Nope, he has it right. D&D 4th ed has very little to do with original D&D, AD&D, or even all the 3rd ed increments. 4th ed looks like a MMO, none of the ones previous did.
Yes, MMOs (and basically all fantasy games) borrowed heavily from D&D, but that doesn't keep D&D (WotC specifically) from borrowing heavily from them in turn.
D&D four obviously doesn't do it for me, I like my MMOs to be MMOs, and my table tops to be full of rules and versatility. and THAC0, tons of glorious THAC0.
JacquesStraw Apr 30th 2009 2:16PM
@5: "I think that's the issue with a lot of "pures" these days. Hybrids got a notable boost with the expansion and pures only received a marginal one to compensate."
This is exactly right. I think that the mistake that's been made here is in Blizzard saying "OK, hybrids *can* DPS, so we have to balance them so that they can DPS just as well as a pure DPS class", rather than saying "We should make our encounters such that complimentary hybrids can help each other make up for the shortcomings of a pure role class." If Moonkins can DPS just as well as a Mage, why would anyone bring a Mage? It's like a Moonkin without the ability to shift out and help heal and without the ability to go bear and pick up adds...
Indy Apr 30th 2009 2:19PM
Wow I am getting so sick of these Pure Vs. Hybrid debates. Simple you play the class you want to play. Nobody should be forced into a role that they don't want to play (ex. Paladins wanting to DPS before this expansion yet being forced to heal). In the end it doesn't matter anyways how much dps you deal anyways (unless its a enrage boss but thats the exception) but if your dps just "stay out of the fire" so you doesn't strain the healers. Doesn't matter if your #1 or #5 on the meters, if you don't wipe then it was a sucessful boss fight.
Rustbeard Apr 30th 2009 2:18PM
If I had a gold for every time someone asked me "Can your pet tank? The DK/Pally isn't specced/geared for it." Seriously, he's a DPS pet, I'm a MM Hunter. Net result: I'm referred to as Tank Hunter in my guild.
And no, I never said that usually ended well.
Josin Apr 30th 2009 2:18PM
So far as I've seen, Warriors are the only class to get hit with the "hybrid DPS tax."
tim Apr 30th 2009 2:20PM
I dunno, it seems like they've already pushed a little of that with Locks, Mages, and Hunters.
We each seem to have abilities or pets that would lend towards off-tanking, and have been used in that way in the past. Personally, if something like this were to happen I'd like to see locks and mages get the tanking abilities (demonology locks and frost mages) while Hunters and Rogues get pushed into a healing roll (perhaps allowing Hunters to tame Treants or Fairie Dragons for healing purposes, while giving Rogues a form of battlefield triage involving bandages, potions, anti-venoms, and surgical repair).
But I'd prefer they be left well enough alone. Particularly good Locks and Mages will be able to off-tank certain encounters every so often, so it's nice to have that to work towards.
Gneblefelbin Apr 30th 2009 2:23PM
Well, warlocks can already tank although they can't sustain the amount of hits a normal tank can. Metamorphosis is awesome and if we chose gear for the role or had a conversion of say spirit into avoidance it would probably work well as a tanking form if you could stay that way.
Rogue evasion tanking is too RNG dependant. Get hit twice in a row you are toast and long periods of taking no damage then a huge spike in damage won't cut it.
Mages could heal by casting shields and prevention spells on players and raid heal with a form of poly that rapid healed you but you cannot cast spells while it is up. If it replenished mana at the same time it would be a very different type of healing but might be hard to balance out.
Pet tanking seems to be something Blizz frowns upon based on the nerf to the warlock VW's tanking Sartharion with a nice 80k buffed hp in raids. I don't expect to see that come back any time soon.
Sorrowind Apr 30th 2009 2:25PM
As a recovering dps meter addict, I think dps need to let the obsession go. I rolled a resto shaman after rogues got nerfed below DKs and Fury Warriors in 3.1. I've not gone back to the rogue for raiding since I'm guaranteed a raid spot as resto. I turned off recount; it doesn't matter. Kill the boss before I run out of mana or we die - that simple. I don't care who contributes more to that.
Oh, and stop whining about hybrid dps or elemental shamans will stop dropping totem of wrath. No one's complaining about 5% crit huh? hybrid buffs ftw!
Wolftech Apr 30th 2009 2:26PM
This is why dual specs are a bad design flaw. It screws the pure classes.
And I would like to add, there is only 2 pure DPS classes. Hunters and Warlocks have pets that make it possible for them to Tank. I have seen Voidwalkers and hunter pets tanking 5 mans, so the fact they can do that (all be it, not very well) leaves only Mages and Rogues as pure DPS.
Solution? Double our DPS.
smiley Apr 30th 2009 3:45PM
mayeb pre3.1... but now even BM hunters and demo locks have shitty HP on thier pets... pets started tankign sarth 3-d over blizzard's precious pet DK's so the got the nerfbat out and beat away at em.. now they just do dmg
Norah Apr 30th 2009 2:27PM
This is a sad, tired, boring debate. People play what they want, if "pure" classes had wanted options it says right on the character create screen that druids and paladins can fill multiple roles. Not to mention how would it even work? Rogues healing with the power of um . . . whining? (I kid of course) But seriously, the 4 "pure" classes dont lend themselves to do anything but DPS in the scope of the lore. Besides, i think its ok that their are 4 tank classes, 4 heal classes, and 10 dps classes, look at most raid make ups, 2-3 tanks, 5-6 healers and a butt load of dps.
Jason Apr 30th 2009 2:26PM
I fail to see the reason to turn Mages, Warlocks, Rogues and Hunters into a hybrid class. These classes have plenty of versatility within their own niche to keep play interesting. I don't feel left out of healing or tanking when I play my Mage or Warlock, when I play those toons I have one goal - make things die fast without (hopefully) generating more threat than the tank -and I do it well. If I want versatility I'll get on my Pally or Drood.
steve Apr 30th 2009 2:29PM
Personally, I'd just like to see pure DPS classes do more damage than hybrid classes. Right now, I'm seeing kitties at the top of the DPS meters.
Frank Apr 30th 2009 3:41PM
^^ this.
seriously, i am tired of being topped in damage by the kittehs.
mike Apr 30th 2009 2:30PM
Mage healers?
Rogue tanks?
Yes please.
CC class?
Hmm pass...
MadMac10 Apr 30th 2009 2:34PM
To me this is the most important issue I've faced since Wrath came out. Look, I like to play a Hunter, and actually that's all I like to play (nothing against any of the other classes, I have very much respect for tanks & healers especially--I just hate to play them.) Ever since WC2, I built ranks of rangers and pwned all I could that way. I just love to pew-pew!
During BC, I was often designated CC in instances. I started out pretty terrible and endured tons of "L2P." Well, using the relatively limited resources of a hunter, I took much pride in improving trapping and misdirection. Then Wrath came out and nobody gave a damn about CC any more.
Which was ok at first, because my DPS topped the charts. My gorilladin could off-tank. Life as a hunter was pretty good. Then came the nerfs. Now I cannot find a place to excel, except in grinding. QQ!
I certainly don't want to take anything away from hybrids. I think what's been happening with shamas and druids have made instance encounters much more interesting and diverse. I just wish more thought could be put into the ranged DPS especially. I think it is incredibly limiting to consider classes in one or two of four or five different roles. There is probably another role that hunters could fulfill that nobody has thought of yet--though I really wish we could revisit CC. Failing that, please give me back my uber-DPS. I promise I won't use it in PVP.
Glamdr1ng Apr 30th 2009 2:34PM
Battlemages Go!
FFTARoxorz05 Apr 30th 2009 2:36PM
Apparently the author forgets that DnD is a turn-based game, so cc is rather broke (controllers can move allies/enemies favorably and such), while in WoW that wouldn't work at all. Yay the mob's over there, now its just running back. You also forget Frost spec and Subtlety spec, cc-heavy builds that no one uses because you won't get into raids with them.
Some of these articles lately are just silly.