The end of vanilla WoW
by Mike Schramm 
May 4th 2009 at 8:00PM
We've heard about suggestions of vanilla servers before (and Blizzard has flatly stated that they have no plans for them), but here's a new twist: Nomnom on Korgath says that Blizzard should finally, once and for all, abandon the old world. He says that leveling from 1-60 is a pain, even with the changes and recruit-a-friend (and on that, I agree -- my Paladin is level 50 and staying there, because leveling is boring), and that Blizzard should just start all new characters at level 55, especially if you've already got a 70+ character. They already did it with Death Knights, and those have worked their way into the endgame just fine.That idea's definitely been batted around before, and anyone leveling an alt can definitely see the benefits. But think of what you're giving up with a new rule like that: Deadmines, Wailing Caverns, Scarlet Monastery. All of the epic quests and reputations, all of the great old-world vistas and settings. Plus, new players to the game will find the old world even emptier than it already is -- everyone who has a high level character will already be leveling through Outland or Northrend.
Do we really want to abandon the old world for good? Blizzard doesn't think so -- Palehoof unofficially suggests that Blizzard is happy with the subscription fees for the two weeks it takes you to level your character, and Bornakk officially says that Blizzard is happy with the way things work now, and if they see a problem, they'll fix it. You have to think that they'll eventually allow this kind of "powerleveling" in some way -- as we move closer to level 100, it'll just be silly bothering with the lower levels considering how far ahead the new content is. But for now, you'll have to stick to leveling the old-fashioned way, because vanilla WoW isn't going anywhere.
Filed under: Patches, Analysis / Opinion, Blizzard, Buffs, Death Knight
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 12)
isma May 4th 2009 8:04PM
bye bye vanilla!
Quickshiv May 5th 2009 2:04AM
I completely dissagree with this ... sort of lol
Phase it all and retune it. Let me go back now at 80 and make all the old dungeons level appropriate with new loot. Even the 40 mans.
JamieG May 5th 2009 2:39AM
^
This.
Viper007Bond May 5th 2009 3:43AM
Quickshiv, your mind is deceiving you.
Everyone loves the cartoons and other TV shows from when they were a kid. However if you go back and watch them, you'll realize they're complete crap.
The same goes for instances. Take Naxx for example. Ever wipe on Thad and have to run back? Man oh man what a pain. Now consider Ulduar: if you wipe on Yogg, it's literally a 10 second walk as the teleporter is 2 feet from his room.
Blizzard only has limited time and I for one would much rather they develop new instances like Ulduar rather than recycling old, poorly designed instances.
Blizzard has learned a LOT over these past years (think how much better leveling in Northrend is compared to Azeroth).
fables429 May 5th 2009 4:00AM
Leveling is one of the many terrible things about this game, if not the worst.
1. It does not does not support playing with your friends. Because if your friends start leveling faster then you, you have to solo quest because they are too far ahead. Also soloing is faster. The recruit a friend thing seems nice (if you find someone to recruit in the first place), but requires your "friend" to be within 3 levels of you.
2. It is terribly boring, I hated it the first time I did it. That would mean the second time I would hate it even more, a lot more. I cannot even think about leveling another character again, that would require a ton... a ton of time (that could be spent on better things).
3. It is not fun. If you think these so called "quests" are fun you have not played a real video game.
4. Random quests suck. You have to collect 9 of some boars intestines and they never seem to drop, (kinda similar to raiding and trying to get your best weapon, that never drops) it's terrible.
5. Oh did I say boring.
6. It takes away time from the only good thing about this game "arena" (which sucks because you have to grind BG's and arena just to compete competitively.)
7. Lastly leveling is not hard, so all you cry babies that say it will make the game easy mode, leveling already is easymode. It just takes "time," lots of it.
8. Blizzard will not change there stupid ways, because time sinks are how they make money. Money makes blizzard really happy. Money causes Blizzard to make stupid ideas about video games, where you have to fly for 15 min just to get someplace, and level, and BG grind, and grind raid's.... everything is a terrible grind.
==Blizzard please just get rid of leveling it is terrible (or at least if you already have a 80 make it so you can make a 80 of any class. And then make pvp gear obtainable for free.
PS: To all the losers that think this will make the game easy mode, first think about how much time you will save to go out and have fun in real life. Then think about how much more balanced pvp will be, because everyone will have the same level of gear. Then think about how much more fun you will have trying all the 10 classes without having to level.
Most important of all think about how terrible time sinks are, and how many are in World of Warcraft. And then think about why you even bother playing the game any more.
Novead May 5th 2009 4:03AM
Not true. There's lots of old TV shows I still love, many years later. And that holds true for most of the classic dungeons as well.
Threads about classic WoW servers has been festering the forums for years, but it's getting just as annoying that everyone is blaiming nostalgia for making people want pre-BC back. Just because somethings is old doesn't mean it have to be bad. I have done many of the old dungeons recently, and though you have to go 2 or 3 with a few levels below the recommended to still find them challenging, the dungeons are just as fun and well designed as they always were.
Gareth May 5th 2009 7:20AM
Can't agree with this article or Vipers comments
"Blizzard has learned a LOT over these past years (think how much better leveling in Northrend is compared to Azeroth)."
I actually find levelling in Northrend dull a lot of the time hence my new Shaman's levelling hit a brick wall at 75 when I started runnng out of non-WotLK content, its missing some magic for me, I liked the Basin though as Horde, but its the only area I've gone to that I've actually cared about.
When I tried an ally in Northrend I did notice the quests were much better and more involving storyline wise then the Horde ones.
I'm thinking here about rolling another alt, the main reason is to do the original WoW + TBC, Northrend for me is mostly a grind and for that I prefer to get into a dungeon to get through the XP here. Even there though while the dungeons are well designed I find the whole Northrend loot to be poor, low level dungeons offer loot which is easily picked up off random quests and dropped fast - the most blues and purples we are given the less they are worth I guess.
MeanGreen May 5th 2009 7:32AM
I agree that the leveling to 60 should be done away with but, I do believe that the old instance should be allowed to run at in a 'heroic' setting at max level. I loved the old instances, I did not 'love' the leveling grind and chore that was vanilla WoW.
Olicon May 5th 2009 9:27AM
I do think it would be a good idea to put some phasing in the old world, maybe rework it so flying mounts work, but keep the old world there. Not everyone has been to every zone. And if you already have higher level characters, have your guildies run you through instances to power level instead.
Izzy May 5th 2009 10:48AM
@fables429
Most of us have short attention spans and stopped reading at the end of the first paragraph.
Clbull May 5th 2009 12:13PM
I somewhat agree with fables429 here. Levelling does seem very boring, especially the second time around when you've seen it all before and think "Not another 80 levels..."
Lets look at the TBC and WotLK content. TBC's levelling time is somewhat reasonable since they cut the xp requirements, although if you know every quest then Outland is going to be a breeze.
Whereas, WotLK content takes AGES to level in, particularly between 71 and 79. The xp required to level is pretty high (~1500000 per level) considering all of the quests that can be done to progress through Northrend.
Imho, either allow us to level through pvp, and reduce the time taken to get from 70 to 80 by a bit, or allow us all to start at 55 once we got an existing 55+ character.
Omestes May 5th 2009 2:04PM
@Fables429
Yeah, I know feeding trolls is bad, but: I have a feeling a lot of people would quit the game. I probably would, since I find end game raiding, and ESPECIALLY Arenas to be painful, tedious, and utterly non-challenging. Sure to be AWESOME in Arenas might be tough, but generally it is a game of classes of the month, general competence, and a heavy dose of randomness.
Raiding is a game of competence, reading a FAQ online, and listening to a 14 year old five you directions, while trying to fool yourself that this is serious business.
Everytime I get a toon to the cap, I grind some heroics, get somewhat geared, the roll a level 1 alt, and start leveling again. My last toon was somewhat better, since I could do BGs for decent gear, I actually enjoy BGs, except for Horde AV. I also enjoy leveling. I started playing WoW because I was a fan of Blizzard, and the amount of work they put into details and backstory, not because I wanted a bigger epeen, or to be able to call myself "hardcore" (if I ever claim that, without irony quotes, please shoot me).
A note on compitence, and a lesson learned from DKs, the only way to become a good player is to level a player. You learn what gear sucks, what tactics are dumb, and you learn how to use skills in an ordered progression, and not all at once (which is somewhat overwhelming). I reccomend you roll a lowbie, get to Outland, and take some weekend Ramps or BF pugs if you doubt this. DKs at that time are among the worst players you will ever see. This isn't because all of them are immature idiots, but because they don't know their class.
Yes, there is exceptions to that rule, and those exceptions are the ones who grow up to be good tanks at lv80, and perhaps even non-group-wiping DPS, if their lucky. The majority though are complete crap who cannot ever GEAR their toons properly, much less hold aggro. (I'm rolling on this lv58 green plate with spellpower!)
Chrina May 4th 2009 8:07PM
I completely disagree I would rather see them remove levels 60-70 cause the worse place to level is the Outlands. I really enjoy leveling in the Old World and I play on a PvP server.
Lorsty May 4th 2009 8:10PM
As the quest says "Outland sucks!".
I usually stay in the old world until level 63-64 (depending on how many instances I did and how many good quests I have left), then move to Outland, quest in Hellfire and Nagrand and then I go to Northrend.
Marysia May 4th 2009 8:56PM
Agreed, I actually really enjoy a lot of Old World leveling. Although I'm tired of the first 20 levels or so, I'm filled with nostalgia and excitement whenever a new alt gets to someplace like Stranglethorn Vale. (I play on a PVE server, so that might be part of why.) With the bonus shoulders, it goes about as fast as I would like, anyway. I haven't felt a need to get a second account and do RAF because I don't like to feel like I'm struggling to NOT level to avoid my quests going gray.
Outland is a drag for me though, but it goes pretty fast now.
CactusHam May 4th 2009 9:44PM
Wait -- Whats wrong with Outland? Outland is great -- every alt I've made has hit Outland as soon as they dinged 58. A wonderful change in scenery, better quests, faster dungeons, everything about Outland is awesome. But I guess its just a matter of opinion.
Geoff May 4th 2009 11:30PM
Bah. I'm calling this trolling or just a weirdo. Go to Silithus and count the people there. Go to Hellfire Peninsular and compare.
Novead May 5th 2009 4:09AM
I agree, Outlands is much more dull to level in than the old world.
The reason you see more in Hellfire than in Silithus might also be because Hellfire is the only starting zone in Outlands, but Silithus is one of four possible end zones in the old world, and definately the least populated of them.
Deadly. Off. Topic. May 5th 2009 2:10PM
Outlands is a tricky place. Some areas were PITAs, while others were enjoyable. I did not like Hellsfire Pennisula much, but I did like Zangalar Marsh. Maybe it was the colouring, the red background in HP didn't do it for me, but Zangalar was a calming blue and I liked traveling around it.
Frank May 4th 2009 8:07PM
"vanilla" wow isn't vanilla when you're a new player – it's only that way if you've experienced the content before. blizzard is right to leave it as-is for new players. catering to the end-game people only would hurt the game in the long run, because there wouldn't be any way to get new people into playing.