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All of the latest Mists of Pandaria newsGC on Hunters and their DPS
by Mike Schramm 
May 11th 2009 at 6:30PM
It took a few tries, but Ghostcrawler has finally agreed to post a "state of the Hunters" on the forums, and there's both good and bad news. First of all, GC flatly lays out that Hunter DPS was too high in Naxx -- Blizzard wants Hunters to be fighting with Locks, Rogues, and Mages for top DPS, not head and shoulders above them. And Survival is still the top DPS build in PvE; while GC says it's probably not a huge increase from the other specs, they are seeing it do better consistently. That said, Hunter DPS may be a little low now, but Blizzard isn't quite sure, for two reasons. First, people are still learning the Ulduar fights, and they don't completely trust the data they've gotten so far. And second, the main goal for fights in there was supposed to be variety, so there are very few places where DPS can just go all out and test how powerful they really are. GC says you should be asking "what's my DPS in this fight," rather than just "what's my DPS?"As for PvP, he says that the T.N.T. stuns and the big mana drains that Hunters could pull off in the past were just plain overpowered, and they won't be coming back. But as for where Hunters are going next, he says it's more of a function of nerfing other classes rather than buffing Hunters -- it's not that Hunters aren't going into Arena because they suck, it's because other classes are taking their place because they're better. He does say that Hunters are better in 5v5 (which makes sense -- Hunters have always been better from the back rather than forced into the middle of things like they might be in 3v3, and 2v2), and Blizzard is fairly OK with that, as not all classes are going to rock at all Arena levels.
Players, for the most part, are grudgingly agreeing -- T.N.T. stuns were pretty off the hook, and no one argues that Hunters weren't a little too powerful in Naxx. And keep in mind that there are still melee changes in the plans for Hunters: most of the complaints in the thread say that Hunters need more mobility and CC options, and certainly buffing their melee choices a bit would help with that. But we'll have to see what happens here -- I think GC is most insightful when he says that the problem with Hunters isn't necessarily Hunters, it's what other classes have been given lately. He does mention one change they might make (Marksman is mostly having an issue with mana management, so they could definitely buff the mana there a little bit), but it seems like there needs to be a little more smoothing in terms of where other classes are before we can clearly see where the issues lie with Hunters.
Filed under: Hunter, Analysis / Opinion, Fan stuff, Odds and ends, Blizzard, Instances, Arena
Reader Comments (Page 3 of 3)
Reps May 12th 2009 12:00AM
Hunters and mages seem to be doing pretty well. Rogues and locks are hard to play, so the charts are usually Hunter>Mage>Mage>Hunter>Mage>Hunter>Hunter>
Locks>Rogues>Warriors>Everybody else
Kruule May 12th 2009 3:37AM
Ok, here it is, SV is fine as DPS for 10 and 25's. I'm an average of 47oo dps on most boss fights with a wolf as the pet. Gear upgrade was a huge increase, as if scaling was just well done with SV Hunters.
I wouldnt say im in stellar gear either. It simply a matter of gear and skill, and using the correct pet/rotation, and watching what you're doing.
I chuckle when I hear that rogues are lower than hunters. Uhmm.. No, they're not. Not in 10's or 25's. Good Rogues top dps in all our raids, fail rogues do not. Usually its Rogues>Hunters=Locks>Mages, but that isnt always true.
To put it quite bluntly, The four other hunters in my guild outgear me by a decent amount. The cant believe the DPS I put out b/c it just doesnt make sense. That, my friends, is class skill and knowing the fights. If you want to be better, do your research, be hit capped, and practice practice practice.
Enough with the QQ about Hunter Dps. I think all classes/trees need tweaking, just not so drastic that we have to relearn things all over again.
Etta May 12th 2009 5:47AM
Like all hunters, I have invested in the 51 point talent in improved whining. Check my armoury on Outland EU if you don't believe me. Seriously though, I think we're fine, although we could do with better set bonuses.. 4 piece on T7 is rubbish and 2 piece on T8 is rubbish...
Mike May 12th 2009 6:09AM
"it's not that Hunters aren't going into Arena because they suck, it's because other classes are taking their place because they're better."
That's got to be the most moronic statement ever.
Sunny May 12th 2009 7:49AM
I have a 80 pve Rogue and Hunter, and i need to say that after my guild started out in Naxx and progressing up, i stoped playing my Rogue after a few runs, simply because his dps sucks.....my Hunter was doing more dps ungeared than my Rogue in Tier7.....
Hunters rock rightnow, in a 25 OS (played with 20ppl), my hunter was 3th best dps in last fight....and i still have some blues to replace....lol
Well, maybe Rogues get a change soon and will be able to be on top of dps again, would be nice....
Lamennte May 12th 2009 8:17AM
"Players, for the most part, are grudgingly agreeing -- T.N.T. stuns were pretty off the hook, and no one argues that Hunters weren't a little too powerful in Naxx."
I don't care... I don't raid. Yeah, nerf it.. big time... whatever. Now I'll really be bent over by the Druids, Pallys, Warlocks, Rogues.... and on and on and on in PvP. Hunters have no ability to self heal... to bubble themselves so they become invulnerable. I mean, OMG, that would be unfair!!! With the ability to dual spec, why doesn't Blizz create a special single spec for Areana and PvP for each class that would level out the playing field? Yeah, hunters are wayyyyyy OP. WHATEVER... I hate this game.
Maine-iac May 12th 2009 8:49AM
I leveled a hunter to 70 then stopped. Personally, I think the class is B-O-R-I-N-G. There's not much creativity that comes in to play unless you are tasked to do some crowd control. There is a pitiful amount of procs that you have to watch for that would force you to change your standard rotation. Last, and I think the worst part of being a hunter, is standing waaaaaaay away from the fight (outside of melee range). You rarely have to move any significant amount. Yawn. In my opinion, it's much more challenging to keep your DPS up when you have to move constantly.
Lyraat May 12th 2009 9:03AM
GC is right: we're learning the fights and as we learn them, we (everyone, not just hunters) get better. And Ulduar has some fights that are simply hunter-unfriendly; Auriaya, for example, is horrible for hunters.
My big complaint is the clunkiness of play. We went from an ultra-smooth (and ultra-easy) playstyle in BC to a cooldown-based style in 3.0 to whack-a-mole in 3.08 and 3.1. Tis much harder to get consistent damage. For SV, my preferred spec, I have to "setup" a boss with Serpent Sting, BA, then hope that in the next 15 seconds both Master Tactician and TnT proc. If not, I lose dps. So my dps can vary 500+ on the same boss. And, with BA having at most a 62.5% uptime, TnT hardly ever procs for me anymore: I get one TnT proc per boss fight compared to 3 or 4 (or dozens on Razuvious :D). MM is all clunky, all the time, as it's just cd watching. BM has been surprisingly strong especially on bosses where the hunter can sic his pet on the boss and forget it.
I'd rather see hunters have a playstyle that includes a heavy dose of SS with other shots weaved in for specific reasons. Boss is casting a healing spell, Aimed Shot. Boss is on the move, switch to instant casts. We need burst, ExS and Chimera.
Radiophonic May 12th 2009 9:36AM
DPS as a whole is difficult to rate in Ulduar. Some fights have ranged dancing all over avoiding this and that or standing in a buff circle (further outbalancing the stats). As a whole though, I think hunters need a little buff up though, they dropped fairly low when I look at WWS of Naxx raids at the end of the night. BM usually trails one spot behind survival which isn't too bad, still not 'balanced' though.
Lotharic May 12th 2009 9:27AM
I'm glad to see GC has acknowledged the watering down of hunters. equally geared peeps in my guild have mages, a particular DK as tops dps in our raids, hunters fill all the spots beneath them. Mage should be the only one there in my opinion, pure dps class. Funny how we are only going to change in accordance with other class changes. Don't know why other classes should influence what they do with hunters. They have washed us down, made us very boring and mudane to play, to the point, the people that wrote our hunter forum websites are quitting them cause they giving up their hunters. They giving them up because the class is very lack luster, and difficult to equip anymore. I still want a 2 hand axe, but only one in all of naxx, for everyone to roll on anymore. I play my pally and my lock more than my hunter now. Terrible thing when exotic pets are out dps'd by a dog. shows how much thought blizzard really puts into our class. Nothing should come near an exotic pet in dps. Loque is the worst pet one ould have for raiding. Loque is a sjhowpiece only, designed to take up space in ur stable, instead of a viable pet.
Shades May 12th 2009 3:25PM
Perhaps this will be over simplifying but for the most part, the majority of classes have their niche. For hunters, this meant DPS and distanced no less (with the exception of pets if you want to get technical). We shouldn't make every class equal per se. Not over powered either but not equal on all levels. They all need to be unique for what they can bring to the table. That is why we play different classes and why we group specific classes for a run. And for the record, I am feeling the mana nerf as well.
I think everyone should stop whining about other peoples classes. If you don't like yours, which was your choice, play another. We shouldn't have to constantly change the classes and the game because of the whining and moaning by those who just refuse to either learn their own, accept the unique differences of the others or who are just too lazy to start another. I now have pretty much everything class represented but a priest to cover all occasions for my guild.
Maysam May 13th 2009 2:05AM
Hunters are only good at 5s cause they get carried by everyone else :
fernando May 13th 2009 6:15AM
I play a PVE rogue and hunter. Depending on the boss i do more or less damage. I have been in raids where other classes top the damage meters. Usually DKs are best for clearing trash. Sustained dps on long fights goes to hunters/rogues/locks... and so on. I honestly only see DKs more favoured for melee encounters with multiple targets, due to their areas. But I think the game is very much compensated between the classes. And some bosses are more suitable for this or that class. Also I would say that if you are within the top ten in a 25 man raid you are doing ok. Everything is not dps, I like to play the class by itself. And you can always improve your gear a little more.
Giezela May 13th 2009 4:54PM
I would think that one way to take care of the problem with our short range abilities would be to remove the minimum range requirement on shooting. I'm not saying that we should be able to use all our shots in close range. I think Steady Shot, Multi Shot, and Kill shot should require you be at least 5 yards away but all other shots to have no minimum range requirement. This would give us the ability to be able to still put out strong damage in pvp since when that warrior is in our face. This would also eliminate the need for Blizz to try and come up with more hunter skills for close combat. I don't know about ya'll but I'd rather not try and find room for more skills on my taskbar.