Skip to Content
6-04-2009 @ 5:24PM
This is probably more of a question for Ask a Lore Nerd, but I'm wondering why Blizzard loves corrupting good guys. Is it supposed to be some type of social commentary? Practically all the major bad guys were, at one point, the best of the good guys. Sargeras, Kil'jaeden, Archimonde, Azshara, Deathwing, Malygos, Illidan, Kael'thas, Ner'zhul, Arthas, Loken... the list literally goes on and on. They started out 'good', but were slowly corrupted and fell from grace. Is Blizzard saying the fall is inevitable? That it is hard being a good guy? Or are they just too lazy to come up with new bad guys, and they like recycling the good guys? Just about the only case I can recall of a 'bad' guy pulling a Vader in the end is Grom Hellscream.
6-04-2009 @ 5:31PM
Blizzard likes to keep everything not black and white, i.e. good vs bad, but a nice, old cream-cheese gray colour. Everyone has a bad and a good side (like in real life, obviously), and some of them go well on bagels.
6-04-2009 @ 5:34PM
Its like the saying, "You either die a hero, or live long enough to see yourself become a villain."
6-04-2009 @ 5:33PM
Because everyone likes to see the good guys fall from grace. Like two face from batman.
Few things are made bad, theres old gods but im not sure what they were like before the titans started fighting them but were they bad back then or are the just pissed at what happened? the people you mentioned were corrupted or did what they thought was right so were good at the start.
6-04-2009 @ 5:45PM
Leandar has it right. There are only truly evil people in movies. Real world "Bad Guys" never started out trying to be bad, they all had good intentions for their actions (unless they are just plain crazy, like Hitler) and eventually just get carried away with their own righteousness and lose touch with the consequences of their actions. A "fall from grace" isn't just a storytelling device, it's more realistic.
6-04-2009 @ 5:50PM
The fall of a hero from grace, his eventual over throw and return to 'the righteous' is one of the oldest story Arcs known to man.Examples: Sampson and Delila, Oedipus, etc.This is not to say that Blizz's lore is 'good literature'. Some could say that Blizzards doggedly returning to the same dramatic theme reeks of hack writing. Not me, of course, Pride Goeth before the fall, after all.
6-04-2009 @ 5:52PM
In these days of RPGs and super villains, seeing someone who's bad for the sake of being bad with no backstory about why he's bad is kind of trite, particularly in a lore-filled game like the Warcraft series.I can understand that the fallen-from-grace angle gets annoying, but Blizzard wants the reason for everything out in the open so you feel that emotional connection to the whole situation. And like Leandar said, few things are bad because they're just malevolent by nature. Most of us grow out of the urge to pluck the wings off of flies and start feeling sorry for said flies by the time we hit our teens. Barring the occasional sociopath, it takes a strong twist of fate to turn a person to evil.
6-04-2009 @ 6:02PM
This would be a great question for a discussion in a literature class. I would agrue that the tragic fall of heroes is a time honored tradition that really gained momentum with classical literature. It makes epic heroes more human when they royally screw up, which is my opinion one of the reasons why people enjoy it. Jason in the Argonautica is depicted as a true hero, aside from using a woman's affections to win the day. In Medea, however, it shows how his choices lead to his own downfall, and he's portrayed as a lying, cheating, pig. In video games, this tradition presents the unique oportunity as the writers can create these really fascinating, powerful characters and tell a story about their ascension as a hero and their fall. Then the writers get to let the reader/player actually fight the character. If Homer was a video game writer, the player would have been the one to shoot the arrow into Achilles' heel.
6-04-2009 @ 6:16PM
I guess my bigger question is, why don't we see more of the redemption storylines? Grom making up for his mistakes, in spectacular fashion, is really a moving (and of course cliche) moment.Also, while I tend to agree with the "there is no good/evil" perspective, World of Warcraft is not really a direct translation of the real world. The Horde vs Alliance conflict is obviously meant to examine the absurdity of labeling one side "Good" and the other "Bad". But at the same time, it is almost impossible to characterize the Burning Legion as anything but Bad. Very Bad. Their entire goal has nothing to do with power or enslaving planets or being a supreme race - it is the destruction of all life everywhere. That's like crossing-the-streams bad. And while Kael'thas' service to the Legion may have been, in his own eyes, for his people or something, I fail to see the moral grey area there. He was corrupted, he fell, and became Bad. This happens a lot in Warcraft, and considering how much it draws on common fantasy tropes, it surprises me that redemption is found so rarely.Also, @splodesondeath: who the hell eats grey cream cheese!?
6-04-2009 @ 6:48PM
Well, when you take some "blue" cheese, like a roquefort or so, grate it and whip it together with some butter and cream until it gets smooth, the resulting stuff is pretty much gray. And tasty. It's not really what one would call a cream cheese, but it *is* gray.Dunno how it goes with bagels though. I've never ate a bagel, and gods help me, I never will. Dark bread rolls for the win!
6-04-2009 @ 7:19PM
I am pretty sure Robespierre covered the same concept when saying "man is born free, yet everywhere he is in chains" we're born good, but the external world ruins it. PS. If you haven't noticed yet, South Park's creators reject that notion.
6-05-2009 @ 7:44AM
It was Rousseau, not Robespierre, who had that snappy catchphrase.As you were.
First time? A confirmation email will be sent to you after submitting.
Members enter your username and password.
Enter your AOL or AIM screenname and password.
Please keep your comments relevant to this blog entry. Email addresses are never displayed, but they are required to confirm your comments.
When you enter your name and email address, you'll be sent a link to confirm your comment, and a password. To leave another comment, just use that password.
To create a live link, simply type the URL (including http://) or email address and we will make it a live link for you. You can put up to 3 URLs in your comments. Line breaks and paragraphs are automatically converted — no need to use <p> or <br /> tags.