Patch 3.2 changes the tiered Emblem system
There are a lot of things in the patch 3.2 test realm notes that jumped out at me, but the changes to the Emblem system seem like an especially big deal. The developers made it quite clear that they wanted a tiered token system in Wrath of the Lich King, they didn't want players just farming Heroics all day and night to get the best possible gear. In patch 3.2, it looks like they're backing off on that pretty heavily, likely an attempt to reignite interest in running Heroics. If you haven't seen the patch notes, here are the points I'm referring to:- Any dungeons that previously dropped Emblems of Heroism or Valor, such as Naxxramas or Heroic Halls of Stone, will now drop Emblems of Conquest instead. Emblems of Conquest can still be converted to Valor or Heroism.
- Both the 10 and 25 player instances of the Crusaders' Coliseum drop a new Emblem of Triumph.
- The heroic dungeon daily quest will now reward 2 Emblems of Triumph and the normal daily dungeon quest will reward 1 Emblem of Triumph.
- The existing achievements to collect 1, 25, 50, etc. Emblems of Heroism, Valor, and Conquest have been converted to Feats of Strength since Heroism and Valor Emblems are no longer attainable.
So taking all of this into consideration, a player could theoretically get 4 pieces of Tier 8 gear without ever setting foot into Ulduar, simply by grinding out Heroics and getting a couple of lucky drops from Emalon. To get the Tier 8 hat and gloves, you would need a combined total of 116 badges. At roughly four badges per Heroic, that's just shy of 30 Heroics. That sounds like a lot, but when you take into consideration how people got their gear in The Burning Crusade, it really sort of... isn't a lot at all. This is a big step away from what the developers stated they want to do, but as I said, I imagine it's a change made in the interest of encouraging people to continue running Heroics.
Of course, Conquest badges won't be the best of the best in patch 3.2, because we're getting our hands on Emblems of Triumph, the new Tier 9 badges. However, they're doing something differently here, too: Both 10man and 25man versions of the Tier 9 raids will drop the same Emblems, there is no longer a split. That means the 10man version of the raids will be able to get their hands on the same iLevel gear as the 25man version, unless there's some crazy black magic afoot that we won't get to see until we're on the PTR ourselves.
Of course, Emblems aren't even limited to the Tier 9 raids. Someone who has never stepped foot in a raid in their lives can get Tier 9 badge rewards if they're dedicated enough. The daily dungeon quests hand out Emblems of Triumph one or two at a time depending on your chosen difficulty. Someone who has never touched a raid can eventually get Tier 9 badge loot. Heck, someone who has never touched a Heroic can get Tier 9 badge loot. It will just take awhile. If current badge loot is any indicator of the cost of Tier 9 gear, it will take them around 60 days of doing the daily to get a piece of tier gear. That's a long enough time to justify that, I think.
So is this all bad? In the case of the Emblem of Conquest change, I don't think it's bad given the game's current landscape. People aren't running Heroics, and they need to be given a reason to do so. Letting them get Emblems of Conquest will give them reason to do those dungeons. I don't think it's the best possible solution and I hope they come up with something better for the next expansion, but for now? This is probably a good move. Wrath of the Lich King really does not encourage people to do 5-mans, so hopefully this will do it.
In the case of Emblems of Triumph, there doesn't seem to be a 10/25 man split. I've already heard theories that this means there won't be different loot for 10 and 25man raids, but it's far too early to start screaming about that, either for it or against it. Maybe we'll see something like 10man raids getting fewer badges than 25man raids, so it takes the 10man raid longer to get 25man equivalent gear? We don't know, and while this change seems weird, I can't immediately say it's bad. My opinion could quickly change upon seeing the implementation.
Like I said, I see the Emblem of Conquest change as a quick fix, a temporary solution. You can't get the best of the best gear with Emblems of Conquest in patch 3.2, but it's still going to encourage the behavior they initially wanted to discourage. They absolutely need to get people running Heroics again, but is this the way to do it? Long term, I don't think so. Short term, yeah, I can agree with it.
Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm off to calculate roughly how many Heroics and Emalon kills I'll need to get all of my alt 4-piece Tier 8. Add the seven, carry the four, divide by three...
Patch 3.2 will bring about a new 5, 10, and 25 man instance to WoW, and usher in a new 40-man battleground called the Isle of Conquest. WoW.com will have you covered every step of the way, from extensive PTR coverage through the official live release. Check out WoW.com's Guide to Patch 3.2 for all the latest!Filed under: Patches, Analysis / Opinion, Raiding
Patch 5.4 patch notes
Virtual Realms feature revealed
The Proving Grounds are coming
The latest patch 5.4 news





Reader Comments (Page 4 of 14)
Wolftech Jun 20th 2009 6:04PM
Hey, I could read it. Then again, i took Latin. Being a gamer and needing foreign language credits, it seemed the logical choice :)
But then again, Marchblack, your followups did make sound like a pretentious prick with his head firmly implanted in his posterior.
dishinki Jun 18th 2009 4:35PM
(Practically) Free Lootz! There goes the sense of accomplishment in gaining high level teir gear=/
Delphinus Jun 18th 2009 5:09PM
what about all of our existing emblems of heroism and valor? will they stay the same or will they be converted to emblems of conquest?
emptyrepublic Jun 18th 2009 5:11PM
See the beginning of the comments thread. What you have now is not changing.
pdorgan Jun 18th 2009 4:28PM
I am not excited about this idea in the least. Just hit 80? In crappy greens and blues? No problem! Run some heroics and enjoy that Tier 8, even if you have no idea what you're doing! This is kind of a kick in the nuts for people who work hard to clear 25 man ulduar. Now everyone on the server will look just like you do..even if they can't clear Naxx.
Samuel Reese Jun 18th 2009 5:36PM
Sure, and while I'm busy trying to get a group together for said Heroics, the gap between people just hitting 80 and the "hardcore" gets wider and wider. But hey, that's okay...we just have to run Naxx to catch u--oh, wait...that's going to take time to get a group together to do that, maybe even months to gear properly.
But hey, once that's done, then they'll only be three point releases behind from the rest of the crowd!
It's been said time and time again, once you've gotten geared properly in Heroics and have all you need from the first-level of raiding in Naxx, there is zero incentive for anyone to go back into Heroics. With this change in mechanics, you're effectively giving those people who would more often than not pass up an opportunity to help "lower-tiered 80s" since they can also benefit from the run, albeit maybe not as much as running higher-level raids such as Naxx or Ulduar.
SaintStryfe Jun 18th 2009 6:56PM
You need 118 badges. You need to run an awful lot of heroics to do that, where you learn that.
And to be blunt, there's plenty of people in Kara and U10 who don't know what they're doing with good gear, so that's not a valid response. People who don't know jack shyte still have gear. People learn to play their class in heroics and in raids. You just have a choice now: a shat ton of heroics, or raiding. That's all this does.
watergem Jun 19th 2009 7:21AM
Even though the "hardcore raider" in me is a bit dissapointed,I have to agree this is going to be a positive change. Besides the fact its happened once already and turned out ok, it allows people to catch up in a very efficient way.
I agree with SaintStryfe, there's a lot of people *now* that are raiding and don't know wtf they're doing. And honestly, all the people whining about "omg all the scrubs will get free epixzz!!!" No, they won't. You have to run a LOT of heroics to get enough badges, so this method will probably only interest people who are wanting to *PUT IN THE EFFORT* to catch up and get into raiding anyway, whether they be veteran raiders who rerolled/took a break, new players who are skilled just inexperienced, or even people who took a break for PVP and are now behind.
And besides all that, by the time this patch comes out, guilds will mostly have normal mode Ulduar on farm status anyway, so is there really a difference?
paperbull Jun 18th 2009 4:29PM
I'm down for running more heroics... as long as they fix the "Additional Instances Cannot be Launched. Please Try Again Later" Issue.
Sargenus Jun 18th 2009 4:40PM
I love this idea. But the problem...
So many 'Additional Instances cannot be launched, please try again later.' errors due to it. Urg.
Arelion Jun 19th 2009 4:06PM
I thought the goal was to make Epic purples difficult to get.... they're practically handing out epic items now....
rcaimi Jun 18th 2009 4:31PM
Hope they also add tabard rep in raids now!
Netherscourge Jun 18th 2009 4:32PM
Ulduar is going to be like Naxx40 - people who are still in Naxx25/EoE25 are goign to skip right over it and head for the Colessium Raid.
WHich is fine with me - I ran Ulduar a couple times and found it insanely boring.
ElderDruid Jun 18th 2009 4:33PM
I love this change.
They need to keep evolving the game such that dedicating entire evenings to raiding is not required to at least get a FEW pieces of top-tier gear.
Ryan Jun 18th 2009 4:44PM
Yeah but you can make the same argument for anything in an MMO. If you don't want to put the time in to level then you don't make it to end game content. If you don't want to spend the time and effort raiding then you shouldn't get the rewards that come with the gear. For me, I don't want to put the time into grinding out achievements and you know, I have a low achievement score because of it. Blizz doesn't owe me achievement points because I don't have the time/patience for them.
Heilig Jun 18th 2009 4:33PM
Well, they were looking for a way to make Heroics more attractive again. I guess they found it.
LFG H Nexus & UK & CoT & AN & anything else that takes 20 minutes to do. Screw tournament dailies, it's dungeon dailies now.
HOWEVER!!!
"The heroic dungeon daily quest will now reward 2 Emblems of Triumph and the normal daily dungeon quest will reward 1 Emblem of Triumph."
This is a big problem. Casual players will be able to get 21 CURRENT TIER badges in a week without raiding. Raiders will spend hours learning new and difficult fights and get MAYBE 40 if they clear ALL FOUR versions of the new raid? Bad play, Blizz. The dungeon dailies need to be conquest too.
Lokasenna Jun 18th 2009 4:47PM
This is a pretty fair criticism. Being able to get Triumph badges is nice, but I'd say limit it to one for the heroic and that's it. Let the reg give out Conquests or something.
placebo Jun 19th 2009 9:46AM
From what I gather, you're limited in the number of attempts due to the tribute system. After that you cannot make any further attempts at a boss. So once you've banged your head against a wall and got nothing to show for the week you go and get some sort of consolation prize or something to that extent by doing the dailies.
(Coffee has not done anything so I'm not going to attempt revising. My apologies if it doesn't sound coherent.)
Mugie Jul 16th 2009 8:14PM
This seriously is the worst argument I read as I read the blog. This really shows how simple-minded some people can get when they find something to troll on. Obviously the 'raiders' can't do the heroic/dungeon-dailies? Smart thinking mate. That makes it 40+21, 61 a week, in my opinion you will actually - yes - get better gear - more epix - more leetness - than the dungeon runners, actually 3 times more, how does that sound? Nerf!
arilasWL Jun 18th 2009 4:33PM
I don't understand why people "need" to be running heroics. Why is it not ok to run them until you get all you need, and then stop? I don't see the allure of doing the same 5 mans throughout the entire length of the expansion.