Patch 5.4 patch notes
Virtual Realms feature revealed
The Proving Grounds are coming
The latest patch 5.4 newsExodus punished for exploiting Yogg-Saron encounter
by Zach Yonzon 
Jun 29th 2009 at 10:47PM
Contrary to some reports, however, Exodus released a statement on their website that members of their guild were not banned, clarifying that Blizzard meted out a 72-hour suspension for their abuse of game mechanics. They argue that the encounter wasn't beatable to begin with, similar to the C'thun fight in Ahn'Qiraj before it was fixed, prompting the exploit. In the same statement, Exodus also points at Ensidia's arguably hypocritical stance of complaining about the abuse considering Ensidia used similar questionable methods to achieve other World Firsts. Serennia mentions this behavior in his column at wowriot, as well, bringing into question Blizzard's apparent double standard when meting out punishment.
Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Cheats, Guilds, Blizzard
Reader Comments (Page 4 of 8)
EZ Jun 29th 2009 11:44PM
This is why casuals don't design hard-modes.
in b4 downvoted to hell for saying casual....can;t you casuals take a joke!? yeesh.
elfennau Jun 30th 2009 8:19AM
I can use every addon on Curse all at once, and nowhere am I using code that Blizz DIDN'T provide. Not a single addon works without hooking into the LUA coding Blizzard provides in the game framework.
You lose.
Rippchen Jun 30th 2009 10:33AM
>I can use every addon on Curse all at once, and nowhere am I using code that Blizz >DIDN'T provide. Not a single addon works without hooking into the LUA coding Blizzard >provides in the game framework.vide
oh, even better! i can play WoW and nowhere am i using code that microsoft did not provide. Not a single game works without hooking into the win32 coding microsoft provides in the OS framework ;)
see how silly that sounds? what do you think the addons are made of? obviously out of code that blizzard did not provide. use a one liner macro written by yourself, and you use code that blizz did not provide.....
bluexxiii Jun 29th 2009 11:35PM
Do you really think that they don't have people monitoring these fights? Not to mention logs of every thing that happens at everytime. I really, really doubt that blizz was like "zomg, ensidia didn't get it first. BAN!"
Exploiting gets you In trouble. end of story. If you exploit a battleground, or exploit a boss mechanic, you get handled. Just because there is a bug, does not give you the right to exploit it.
"Look, that car has the keys in it... must be free!!" Unless you're a total dunce, you know when you are doing something against the rules or the spirit of fair play. They knew what they were doing, they got caught. And everyone cries foul.
Bugs happen, things aren't always perfect, Anyone who thinks that it's possible to create something on the scale of WoW and have it be 100% bug free is a fool in the first place. Regardless, it's not acceptable to intentionally use a bug to obtain something as important as a world first.
You cheated. Good Riddance.
Vidi Jun 29th 2009 11:58PM
my questions are this:
Why is called "Creative use of game mechanics" when Ensidia does it, but "exploitaion" when Exodus does it?
Zachary Pruckowski Jun 30th 2009 1:28AM
"Why is called 'Creative use of game mechanics' when Ensidia does it, but 'exploitation' when Exodus does it?"
Because there was a key difference between the two "exploits". Let's for a moment stipulate that 2min Hodir and Yogg-0 are overtuned.
In Ensidia's case, Ensidia's "exploit" involved using a spell in the game (spellsteal) to steal a magic +DPS buff from a trash mob. To beat Hodir, they then had to follow all the other mechanics (Biting Cold, the helper-NPCs, the various +damage buffs, the flash freeze, etc.) and execute perfectly. In a literal sense, they creatively used one game mechanic (spellstealing) to solve an otherwise unsolvable problem.
In Exodus's case, they didn't use a game mechanic, they used a bug. They forced the Guardians to evade-bug, allowing them to skip several hard mechanics in Phase 3, and turning the fight into a tank-and-spank. They skipped out of much of the challenge of the fight.
I hope it's clear how the two differ.
Orrine Jun 30th 2009 1:50AM
Any exloit anyone else used doesn't justifies Exodus cheating.
If Karate-something used GM's shirt to kill Yogg-Saron-0 and Ensidia was the first to say it was an exploit would you say that this gnome was right? Really, just because Ensidia is jealous? Come on, what twisted logic is that?
If Exodus cheated, they cheated, period. If Ensidia can't stand other players getting world first - it's completely separate matter.
Vidi Jun 30th 2009 3:31PM
Thanks Zack!
I was unaware as to the exact details of their Hodir take down.
Did they also geta world first on Lady Vash? On their forums they say that Vash dropped down to 1% health due tro a bug thus allowing them to get the kill. Then say they got lucky on that one.
It just seems to me everything Ive heard over the years about Nihilm and now Ensidia, that these folks dont seem to care how they get it done as long as its them that gets it done first. And then they QQ if its not them.
anyway, thank you for the details on Hodir. I appreciate you setting me straight on that.
Verit Jun 29th 2009 11:47PM
Well like I said in the previous post - the amount of raiding guilds posting tips and tricks on hard mode bosses in ulduar on WoW exploit sites makes me think a good chunk of these guilds are up to this sort of thing.
Maximize Jun 30th 2009 11:35AM
Blizzard, take responsibility for your sloppy programming and stop banning everyone when they try to creatively solve the problems of crazy-hard (or borderline impossible) encounters. It seems like every week a bunch of guilds get handed suspensions for handling overwhelmingly hard in surprising ways.
If you don't like it, fix it. Again I say it. TAKE RESPONSIBILITY for your screw ups.
Vidi Jun 29th 2009 11:48PM
Did the guy who got the mount get to keep it?
and I agree with engineering is underpowered on this one. The fact that Ensidia practically bragged about exploiting to get the Hodir kill and are now complaining when someone else gets a world first other than them really says alot about the class of loser that must be in that guild.
They may get world firsts but they are FAR from the worlds finest.
Shisho Jun 29th 2009 11:50PM
I know I'm not alone when I say that I love excuses.
Time for some backpedaling.
Kaphik Jun 30th 2009 2:28AM
How can it be an exploit if they are the first people to figure it out? That's a really bad decision on Blizzard's part here. Hotfix the encounter, and thank Exodus for finding a bug THAT WASN'T FOUND on the PTR.
Orrine Jun 30th 2009 7:20AM
Exodus used this exploit but didn't report it - it was Ensidia who did this. And there's no excuse to cheating, even bugs.
sneakums Jun 30th 2009 12:04AM
fuck blizzard. me and 24 of my guildies got a 72 hour suspension because FL bugged out when we tried to reset the encounter and he just walked through the fucking walls. he was taking out all our people so we killed him. keep in mind we did so on NORMAL. no hard modes were activated. we killed him with 2 people left and we got a 3 day break from wow for THEIR faulty coding. 13 of us have quit wow.
PeeWee Jun 30th 2009 5:35AM
Can I have your stuff?
No wait, you'll all be back within a few weeks anyway.
sneakums Jun 30th 2009 12:23PM
nah. i honestly think im done. i didnt really enjoy playing this time around. i just did it because many of my friends played. shame how almost half of the guild's core raiding group is just leaving
Vanich Jun 30th 2009 12:19AM
First off, I agree that Exodus deserved the suspension (actually suprised that the punishment wasn't more severe), and I agree that use of un-intended mechanics is a bannable offense. Please note, I'm not an Ensidia hater, nor do I favor any specific guild/nationality, just looking at the situations and their outcomes.
But lets take a look at what has been done recently by both Ensidia and Exodus and how they were handled.
Exodus - Used an un-intended game mechanic and was succesful, then lied about it
Result - Suspension & Encounter hot fixed
Ensidia - Used an un-intended game mechanic and was succesful, then told blizzard AFTER taking the kill
Result - Nothing & Encounter hot fixed
Exodus got what they had comming to them, I won't argue that. BUT, do you think the situation would have been much different if they would have reported the bug to Blizz after the kill? IMO, doubtful. Granted, Evade bugging and spell stealing MAJOR buffs that weren't supposed to be stolen are in different scale of "use of un-intended game mechanincs," they both are the same offense. The reason I see both of them on the same scale is that after Ensidia got the kill using this mechanic, it was hotfixed as to avoid further use of it. How do you explain the hotfix if this was something intended from the beginning? How is the situation different with Ensidia than with the mage that got Perma-Banned for spell-stealing buffs in naxx? The only difference I note is one is in Ensidia and the other isn't.
"Blizzard made the encounter undoable without our 'Clever use of game mechanics'"
This logic was used in their defense by both Exodus and Ensidia, but it was only an acceptable explination for Ensidia. Again, i'm not trying to defend the actions of Exodus in any way, shape, or form... merely pointing out the similarities in questionable actions taken by Ensidia and Exodus and the differences in the actions taken by blizzard.
Point is, they both used 'un-intended game mechanics' to achieve something that they were unable to do before. The only glaring difference is that Exodus lied after the kill (bad form, seriously) and Ensidia informed blizzard after the kill. If blizzard is not playing favorites to some extent, Ensidia should have gotten their Hodir Idol removed after the hotfix, as it was attained un-intentionally.
Verit Jun 30th 2009 12:33AM
The buffs they stole essentially gave their mages insane amount of DPS (I've heard 40+k) - its right up there with mind controlling warp engineers and killing Void Reaver in TK in 39 seconds - that was essentially a clever use of an in game mechanic, but people got banned for it.
One could argue that Ensidia only told Blizzard after the kill to ensure no-one else could get the same achievement so easily, and it worked.
Vanich Jun 30th 2009 1:01AM
@Verit: That's exactly my point. The 'clever use of game mechanics' that Ensidia employs has been used by other WoW players in different situations and received a ban as a result. And I'm sorry, if you think that getting a buff to SUBSTANTIALLY increase DPS (from ~6-7k to 40k +) is not trivializing the fight, consider that the only challenging part to that encounter is the DPS race involved, the other mechanics are trivial to begin with. In Ensidias defense, people claim that the encounter was buffed to the point that it's not achievable other wise along with a hundred other exuses to validate their improper use of mechanics. The point still stands that the mechanics that were used were not intended, resulting in the hotfix.
About Ensidia essentially cock-blocking the method they used... I try not to assume peoples motives, and as such stand on a relatively neutral ground on this topic. Although, I wouldn't put it past a competetive raiding guild to make it as hard as possible to allow others to catch up to their progress (I.E. Getting the only way they were able to beat an encouter hotfixed right after they finished it). I do tend to lean towards that line of thinking when considering they only reported it AFTER they had the encounter under their belt, also considering that they weren't all that pleased with the encounter being buffed before they got it down.