World first of "Alone in the Darkness" a possible exploit
We reported last week that a guild named Exodus on the US realm of Ysondre had come out of nowhere to topple the world first of the Heroic: Alone in the Darkness achievement, which requires that you bring down the biggest bad currently in the game, Yogg-Saron, with no help from any of the Keepers in Ulduar. But not so fast, says Serennia over at WoWRiot -- over on their forums Ensidia is claiming that Exodus used an exploit, and that their kill doesn't count at all. Apparently, having Thorim help on the fight keeps the "Immortal Guardians" in the last phase of the fight from being a problem, and without Thorim, you have to not only do the fight without his extra 10% damage bonus (each Keeper ups your DPS that much), but you have to deal with the Guardians messing up your melee classes, and oh yeah: they both heal and get healed by Yogg. Not that it's impossible to do it, but it's definitely not easy, and Ensidia claims that Exodus found a known exploit that allows you to evade the Guardians out completely, thus turning the last phase into a straight tank-and-spank, obviously much easier.After that, it gets into some guild back and forth (Ensidia apparently did something that might have been an exploit on Hodir, and when people call them out on that, they say that the exploits were different -- Ensidia's tactic was just an interesting use of game mechanics, while the exploit Exodus is suspected of using is more of a cheat), but the fact remains that Exodus is clearly not a guild that anyone expected to clear what might be the toughest raiding achievement in the game before anyone else, and yet that's exactly what they did. Ensidia says they won't be killing Yogg for the achievement using the exploit, and that they've reported the Exodus kill to the devs, so we'll have to see if the devs decide that Exodus did cheat, or if they let Exodus keep their achievements and mounts. We're not sure how much it all matters, with world first kills not being all that important any more (and that's exactly what the devs might say as well), but Ensidia is claiming that an exploit took place -- we'll have to see if that turns out to be true.
Thanks, Nimrod!
Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Guilds, Blizzard, Raiding, Bosses, Forums
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Reader Comments (Page 4 of 5)
Vidi Jun 29th 2009 11:32PM
I am not going to vent about Ensidia not am I going to bash Mike Schramm.
The question here is: Where is Endsidia's proof that Exodus cheated?
It may turn out that Exodus did indeed use an exploit, but Exodus is an AMERICAN guild and in AMERICA you're SUPPOSED to be innocent until PROVEN guilty.
So let's see some evidence and then we can pass judgement...but not until then.
talkingmike Jun 29th 2009 9:36PM
Oh stop. "Innocent until proven guilty" (along with things like "free speech") means nothing when talking about the court of public opinion. Just talk with OJ Simpson and the family of the recently-departed Michael Jackson.
Certainly, facts can be covered up and statistics can be manipulated. But we can all draw our own accurate conclusions even based on circumstantial evidence.
Vidi Jun 29th 2009 11:39PM
talkingmike was the shooter from the Grassy knoll.
there I made an accusation, but that doesn't mean its true. If that's all it takes to convince you, then I have some REALLY nice swamp land in Florida for sale, please send me your credit card number and your wow account name and password so I can process the sale.
Sheesh
tulipblossom Jun 29th 2009 9:51PM
Lol, anyone else find this all a little amusing? If a stranger to the game were reading this, they'd think getting a world first Ulduar kill, and all the drama that surrounds it, was tantamount to Watergate.
This isn't like being the first person to swim the English Channel or climb Mt. Everest. This is who can strategize and pew pew the best in an online game. I'm not trying to diminish anyone's accomplishments in game, but let's please put the whole thing into perspective.
wheels Jun 29th 2009 9:55PM
Sounds like Exodus did actually use an exploit. According to their website, http://www.exo-guild.com they have been suspended for 72 hours because of it.
Rezeyu Jun 29th 2009 10:05PM
It's official anyways, Exodus got a 72 hour ban.
The Claw Jun 29th 2009 10:56PM
..and the apologies from all the e-thugs slagging off Ensidia for being "butthurt" about someone "beating" them will be incoming when, precisely?
lawlatallyall Jun 29th 2009 10:06PM
First the US soccer team beats the best European team..
Then a US guild beats a European guild at a world first...
Is all the Ensidia whining stemming from the fact that US is beating Europe at games it's dominated in, in the past?
methinks so!
Verit Jun 29th 2009 10:43PM
I've been on a single run with a really "elite" raiding guild, and to be honest it surprised me on how many tricks they used in the instance (some of which could be considered exploits). I wonder if this is what makes them so much more better at this game than the rest of us. I've heard of Ensidia (and Nihilium before that) using exploits in black temple, buying pre-made characters and being paid by an Arab Price from Dubai, so nothing they say really shocks me anymore.
Also - if you read any of those WoW exploit forums, the number of exploits, hacks and tricks for hard modes for various raids is surprising. Maybe Blizzard just needs to crack down on it - because I suspect its a pretty widespread problem amongst the world first crowd.
Jagoex Jun 29th 2009 11:06PM
Comments like the ones in this post make me /facepalm at the community. Seriously.
If people are critical of Ensidia, they are called "haters" and automatically labelled as "jealous," etc. If people defend Ensidia, they are called "fan boys" and what not. What happened to just looking at the facts and letting them speak for themselves?
The facts of the matter are as follows:
- There is a questionable mechanic that may have been used in the World First encounter that might negate the accomplishment.
- Blizzard has to confirm their position on the mechanic.
- Both guilds are acting like immature, egotistical tools.
That's pretty much as far as I can take it without making the issue totally about drama. Lets just hope Blizzard jumps in and clears things up soon.
Jagoex Jun 29th 2009 11:08PM
Well there ya go -- Blizzard has spoken. Exodus was banned for 72 hours for using the exploit.
Enough said.
TobiasX Jun 29th 2009 11:21PM
Small correction:
Exodus' GM has demonstrated, on the guild's front page, that he is an immature, egotistical tool.
Very few members of Ensidia (notably NOT Kungen) have posted in that thread. Buzzkill just takes the piss out of anything and anyone he feels like no matter where they're from so I'm not sure he really counts either way. Of those that have posted I don't think any blatantly say "Exodus cheated" (Buzzkill implied it) and they've generally tried to avoid any name-calling.
Fizzle Jun 29th 2009 11:39PM
News just came down on Trade in realm. All in the run were banned 72 hours.
That settles that.
Vidi Jun 29th 2009 11:42PM
yeah cause everything you hear in trade chat is absolutely true
Vidi Jun 29th 2009 11:45PM
http://www.wow.com/2009/06/29/exodus-punished-for-exploiting-yogg-saron-encounter/
ok NOW, we have evidence and can believe it.
I sure hope none of you are ever on a jury.
Andrew Jun 30th 2009 5:01AM
Sounds like a bad case of sour grapes tbh.
I laughed at how Ensidia "exploiting" is "an interesting use of game mechanics" whilst anyone else alleged to be "exploiting" is a "cheater". It's not surprising as it always happens that way but it's still amusing.
Raven Jun 30th 2009 1:30PM
A lot of people seem to struggle with this. I am in no way defending either guild but:
Utilizing a spell in game to capitalise on a buff is/has been labelled 'clever use of game mechanics' and while I think that make's it sound completely innocent, I suspect the availability of the buff in such a fight was unintentional and an oversight by the design/QA staff. Technically, you could consider it an exploit but from a software developer's point of view I would label this as an unintended feature. I would say this is similar to the way using a DK or Voidwalker on 3D, in the words of Blizzard "made the fight a lot easier than was intended".
Going out of your way to remove a key element from a fight, completely negating the encounter design, as has happened with Flame Leviathan and now this, seems more intentionally malicious. In my opinion, the Flame Leviathan incident is more of an exploit since literally the whole fight is exploited, but understand that the 'AitD' incident is a lot more high profile and important in the community which is why I suspect there were suspensions. You have to do something about it or it gives the impression that it's ok to do things like this.
Andrew Jun 30th 2009 5:03AM
Ah, lol.
micahks Jun 30th 2009 10:36AM
I do not keep up with this crap, but due to boredom and server maintence I caught up on it via this site and the forums. I have to agree that it is funny that Ensidia used several exploits in the past, but when someone else does it they report. Not to mention saying theirs were diffrent. I guess all the other guilds will have to start reporting Ensidia in return. It will be interesting to watch how the 72 hour bans effect their progress. Seriously though Ensidia = 10 year olds trapped in adult bodies apparently.
evankimori Jun 30th 2009 10:39AM
Man, I can only imagine how the Lead Designer must be practically screaming at the various programmers right now:
"WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED HERE? DID NOBODY EVEN TEST THIS ENCOUNTER PROPERLY?!" etc etc.
There's probably a head rolling somewhere in a department for this.