The Care and Feeding of Warriors: Small changes

Okay, first off, a confession: I'm cheating on my fury spec.
I have been since the option to have dual talent specialization came out, actually. See, I tanked all through original WoW and The Burning Crusade (to be fair, I tanked as an arms or fury warrior because I could in MC and BWL) and so I figured, what the heck, I'll go prot for my offspec and tank some heroics. After an initial hiccough where I actually specced arms for some fights and fury for others, I settled back into a standard prot build for tanking heroics for friends. Then summer hit, and we all know what happens in summer: people suddenly want to go outside and froilic in the sunshine and you're sitting there waiting to raid with 22 people and no tanks. So what do you do?
Well, you strap on all that offspec tanking gear you collected 'just in case' and you tank Ulduar, that's what you do. Over the past couple of weeks I've tanked more than I've been DPS That's not the problem, however. It's not that I've been tanking that has me bothered... it's that I liked it. A lot.
I switched to DPS last December when I moved guilds and started WotLK progression. I was tired, and maybe even burned out on tanking. For some reason, when I tank I'm much more of a perfectionist than when I DPS, I work like a fiend to get and hold aggro (I was trying to multi-mob tank in ZA on Dragonhawk way before the change to TC and addition of Shockwave, which is one reason why I have this very impressive cyst on my right wrist) and in general I find the greatest satisfaction as a tank in doing as good a job as is possible. However, by the time BC ended, I had started to hate tanking, hate the guild I was in for being the people I tanked for, and hate Blizzard for how they designed tanking. You've either taken a look at that cyst picture or you haven't, but either way the ridiculous amount of spamming Devastate, Heroic Strike, and Shield Block (also TC every time it was up, also Demo Shout every time it was about to fall off, also Shield Slam every time it was up... warrior tanking meant never allowing a cooldown to lie fallow, you were slamming on keys like a pianist on crank) had left my right hand in a state of pure agony.
I had to ice my wrist down after we killed Kael'Thas the first time. I'm not even kidding here.
So when I found myself tanking again this week and found myself enjoying it again, it came to me as a bit of a shock. Not that I didn't know that they'd overhauled prot immensely in patch 3.0, I leveled from 70 to 80 as prot intending to tank for my then-guild before the lure of Titan's Grip became too strong to resist. But the reduction in the spam factor was pretty substantial. Aside from metaphorically slamming my foot down on the Heroic Strike accelerator, and beating on my Devastate key like it owed me money, and yes, hitting TC every single time it was up... well, okay, I'm not exactly making my case here but trust me, it really is a lot better now. Honestly, while it's hard for me to determine which tanking class is outright superior to the others (DK's generally get chosen for hard modes due to their ridiculous level of tanking cooldowns, I am aware, but while that's an important part of the game it's hardly all there is to tanking) I would have no difficulty in saying that there's nothing a warrior can't tank. It's probably true that a paladin would have an eaiser time with large AoE packs and can generate more threat up front, it's certainly true that a druid has higher armor and health and most likely a great deal more dodge (which is true avoidance and not a mixed stat like block) and we've already mention death knights and their cooldowns that a warrior has to double glyph just to approach. But when I as a warrior tank can solo tank Yogg-Saron's Phase 1 and 3 and get a successful kill, I have a hard time believing that warrior tanks are broken as such.
That being said, the recent changes to the class on the last PTR build seem like very welcome ones to me. Are they massive, ground breaking redesigns of the class? No, they're not. Do warriors need more to remain viable tanks? I think this is a deceptive issue. Warriors are viable tanks now. Blizzard keeps saying that warriors are very well represented in Ulduar, and while for myself I have to say I haven't seen that (I'm the only warrior currently doing much tanking for my guild) I don't see much point in disbelieving them on it, not only do they have access to numbers I don't but if they were lying then the whole point of the discussion would be gone.
I think the biggest issue facing warriors as tanks is that they are, in many ways, the legacy tanks of old content. Warriors are the tanks who were designed to tank MC, BWL, AQ, and original Naxx. They're based around the idea of steady damage coming in, converted to rage, and going back out as threat. This worked fine when warrior tanks had 4 to 6k health and took hits for 3 to 4k at the absolute most (not counting things like crushing blows or big predictable Broodlord Lashlayer MS hits that could crit for 8k) but now that damage comes in huge spikes of up to 25k and tank health fully buffed is creeping towards 45k or more, you end up in a situation where warrior threat is ridiculously spiky. The initial period of aggro generation is hampered by having, at the most, the rage from Bloodrage and a charge to work with, making AoE tanking still an issue for warrior tanks despite our greatly increased toolbox we gained in patch 3.0. Meanwhile, on a boss, a warrior will often go from having effectively no rage to suddenly seeing the rage bar fill up from a huge spike or two of damage, leading to what I said before about threat generation being extremely spiky.
Combine this with one of our tanking stats being fairly lackluster at the moment, (the change to Shield Specialization will help with this to some small degree, at least in terms of rage generation, but it doesn't fix the 'meh' factor of blocking a 25k hit and in so doing reducing it by 2k damage, and that only if you're lucky enough for the 25k hit to be physical and not magic damage) and it's quite understandable that warrior tanks would feel that patch 3.2 is a disappointing one for them. It's fair to say that, despite the drastic and welcome redesign of the warrior protection tree in patch 3.0, warriors are still a tanking class designed and built originally around the idea of spamming certain ability to gain and hold threat.
Such a class, and one based so much around mechanics like block that are simply less impressive in the WotLK tanking world of big spike damage that requires cooldowns to mitigate, ends up feeling a lot more fussy to tank with. There's less of a feeling of a rotation and more of a feeling of battering your keyboard into submission in any given attempt to tank a boss, and AoE tanking still requires a warrior to hope no one is stupid in the first ten seconds of a pull because it takes about that long to get thunderclap, shockwave and tab devastating to the point where mobs will hold themselves on you via damage shield, and in that window it's fairly easy for anyone to pull mobs off of you while you wait for an AoE cooldown.
While I believe it is possible for a warrior to tank any content in the game, and for some fights our vast array of situational abilities (Vigilance, Intervene, Spell Reflection to name a few) can be quite handy, warriors are tanking with a design philosophy from the original release of the game at their core, and despite all the changes and abilities bolted on to that framework in BC and WotLK, the legacy of that oldest set of tanking mechanics persists and needs to be addressed. I don't think it will break the game if it's not addressed in patch 3.2, no.
But I also don't think the band-aid changes to block value on gear are going to do much, and as long as warrior damage output is the lowest of all the tanks, our rage generation is inexorably tied primarily to how much damage we take, and our threat output is linked to spamming abilities (you should have seen my wrist after I got done solo tanking Yogg) there are going to be issues with warriors as tanks. I've learned in the past couple of weeks that yes, I enjoy tanking still, but that going back to it full time might well destroy my hand. Is it as bad as it was in BC? No, but not as bad doesn't mean good enough. The small changes we're seeing in 3.2 are a step in the right direction, now lets see some more steps.
Filed under: Warrior, Patches, Analysis / Opinion, Odds and ends, News items, (Warrior) The Care and Feeding of Warriors






Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)
Fu Leng Jul 2nd 2009 3:14PM
Please forgive my complete ignorance on the subject of rage - I've never run a warrior or druid before.
But couldn't you use a pre-combat Rage Potion before difficult AOE pulls?
Erogroth Jul 2nd 2009 3:30PM
Ya you could. But depending on the fight an armor pot is sometimes better for the pull.
I have been tanking with my warrior since UBRS and it has changed to some degree but it is the same at the core. I have been working on Yogg recently and phase 1 on that fight is a bi*ch! I can handle it. I can get through it but all it takes is someone hitting the adds before they reach me and it becomes a mess. You can't charge to the adds since you have to stay out of clouds and your taunt is on a 10 sec cooldown unless your vigilance target gets hit. Your only other hope is heroic throw as a Oh S**t button or your aoe taunt. TC can be good if the target is near you but you don't always have that luxury. I love tanking. LOVE IT! But people need to understand how hard the first few seconds of a fight is on us especially if you happen to dodge an attack or 2. I am so sick of hearing how they are used to the Paladin threat.
Heilig Jul 2nd 2009 3:32PM
Sure, and you can use a pre-combat dps potion, too. Do you? of course not. No one should need to use consumables to be able to do their job on trash, ESPECIALLY consumables to fill the primary resource that even allows you to do your job AT ALL.
Not to mention the chain-pulling that takes place in many cases. You would never leave combat long enough to use another pot, and if you did it would end up being very expensive just to meet minimum tanking requirements.
vazhkatsi Jul 2nd 2009 3:35PM
yes... but what for? with shield spec you block enough and gain enough rage where in an aoe pack rage isnt a problem, instead its that you have to work around a 6 second and 20 second cooldown as you're only real aoe threat dealers. theres damage shield, but thats minor, as are all the shouts. so you wind up tabbing around and hitting individuals with devastates and HS's. luckily if you time it right, and the mobs are stunnable you can usually Tclap, shockwave, and when the stun wears off Tclap again.
jjcoola998 Jul 2nd 2009 3:52PM
or your DPS could wait 2 globals before burning aoe packs... warrior threat and snap threat are great though on single target.
nyctef Jul 2nd 2009 9:16PM
As a druid tank I sometimes see spiky rage like you mention - but most bosses have plenty of raid damage that usually keeps my rage bar topped up nicely.
Blackrok Jul 2nd 2009 3:19PM
I agree with warriors being able to tank any content. I also agree that most who say warrior tanks are broken just do not understand the class mechanics. I main tank all of Ulduar and Naxx raids for our guild, and have no problem doing it. Except the hand cramps..... /sigh.
HJACK1 Jul 2nd 2009 3:20PM
The Link for your "very impressive cyst" is broken.
Matthew Rossi Jul 2nd 2009 3:33PM
Should be able to view it now.
shaun.sparks Jul 2nd 2009 4:02PM
Hit that thing with a book. Seriously, my co-worker has had a cyst for months that after a lot of internet research we learned this was the preferred method of getting rid of cysts on the wrist. Yesterday afternoon, I hit her with a book and the cyst is gone and she just has an impressive bruise there today. She keeps thanking me and telling me how much better it feels!
Tisen Jul 2nd 2009 11:01PM
That cyst is known as a ganglion cyst and yes, hitting it with a big book (dictionary or a bible work best) will get rid of it.
THE MORE YOU KNOW!!!
Robert M Jul 2nd 2009 3:24PM
Well done again Rossi. I swear your posts make me wish I played a warrior, but I just can't seem to level one past 21.
alpha5099 Jul 2nd 2009 3:28PM
I will second that. My main's a shaman, and I love Rossi's work on both Totem Talk and TCaFoW that I decided to roll a warrior last week to see if it appealed to me. I've gotten him up to 28 so far (leveling prot), and so far I love it.
Keep up the great work.
Alex Yang-Nikodym Jul 2nd 2009 3:29PM
Here's what helps AoE tanking: Cleave, and Glyph of Cleaving. Replace Heroic Strike with Cleave in a 2+ mob pull and you're set. Works like a charm.
Kaphik Jul 2nd 2009 3:36PM
Glyph of Sunder Armor helps a lot, too. Tab target a couple of times and youc an have 5 Sunders stacked up on 5+ targets very quickly.
The guild I'm in now is running a DK tank, warrior tank, and druid tank for heroic Ulduar, and we're doing extremely well. I was actually very surprised to find that there wasn't a regular paladin tank.
micgillam Jul 2nd 2009 3:42PM
I'll vouch for Glyph of Sunder Armor as well, I use it and I love it for helping hold multi-mob aggro.
jjcoola998 Jul 2nd 2009 3:53PM
yes, kaphik I believe personally that is the Ideal tanking setup.
Equillian Jul 3rd 2009 1:27AM
Rage Potions are expensive, plain and simple.
It's not an issue of rage as much as it is "Rage and Getting off 3 moves before everyone starts attacking". Tanking as a warrior is challenging, but I dont quite think it's challenging in the right way.
I play a prot pally (arguable the best tank in game for aoe pulls) - comparatively, I can walk up to a group and the dps can start immediately. With a warrior, you need to give him a few seconds (up to 10) just to where he can hold through the fight.
To fix the warrior, its simple... either SIGNIFIGANTLY up the damage or, SIGNIFIGANTLY increase the threat of Thunderclap. There is no middle ground (aside from some new abilities).
Reddeth Jul 2nd 2009 3:39PM
Ah, I guess it's the price we pay for playing such a complex class. (The funny thing is I originally rolled my warrior way back with I first started because I thought playing a warrior would be simple. I mean, you just hit things, right?)
micgillam Jul 2nd 2009 3:40PM
In Diablo 2, I believe the Barbarian class had a Natural Resistance talent at the bottom of the tree that gave +x% to all resistances per point. I think something similar sliding into the prot tree to help the warrior handle magic damage better would make them a more favorable choice for some of the content that they're currently last pick for. Maybe a straight buff, maybe based on stat conversion (+x to all resistances for every y stamina, for example).