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All of the latest Mists of Pandaria newsDrama Mamas: Let the drama begin!
by Lisa Poisso 
Jul 10th 2009 at 1:00PM
Let the Drama Mamas guide you through the sticky business of dodging drama, toward becoming that player everyone wants in their group. Drama Mamas Lisa Poisso and Robin Torres are taking your questions at DramaMamas (at) WoW (dot) com. Getting your own 15 Minutes of Fame is not a bad thing – except when it's for all the wrong reasons. Leave the drama, Dear Reader, to the denizens of GuildWatch. Introducing WoW.com's Drama Mamas, here to help you stay out of the wrong kind of spotlight. Drama Mamas Lisa Poisso and Robin Torres are real-life mamas and experienced WoW players. And just as we don't want our precious babies to be the ones kicking and wailing on the floor of checkout lane next to the candy, neither do we want you to become known as That Guy on your server.
What to do, what to say? Let the Drama Mamas guide you:
- The polite way to share quest monsters
- When someone "accidentally" ninjas your loot
- When you accidentally ninja someone else's loot
- Handling the (nice but annoying) pest
- When your friend's significant other is an awful player
And now, on to the matters at hand ...
This week, the Drama Mamas lend their wisdom to two younger players wrestling with the age-old problem of ... well, age.
Drama Mama Lisa: Oh, boy (and "boy" is definitely the operative word) ... Not a Baby Boy, the problem isn't how old you are – it's how old you're not. The guilds you keep applying to are looking for dudes who are in the same general place in life as they are. It's not just things like someone whose mom won't make him stop raiding to go to bed on an exam night (although that's important, too). They're looking for someone who can relate to all the things they do outside of WoW. They want to talk about the campus parties, their jobs, dating, the social scene ... things you haven't had much of a shot at yet, at 16.
They're also looking for a place to cut loose. Vent can be a place where they can indulge, both literally and figuratively – and you're not legal age yet. Are those things part of WoW? No. Should they be important in WoW? Maybe ... But they definitely are important to your potential guildies, if they enjoy talking about that stuff in game.
It may sound backwards, but it may work in your favor to look for a guild of even older players. Players who are well past the college and early 20s years, who have busy careers and families of their own, are generally looking for a less raucous atmosphere with more of a focus on getting things done in a reasonable amount of time. And even if they do think you're a "baby boy" – well, they're parents, too. They can relate.
Drama Mama Robin: Many serious raiding guilds would appreciate your skills but probably have an age restriction due to experiences with other young players. There is a perception that younger players constantly use leetspeak, throw temper tantrums when things don't go their way and (as Drama Mama Lisa said) are beholden to a higher/parental authority.
Your job is to prove to them that they won't be able to tell how old you are:
- Fill out their guild app completely and honestly, using correct spelling and grammar. Be honest about your age, but ask for a chance to run with them to prove age will not be an issue.
- Continue using your language skills in all chat. Presenting yourself as an educated adult will make people forget you aren't.
- Respect all loot rules and decisions. All apps and new guildies are lowest on the totem pole - and this reflects real life. You aren't going to get the phat raiding lewt until you have proven yourself a valuable teammate.
- Don't commit to a raid unless you have the time and parental permission. Mom aggro sucks for everyone.
Dear Drama Mamas: My mom says it's ok to play WoW, but then she keeps not letting me play! Every time I get in a group, she wants me to do something. I'm afraid to even try to raid. She just doesn't get it. School's out! I wanna play! Help me explain that I can't just leave the game any time she wants me to or else it's just not worth playing. Signed, Sad in the SummertimeDrama Mama Robin: Sad, I can understand your frustration. My 3-year-old doesn't get it either - but unlike her, you have some options for reasoning with your mother. Scheduling is the key here. Sit down and work out two schedules with your mom: a chore schedule and a WoW schedule. If you trade her some uninterrupted chore time, my guess is that she will respect your play sessions.
Drama Mama Lisa: What your mom needs is the ol' bowling league analogy. Explain to her that playing WoW is like bowling: you can wander down to the alley and sling a few balls down the lane on your own, but it's much more fun with a group. Once you've committed to a group, your groupmates – just like the members of a bowling team – rely on you to hold up your end of the bargain.
Give your mom an idea of how long common WoW activities run: "A five-man dungeon usually takes about an hour, but it could go twice that if our group is having a hard time. I can zip through all my dailies (the chores my character uses to make money and maintain her stuff) in about X minutes. A raid is more like a bowling tournament; I need to be available the entire afternoon or evening." Then don't leave the rest to chance – talk to her in advance about which activities might match up best with the time slots when she thinks you could (and should) be playing.
Remember, your mama wouldn't want to see your name on any drama. Play nice ... and when in doubt, ask the Drama Mamas at DramaMamas (at) WoW (dot) com.Filed under: WoW Social Conventions, Virtual selves, Features, Drama Mamas
Reader Comments (Page 4 of 6)
Daine Jul 10th 2009 2:00PM
mmoredrama.wordpress.com
Don't steal my llamas :(
Vidi Jul 10th 2009 2:02PM
Its not just Mothers who interrupt alot during game time, non gamer wives do the same. The mistake is not theirs, but ours.
Here's a little advice:
At least one hour before you begin gaming, tell your wife/parent that you plan on being on the game at a specific time. If you are raiding or running an instance, explain to them that once this begins, you have made a commitment to 4, 9 or 24 other people to be there at all times and you will be unable to do any chores that they may have for you.
Then, and this is the most important part, you must ask them if there is anything you can do for them BEFORE this begins. By doing this, you are showing that you are being a responsible person not only to your online friends but to them as well.
This also worked with my father-in-law who had a nasty habit of showing up to "chat" on Raid nights. Drove me crazy until I explained that there were all these people relying on me and I had to respect the commitment I had made to them. He immediately understood ( which was shocking cause this is a man who had no boundaries hehe ) and would call after to ask if it was a good time.
With my wife, I had to be sure I took care of what she felt I needed to do for the family before Raid time. Once that was accomplished, not only did she support me during those times, she would stop by the comp to ask game related questions, bring me snacks and the occasional neck rub. ( I am a very very very very lucky man ) But I had to deal with my responsibilities to the family first. Once she knew I wasn't going to ignore that, I gained alot more freedom.
Being a responsible gamer goes far beyond your in-game experience, it means taking care of your real life first so that it doesn't distract from your in-game commitments.
Vladeon Jul 10th 2009 2:38PM
You are a lucky man. I tried the same tactic with my girlfriend and she only asked me, "is your commitment to those other players more important than your commitment to me?"
There's no answer to that other than to, as quickly as possible, turn off the computer.
Forcepath Jul 10th 2009 3:15PM
@Vladeon: Personally, I think that kind of passive aggressive behavior is unbecoming in a significant other. OF COURSE they are important, but if you aren't allowed to live a life outside of your significant other, then most relationships tend to sour fast. My girlfriend has great respect for the nights when I say I just need to stay in and unwind. Mind you, since we are both introverted people by nature, this is good for both of us, but my point is: nobody should be forced to make stupid choices like that. Relationships aren't about spending as much time together as possible - that comes when you're married anyways - they're about learning to love someone who isn't you and probably helps complete you in many ways. /shrug
Weird rant.
Irem Jul 10th 2009 3:45PM
@Vladeon This is none of my business, and you didn't say whether you actually -had- made a commitment to her for the time period you were playing in (as in she'd made arrangements to visit you vs. "but that's just a stupid game and you should drop it whenever I ask"), but one thing you can do is calmly point out that you wouldn't ask her to cancel/give up one of her hobbies on a whim, and you'd appreciate if she'd show you the same courtesy.
Ian R. (Orkchop) Jul 10th 2009 2:01PM
Do we post questions here, like The Queue? I have one:
Do you have any tips on you and your 3 year old playing together? I started a Belf Paladin for my daughter. Should we try to level that, or do something else? Maybe start fishing on my main or go for The Explorer achievement (using maps, just like Dora :D ). Are there any activities that you were able to enjoy with your children?
Lisa Poisso Jul 10th 2009 2:30PM
Send questions directly to us at DramaMamas (at) wow (dot) com.
As for playing with your daughter, my kids both started fiddling about with various games around that age. It's more fun, really, to let them take things at their own pace. For my son, that meant becoming intimately familiar with the area around the inn in Northern Ro in EverQuest, where he would run around jumping over the armadillos. (Much fun was had learning how to recognize the words "Dorn B'Dynn" in the chat box so he could then book it out of the area). Our youngest wanted to make the acquaintance of every last bandit that's ever spawned in Elwynn Forest and enjoyed developing an extensive wardrobe for every occasion. It's very quirky at that age -- don't try to shape it. Just go along with and enjoy!
jbodar Jul 10th 2009 4:28PM
Fishing?! That has to be child abuse or something... ;p
yaminokishi Jul 10th 2009 2:12PM
"The guilds you keep applying to are looking for dudes who are in the same general place in life as they are. It's not just things like someone whose mom won't make him stop raiding to go to bed on an exam night (although that's important, too). They're looking for someone who can relate to all the things they do outside of WoW. They want to talk about the campus parties, their jobs, dating, the social scene ... things you haven't had much of a shot at yet, at 16."
No *raiding* guild I have ever heard of is going to turn down someone because of something like this.
Anyway, if the raiding guild you have your heart set on has a strict 18+ policy just lie about your age on the application. If you're a good mature player they are going to overlook the age thing.
impurezero Jul 10th 2009 2:30PM
I'm surprised it took someone so long to mention the obvious solution. Lie!
If he's really as mature as he claims, then it'll work just fine. (Unless he just has one of those obvious children's voices...)
RaptorGsus Jul 10th 2009 2:40PM
Yeah, and then when your guild finds out you lied about your age, you'll get gkicked.
JKWood Jul 10th 2009 3:53PM
Yes, because lying to get what you want is a sign of character.
Irem Jul 10th 2009 4:00PM
If you're a good mature player you won't lie about your age on a guild application. Just the act of doing so proves that you're not able to put the needs or desires of other people above your own, and are in fact willing to actively go against them to get what you want.
I've been in 18+ guilds before, and regardless of the kind of language used or whatever there's some stuff I wouldn't feel comfortable discussing or revealing if I knew one of the people listening was a minor. And I know that when I was a teenager I thought there was nothing I couldn't handle discussing and that I totally would be fine with anything an adult would want to tell me, and it took me until I grew up to realize that it wasn't about what -I- could handle, it was about -their- wishes to not have those conversations with a child.
The ability to empathize with and respect others is the first sign of actual maturity.
impurezero Jul 10th 2009 4:01PM
Certainly not. But if he's truly "mature" enough to get away with it without getting caught, then it really doesn't harm anyone. A true "victimless crime" if you will.
Irem Jul 10th 2009 4:35PM
@impurezero Again, this is the point I'm trying to make. It's a "victimless crime" only if you don't care how other people would feel about it if they knew. It's incredibly disrespectful and the opposite of mature behavior to simply go behind someone's back because you think you won't get caught.
As an example, if I don't know someone's age, I'm not likely to go into certain topics just to be safe. However, if I found out that my 28-year-old friend that I have shared some of the details of my personal life with and had conversations about volatile political/social topics with was really 15, I would feel very, very upset and disturbed. Some people would argue that it's the internet and you should never trust what you hear anyway, but as a species we like to talk about stuff with people who are like us, and that's why people make spaces that specifically have age limits, and trust people to abide by them.
The words "victimless crime" are being used in this case to mean something more like "it's only illegal if I get caught." If a kid is willing to break a clearly stated rule and potentially hurt people (and it does hurt to be lied to like that) in order to get ahead in a video game, they are the very person the rule is meant to keep out.
Guildenstern Jul 10th 2009 4:56PM
"if the raiding guild you have your heart set on has a strict 18+ policy just lie about your age on the application"
You have GOT to be kidding.
Yeah, that's real mature.
impurezero Jul 10th 2009 5:40PM
I think we're just gonna have to agree to disagree on this one.
First off, the concept of the magic number "18" automatically equaling adult is simply an arbitrary decision made by God knows who. To me, you should really judge the people you converse with online based on the conversations themselves. If you had a social/personal/political conversation with someone and enjoyed it at the time...I don't see why you should be "hurt" later on when you discover that you had this conversation with someone who was born in a slightly different year that you initially thought.
Likewise, you can have the same type of conversation with someone exactly your age and hate their point of view. It's one thing if you were lied to in a way that has some real reprecussions for you, but I just don't see it here.
One last thought: This is, after all, a role-playing game, and really it could be said that it's not any of your business what age the other players are. The lines are intentionally blurred sometimes between reality and our avatars. Technically, it's against the TOS for you to go around blabbing another user's personal information anyway. This rule is in place for a reason. Not everyone wants their true identities given to random strangers in a game. And that's exactly what it is...a game.
So, back to my point...judge based on character...not age. There's no magic switch that flips in a brain on someone's 18th birthday. Those behaviors that endeared you do another player should not suddenly be worth nothing because they fudged a tiny little thing on their application.
(Note: For the most part, I'm just playing devil's advocate here. My initial response really was just me being surprised at the length of time this suggestion took to appear.)
Sarabande Jul 12th 2009 7:22AM
This very topic is a discussion of a thread on the Guild Relations forum on the official site. It caused the guild a lot of problems once it came out that a really good and mature player had been underage at the time of the application (and in fact, still was by a few months).
It's best not to lie. You might ask to PuG with them or hang out, and if they can see that you are mature, they may let you join but lying could cause them to look at you differently if they found out later, even if everything else about you is cool.
kadield Jul 10th 2009 2:16PM
FYI, I do love the name of the article!
But, back on point, our guild doesn't have a firm age restriction as a lot of the officers/regular raiders are parents and most of their children are in our guild, so our guild atmosphere is very family friendly (no swearing on vent/guildchat/etc). However, we're normally looking for mature raiders. So when I see an app for our guild, I'll pay special attention to how they phrase their thoughts and what not to see if they're personality will work with ours, irregardless of their age. I think we've all seen 16 year olds speak like adults and we've seen 30 year olds act like children. I for one was a very mature "young one" and I give everyone the opportunity to show me that they can be mature and responsible.
ImDrFreak Jul 11th 2009 2:28AM
My guild has a strict 18 and over policy. It has nothing to do with how good or bad a person is, if they're dedicated players, etc.
It's mostly that our guild is made up of mostly adults, and as such, adult conversations happen in guild chat... Plenty of swear words, and urban dictionary (if you know what I mean) The last thing we need is for someone's mom to look over their shoulder, see one of our Biology professors amusing and revolting their fellow guildies by talking about the mating habits of echidnas (or, you know, humans)
Parents all over the country are upset at the latest Pixar film for "scarring" their children by having a scene about "infertility"... If that's any example of how parents are... yeah... no.