Blizzard to focus on battlegrounds more
by Mike Schramm 
Jul 29th 2009 at 7:00PM
Ghostcrawler has posted a little paragraph on the forums, reaffirming something we've already heard from Blizzard: that in the past, they've spent more time on Arenas to the detriment of battlegrounds, and that battlegrounds are going to be gaining a little more focus in the future. They've already started, actually, with the Isle of Conquest in 3.2, but GC says there's even more on the table, and that future plans will be revealed at BlizzCon.He also brings up another good point, however: in terms of class balance, Arenas are a much more striking example of imbalances than battlegrounds are. Battlegrounds have all sorts of things going on, and so you don't get as good a picture of just how the different classes work with and against each other as you do in Arenas. And so, if you're a dev trying to figure out class balances, of course you'll spend more time looking at the Arena gameplay than the BGs. GC also says that the majority of issues in BGs tend to be map-based rather than class imbalances, which is really a whole other science. Not that BGs aren't relevant to how the classes work, just that there are many more variables in there than the relative vacuum chamber of Arenas.
All good points. I'm a fan of battlegrounds much more than Arenas, but I don't particularly feel that Blizzard has ignored them necessarily. The real problem, to my mind, with BGs is simply how faction imbalanced they are: it seems like on every realm in every given BG, one side always seems to have the upper hand, for whatever reason. Sometimes it's a population problem, sometimes it's a map issue. But GC is right: those problems are more pressing than class balance in the BGs.
Filed under: Horde, Battlegrounds, Classes, PvP, Blizzard, Odds and ends, Fan stuff, Analysis / Opinion, Alliance, Arena
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 6)
jfofla Jul 29th 2009 7:06PM
Please let this mean that Blizzard will no longer try and balance the game based on Arenas!
Valt Jul 29th 2009 7:22PM
But does this mean they will tone down the AoE damage?
Plot thickens.
Dun dun duu
R Jul 30th 2009 12:50AM
It means that blizzard will now apply their new design philosophy toward battlegrounds: Nerf everything, and when fun is being had doing something, remove it. nerf, nerf, nerf, remove, nerf, remove, make the least played battleground less fun, When players want something, don't fix it until it is seen as a monetary loss, nerf, nerf, nerf, fix something that isn't broken, ignore players of every level except 80.
brownyboi Jul 30th 2009 5:10AM
I think that that's quite accurate, really - didn't think that it needed voting down :-)
Bod Jul 30th 2009 6:40AM
@jfofla completely agree. I'll probably be greyed out for daring to suggest this, but balancing a game based on something a tiny minority of players devote time to has been damaging both to PVP and PVE, and arguably a huge waste of development time in Wrath.
Any number of PVE talents have been ammended, changed or downright nerfed to compensate for Arena (dispersion, replenishment, retri pally and dk on mass to name but 4), and real PVP issues, such as shammy survivability or SP usefulness put on the back burner to fix these perceived imbalances.
I have a tiny hope this might be the end of this nonsense, at least until the next expansion, and that we can get back to spending development time where the majority of players spend their time...fingers crossed.
Andrew R. Jul 29th 2009 7:07PM
I can't stand arenas. I do BG's to have fun and because I can play at 4am or 4pm and not have to worry about my teammate(s) being on and trying to work around their schedule.
Arena only favors certain classes and that's my other beef. I play a hunter and while I'm not the best at pvp I'd rather avoid going into arenas since it never pays off. Maybe now we will see more BG rewards. Only time will tell.
Ras Gonzo Jul 29th 2009 7:11PM
I miss premades so much. I wish for them to come back. It was a cool thing to have happen when 25 guildies raiding X raid, and the other 25 are running guild premades all night, those were the daze...
impurezero Jul 29th 2009 7:13PM
My dream...several more battlegrounds, and one giant battlegroup to compensate.
Philip Jul 29th 2009 7:14PM
GC says the majority of issues in BG's are map-based? lol
I'm quite sure casuals probably don't notice the obvious class imbalances. Anyone who PvP's for the love of PvP, and I'm talking about the guy/gal who's qeueing up even when honor-capped with 100 of every mark, notices the imbalances. When the opposing team would rather have a tree druid hold the flag than a prot warrior, something has gone terribly awry. And you don't have to be on the Blizz Dev team to figure it out, either.
Quite honestly, the fact that Alliance can just ride into Horde's camp in AV is the LEAST of the problems in battlegrounds.
Maybe Mr. Ghostcrawler can start by addressing the AFK'ers, the botters, or both. And for the arena e-sporters, maybe he can quite making them spend time rolling in BG's that they, by their own admission, hate to begin with.
Sorry, this isn't a QQ post. I just find it mildly amusing that after all the complaints left by the player base on the forums, that GC came away with "map issues" as the big deal.
Jack Spicer Jul 29th 2009 7:23PM
A lot of the points you bring up are the same reasons why arena gets all the great gear while BG awards are lacking in comparison.
thebvp Jul 29th 2009 7:28PM
It depends on what you call casual.
I've floated between "casual" and "serious player" since launch. I'd currently consider myself "casual," playing maybe twice a week, and the imbalances are very obvious, especially in a place like AV.
On my battlegroup, there was a time in Vanilla when AV seemed pretty even, except I remember sitting in one for literally eight hours.
In BC, I decided to try out a Paladin and parked his butt at 59, where he has been ever since. During that time, Horde not just won every time, they steamrolled. I think I lost maybe three AVs then.
Then Blizzard nerfed the crap out of the Horde starting area and choke point and we started losing. It was a complete reversal and extremely obvious to everyone.
And we've been losing ever since. Just take a look at any player's stats in that bracket. Achievements and persistent stats don't lie.
megamogx Jul 29th 2009 7:40PM
indeed and the fact that they are turning the PVE game into a lame esport to counter the mounts that top arena players earn. So now raiders are just supposed to chase after the carrot and hope they can get them before the undisclosed time comes and they remove them for rarity of 310% flying or so they say... Just what i wanted in my PVE end game arena season mentality..... If they spent at much time on making BGs have a balanced class representation(for example WSG with no druid/healers on your team when other team is stacked with dk/pallys/geared mofos well your team gets some softies in green gear)
Arena blows and blizzard keeps trying to force it down our throats just so we can enjoy BGs and not get pwned by unkillable arena players. And trying to apply it to PVE is fail and even blizzard can't balance end game properly enough to warrant removing the drakes now because 25man one is so much harder then 10man(might have something to do with it being outgeared in 25man gear from uld25, aka the reason they say the rewards have to be removed, can't out gear the encounter or that would just trivialize it supposedly or so they say)
alex Jul 29th 2009 8:00PM
"GC says the majority of issues in BG's are map-based? lol"
No, Ghostcrawler does not say that. Mike (the guy who wrote this article) said that.
Ghostcrawler actually said "... [BGs] tend to be more sensitive to say map issues than class issues."
Which I agree with. Whether you agree with it or not is a different story, but it's quite different than what you're responding to ("the majority of issues").
Clbull Jul 29th 2009 9:39PM
Alterac Valley definitely favours the Alliance more in its map design to be honest. As for other battlegrounds, they're equal.
buenoexcellente Jul 30th 2009 12:17AM
One of the things people aren't realizing is that battlegrounds are now relatively unorganized simply because there is no penalty for losing and the gear provided is second or even third tier.
If Blizzard starts to give top tier gear for BG participation what will be the requirements? If those requirements are strict, then you will again see people generating the optimal team to meet those requirements. So class balance issues will again rise. Different ones to be sure but issues nonetheless.
Also what will be the penalty for losing? If there is no penalty for losing then why would you PVE and deal with wipes?
FASTFIRE Jul 30th 2009 12:47AM
Horde QQ is epic in this thread...
most of the top Arena teams are Alliance....is Arena balanced in Aliance's favor too?
Dart Jul 30th 2009 1:07AM
Yes, totally disregard that double trinkets on ret/rogue pwns anything the Horde can get.
I placed in the last AJ tourney because, yes I rolled ally with my 2 arena buddies to play Ret/mage/priest because double trinkets, and stoneform win games.
This arguement will never end unless you roll the opposite team and play high end arena. Theres a difference, don't be a scrub and QQ about things you don't know.
M Jul 30th 2009 8:18AM
Also, it was the author of the article who said:
"it seems like on every realm in every given BG, one side always seems to have the upper hand"
I would agree that's a problem if not for the fact that it usually tends to be different factions on each server who have the upper hand for any given battleground, and even that changes depending on the bracket.
Battlegrounds are "better" PvP because class balance doesn't have such a HUGE impact as it does in Arenas. It works with the MMO concept, where you work together with -many- other people to accomplish a goal.
Arenas? Just something they're trying to turn into a cash-cow.
Dere Jul 30th 2009 8:50AM
How can you guys sit there and say they nerf a class just for PVP and i dont like that....and then in the next breath say Druid healers are OP???
This is the real problem with the game people that want to be able to steamroll the other team because they are the flavor of the month, and that's the way it should be. To that i say MEH go back to your PVE and leave it be i will stay with a few classes being able to out heal my dmg if it means that the same healer on my team can heal me through someone else dmg also. The only real thing that makes me sad is the lack of diversity in BGs, but that is not really a class issue it's more of a perception issue IMO people want to be able to be the most powerful class in the game so they can be the Rambo in the BG and take out the other team all by them self, but they seem to forget that this is a MMO and the whole reason we play this game is to work as a team and use another players strengths to make up for our lack of power. Have you ever been killed by a tree druid?? I can't think of one time that i have, but a tree druid healing a Ret Pally now that is a sure fire death sentence to most of us. Get a lock and shut down the healer and a mage to make sure he stay shut down and you can win...it's just a matter of working with what you have and not crying every time someone beats you like some school yard punk.
But i could be wrong.
Nick S Jul 30th 2009 10:30AM
I'm not a "serious" PvPer - just got 1850 for the first time last week - but I agree that class imbalances seem pretty obvious even in BGs. If I met at 5 DK/5 Resto Druid team in WSG, I wouldn't expect to be able to win unless they were much worse geared.