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All of the latest Mists of Pandaria newsThe purpose of Achievements, and how it's changed over time
by Mike Schramm 
Aug 13th 2009 at 3:00PM
Moonglade has a good post up about the pros and cons of achievements. Nowadays, achievements are everywhere, but when they were introduced to the game a while ago, they were seen as a great way for Blizzard to integrate an idea that had really taken off on Xbox Live (and that an impending competing MMO, Warhammer Online, was implementing for themselves). They were mostly seen as a benefit for the solo player -- even if you hit level 80 and nabbed some awesome gear, there'd be some optional fun for you to have in the future.Since then, achievements have changed quite a bit -- I'd argue that they're actually more used in groups than in solo play, as raids check players for achievements when inviting them, and guilds use achievements to rate where their proficiency lies. There are certainly still lots of things for solo players to do (every holiday, achievements come to the forefront again), but titles and mounts have become the main goals there, not just optional points. As Moonglade says, instancing and checking up on what players have done seem to have become the main point of achievements. What was just a bragging competition on Xbox Live has transitioned to a real yardstick in terms of what a player focuses on in game and what they've done so far.
Is that bad? I don't think so -- Blizzard has done with achievements what they've done brilliantly with all of the other features of their games: borrow them, polish them, and then make them better. If you look through that old thread, most of the talk was about achievements pushing people to keep playing the game, and that happened, but I think one thing Blizzard has done is use achievements as a way to see what people have done so far as well: what instances have you run, what quests have you completed, what titles do you have already? There's lots more value to achievements than what any of us originally envisioned.
Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Odds and ends, Blizzard, Instances, Leveling, Achievements
Reader Comments (Page 3 of 5)
Sinthar Aug 15th 2009 10:05PM
To ALL grammar Nazis out there. As a Dyslexic i find someone continually stating THATS WRONG gives me (and many others) a continual sense of enjoyment. I even make my spelling deliberately bad (esp when posting about rouges on a rogue blog), just to egg them on. Language is a tool to be used. Many words we now use - in fact most - were originally not IN the language, and grammar/spelling nazi's would have denied anyone the use of those words if they had their way (like the word quiz - was introduced by ONE man as a bet - look it up if you dont believe me). If you understand what they are trying to mean, then imo its wright, as its done the purpose for which it was intended.
Anyhows, hopes u all likz thus litle speek. Enjy
Kumo Aug 13th 2009 3:19PM
The negative side of achievements is worse then the benefits.
-Elitist Guilds/Groups who won't even invite you unless you already have the achievement for having beaten the target(s).
- Lazy Raids/Groups who do the same for everyone but themselves, so they can get carried through the target despite their gear/skill level.
It's become a E-Peen barometer for the most part, and despite having pretty much every raid/heroic achievement, I routinely avoid and ignore such LFG/LFM calls.
DigitalMonitor Aug 13th 2009 4:44PM
This! Last week I did a LFG with an un-chievement requirement. Just to give people a chance, only people without the achievement were allowed to join the group . And the run went really well!
Worcester Aug 13th 2009 5:03PM
Those elitist and lazy players all behaved the same way before Achievements. Then they judged you on your gear instead of your accomplishments.
Achievements do offer a personal sense of reward. I don't need a group to get many of them. Titles are also a fun way to personalize your character, and show your commitment to other aspects of the game. I was able to get Merrymaker on my Undead Rogue long before I could fly in Northrend. It took some very creative gameplay to get on that flying ship in Icecrown, but my personal sense of accomplishment made it worthwhile.
I don't think anything will curb the rude, elitist behavior of some players... except for some form of shock therapy! Now that would be awesome!
catharsis80 Aug 13th 2009 3:20PM
Wow, the timing of this article is incredible. I JUST had a conversation with a co-worker about "achievement" in video games in the recent years. I was saying exactly what you're saying, and almost in your wording.
However, on the whole, I almost wish achievements had never come into play. It feels like a cheesy boy scout badge of honor system to me, and when I see people going out of their way to do achievements that are worthless, it boggles my mind. I will ask them why, and they can never, ever give a good reason.
Achievements are a double-edged sword. They are good for all the reasons you listed, but bad because they can tempt us all to turn the game from fun into simply checking off boxes on our shopping list of things to do.
fauxbo Aug 13th 2009 4:09PM
I love the argument that achievements aren't 'worth' anything.
It's a game, your imaginary gold points are 'worth' as much as my imaginary achievement points.
It's 'worth' is measured in how much pleasure you derive from it, if you like them they are worth a lot.
Personally after the nth time through a dungeon I want something different, I like that Blizz has given some ideas.
jfofla Aug 13th 2009 3:56PM
I absolutely love checking off those boxes. I look at what Achievements I need, and plan how to get them. I currently have 85 mounts, and all my focus in the game is getting to 100.
catharsis80 Aug 13th 2009 3:59PM
Why, out of curiosity?
Dharmabhum Aug 13th 2009 4:07PM
@jfofla:
I'm the same way. I love that you can fill out your cooking and fishing profession achievements just doing many of the things you would have otherwise. Hell once I got those done, I ended up leveling first aid up through Outland just so I got the Skills to Pay the Bills achievement, even though I don't need first aid really as I play a priest.
In the end, yes, they are arbitrary points that we accumulate with a nice little flash and ding to it. To be honest though, I don't really see how its that much different from getting a new purple ring or something. After all, its just digits on a computer somewhere as they have no bearing on real life at all. But thats why I play video games in the first place.
Arbitrary point wins 4tw!
Irshalthra Aug 13th 2009 4:13PM
I can't answer for jfofla, but as for me it is something to do at end game. Keeps me entertained and keeps me playing. I do not have blocks of time to raid so at end game so those "worthless" achievements are my goal/fun. I thrive getting any achievement I can, whether "worthless" or otherwise deemed "worthwhile". That of course leads to the ultimate question of which ones are "worthless" and which are "worthwhile"... all in the eye of the beholder. My Baron Deathcharger achievement is worth a lot to me, but worthless to others so I hear.
I see it this way - I love living in the fantasy world otherwise known as wow and chatting with my friends, if not for achievements I would have dumped wow at end game due to boredome. Win/win for me and Blizzard - smart company and I thank them for it.
danawhitaker Aug 13th 2009 4:13PM
Why, exactly, does someone need a "good" reason? It's a video game. Can't people do something just for fun? Plus we'll ignore the fact that your definition of "good" may vary widely from that of the general player base.
One of the contributing factors to my quitting the game at 70 was the fact that there was no way to measure my progress toward certain goals I had in the game. I wanted to collect pets, and mounts, and tabards, and grind rep, and complete all the available quests in zones, but actually keeping track of those things without having out-of-game spreadsheets and lists was nearly impossible. When I came back, I found much of this stuff built into the achievement system for me.
I would never exclude people from running things simply because they didn't have an achievement for it or didn't know the fight (with the exception of recently excluding a former guildmate who had made fun of me for doing jousting and the Argent Tournament dailies before 3.2 dropped; he was lowest man on the totem pole to go along to Trial of the Champions). Otherwise, I'm usually willing to give people the benefit of the doubt. Long before achievements existed, people would say when looking for groups that people needed to know the fight. Now, the only difference is, you can't *lie* about it. I think that's what bugs a lot of people, the fact that they know the person asking can look them up and see to a reasonable degree if they're telling the truth. And just because you know a fight as, say, DPS, doesn't mean you know it as a tank or a healer.
erikh Aug 13th 2009 4:17PM
Doing achievements beats hanging out in Dalaran watching Trade chat scroll by.
Plus it gives a sense of accomplishment, especially doing the Heroic/Raid ones and any that require some commitment from the user to get. Loremaster in particular comes to mind.
t0xic Aug 13th 2009 4:24PM
"Achievements are a double-edged sword. They are good for all the reasons you listed, but bad because they can tempt us all to turn the game from fun into simply checking off boxes on our shopping list of things to do."
I don't INTENTIONALLY set out to complete achievements. The only thing that aggravates me is when someone else tries to hijack a heroic 5-man and turn it into their own achievement "shopping trip". I've seen people ask nicely if we wanted to do xxx achievement and I've seen people be downright pushy about it.
The "tard alarm" (Anaughtybear) comment up above made me laugh =)
catharsis80 Aug 13th 2009 4:53PM
I really do understand what you all are saying. I guess fishing for something deeper would probably be best suited for an article written about why we do things in WoW.
mickk27 Aug 13th 2009 3:25PM
agree with ya
Ken Aug 13th 2009 3:34PM
I always looked at achievements as WoW's answer to Deeds from LOTRO, and never a preemptive strike against Warhammer Online. Infact, I still think LOTRO's Deeds has the Achievement system beat hands down. Using it as a system for character development as well was a brilliant idea, and one I'd love to see WoW integrate in the future.
micgillam Aug 13th 2009 3:35PM
You were never first. You never had a comment.
Sorcefire Aug 13th 2009 3:36PM
Achievements for instances should never have been implemented IMO. It's become very common place, on my server at least, that people look to see what achievements you have before inviting you to a raid. It seems that no one wants to bring someone new to content which is very sad indeed.
The inverse is true as well...people use the event of gaining an achievement as a means to criticize your performance. Just last week I ran HoL for the daily on my toon that had not yet got the achievement (the other 80 has long had it) and before I could say "woot", the PL was criticizing my DPS because he saw me get the achievement and thought "noob". Didn't stop to ask what spec I was playing or whether their zerging made my DOT-dependent class less effective. All because of an achievement.
catharsis80 Aug 13th 2009 3:39PM
It IS very sad. Everyone wants to be elitist and perfect in every way possible in the game. Could someone show me someone who has actually done that? And once you get there, what then?
catharsis80 Aug 13th 2009 3:40PM
Sorry, not "everyone". That was frustration and annoyance speaking.