WoW Rookie: Sharding etiquette
New around here? WoW Rookie points WoW's newest players to the basics of a good start in the World of Warcraft. Send us a note to suggest a WoW Rookie topic, and be sure to visit the WoW Rookie Guide for links to all our tips, tricks and how-to's.UPDATE: Most groups use the automatic Disenchant option available in the loot roll box as of Patch 3.3.
This week, we're going to help you understand a practice that varies wildly from group to group, server to server and even expansion to expansion. "In the past few months, I've run into a situation with people who are (or who I think are) new players who happen to be 80," reader Sarabande writes to WoW Rookie. "To them, the idea of DEing BoP items for shards is completely alien (and to at least one, he just rolled greed on everything 'just to see if he could get it')."
Should your group roll for unwanted or unneeded drops when an enchanter is on hand to disenchant them? What's accepted in one situation might be scorned in another. Because there's no single way to handle the situation, it's important for new players to be aware of the options. It's also important to understand the reasons why players feel so strongly one way or another about this issue. Because there's no single "correct" method, the savvy player respects the group consensus.
Disenchanting is the process of breaking down (yes, we mean "destroying") armor or weapons of uncommon (green), rare (blue) or epic (purple) quality into magical elements (crystals, shards, essences and dusts), which can then be used to enchant other gear. Also known as DEing and sharding, disenchanting is the primary means of "gathering" or "creating" materials for enchanting (an important point that explains why enchanters sometimes get touchy about their "rights" to loot drops for sharding.)
When a drop is not an upgrade ("need") for any given player, it's considered a "greed" roll. If there's an enchanter in the group, he or she may volunteer to DE the unneeded loot. The value of the enchanting component often outstrips the value of the original drop, either to a vendor or through the Auction House. This is especially true for unused BoP items, which always end up getting sold to a vendor.
At this point, we'd like to direct your attention to a recent Insider Trader column, Who keeps the shards?. Go on, click on over and read it, then come back. We'll wait right here.
Got a little better handle on the matter? Hang on, class, we have one more assigned reading for today: Are disenchanters getting robbed by rolls?
"Up until recently, all I had to do was say 'Do you want me to DE?' and it was understood and accepted that we would roll for shards at the end -- at least for those who did not get a BoP upgrade," writes Sarabande. "But lately, just asking that is not sufficient."
The WoW Rookie solution: Speak up and lock down a looting procedure before your group gets under way. "How are we handling shards, guys? Can anyone here DE?" keeps it above-board, friendly and clear.
Points to consider:
- Is everyone in the group willing to let the enchanter keep any loot that's not Needed?
- If you have an enchanter willing to shard drops for randoming, will you roll and distribute shards at the end of the run or after every drop?
- Will you be sharding all un-Needed drops or only BoPs?
- What if someone leaves early?
- Is there an enchanter in the group who still need mats for leveling or buying high-end Enchanting recipes (some require shards for purchase)?
- If your group decides to shard and distribute, press Pass (the "X" at the top right-hand corner of the loot roll box) on any drops you're not rolling Need for.
- Don't be a jerk about "outing" enchanters who prefer to take their chances with a Greed roll and DE their own wins afterwards. They've undoubtedly lived through their share of DEing controversies. Put the Armory down, boy, and give them their peace.
- If your group has decided to distribute shards at the end of a run, don't forget to stick around!
Filed under: Enchanting, Items, Tips, WoW Social Conventions, Features, WoW Rookie, Making money
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Reader Comments (Page 3 of 4)
Fierna Aug 19th 2009 1:46PM
If it's a guild run by all means, load up your enchanter with shards. But do PUGs care about leveling my enchanting profession?
Bullseyed Aug 19th 2009 3:37PM
When those pugs are miners or skinners, do they roll on the leather and ore they receive?
You lose.
micgillam Aug 19th 2009 4:25PM
Yes. When there's someone else that can use the mat, we roll. Two or more people can use the vein? We roll, at least on the first one, then usually alternate from there. It's called *sharing*.
Two people can use the skinnable corpses? We try to divide them roughly evenly (unless one skinner is still skilling off them).
Two or more people can harvest the herbs? Some swapping goes on.
5/10/25 people can use (but don't need) that BoP? Oh, but the on enchanter feels he should be privileged to get all the un*need*ed loot. Tell you what, if he wants to pay everyone for their time, repairs, and consumables, I'll consider it. Otherwise, no way.
Bullseyed Aug 19th 2009 4:57PM
I heard that NPCs drop money and gray items to make up for any wear and tear on items. I also heard that if you wipe it is because you're bad.
You mentioned miners trading off on nodes or skinners trading off on skins.
Enchanters trade off on shards. If you aren't and enchanter, then they aren't yours.
micgillam Aug 20th 2009 1:29PM
Gray crap and 40s drops don't add up to much today. If you never wipe, it's because you're a pansy sticking with easymode content.
And the difference is, mineral nodes and shared among the people that can use them. Skinnable corpses are shared among the people that can use them. BoP drops (that aren't an upgrade for everyone) are the equivalent for enchanters to veins and skinnables. Not shards. And unfortunately for gouge-happy enchanters, everyone can use them so they're shared among everyone. Want people to be more willing to help? Don't try to gouge them for 200g when they're already providing all the mats.
Tharina Aug 19th 2009 1:32PM
I always offer to give out the de'd stuff after a run, unless someone was being rude or something, then they don't get anything, gotta love having the power.
Off topic: heh, my old wowinsider.com bookmark finally stopped linking to this site
Skojar Aug 19th 2009 1:36PM
This is much less of an issue now that even BoP items can be traded within the group.
I would say:
Need if you will acually use it,
Greed otherwise.
If you want the shard, and there's a Enchanter in your group, ask them to DE your wins for you during down time or after the run.
Much more convenient.
Ger Aug 19th 2009 3:35PM
I disagree with that method because then you could conceivably have 1 person get every single item. I much prefer the enchanter handing out shards afterwards because then it is more likely for everyone to benefit. Further, if I'm the disenchanter then people who got an upgrade on the run (rolled need) are not eligible for shards.
Schadow Aug 20th 2009 1:09AM
@Skojar: I completely agree, and will be taking this method from here on out. I will run the instance, greed on everything I don't need, and DE my own stuff. If someone wants something DE'd, they can trade it to me and I will DE it for them for a tip.
@Ger: You can still do it that way - anyone who already won something needs to pass on future items. Pretty simple. While you're at it, do that with greens, too. I could use a share of them.
hp1 Aug 19th 2009 1:41PM
Absolutely agree with the above people that 3.2 has changed everything.
The new default is for the enchanter to enter a pug and offer to DE at the end. DE'ing via trade at the end is bit inefficient, but so much less stress on me as an enchnater. About half the time the group will recognize the inefficiency (and inequity) of this approach and suggest the "greed BOPs and hand out shards at end" approach.
I can't tell you how often I suffered through arguments about "but I need the gear to vendor for repair costs" despite the fact that shards almost always sell for more.
The sad part is that the new system is less fair than the old one. When the enchanter had all the not-needed BOPs there was more even distribution (top roller got the epic shard, others got a blue). But I'm happy with less fair in exchange for less discussion quite honestly.
SpaceGoatPriest Aug 19th 2009 1:52PM
I announce ahead of time I am needing (no problem with the trade system now in place), because I want the Needy achievement, and I will DE all at the end. If someone needed something I just give it to them. Almost every dungeon I end up with 4 shards and an Abyss. Highest roll gets Abyss, and I give one shard to everyone else.
Here lately though, people don't seem to care. They either literally after the boss is down, or just say keep. I do generally run with 2-3 friends and only 1-2 pugs when I instance though. I generally put everything in the Guild Bank, even though we (as a guild) stopped raiding, and such really don't give out enchants like we used to.
SpaceGoatPriest Aug 19th 2009 1:55PM
They leave right after boss*
Either way with the ease of getting epic gear, at least from what I have seen, has kinda curbed loot drama, in 5 mans at least.
Darush Aug 19th 2009 1:54PM
This seems to be the consensus on my pugs. Either an enchanter volunteers to de everyone's BoPs, or I find out one of us is an enchanter on Armory and out him ;-)
Kole Aug 19th 2009 2:04PM
Why out them? They aren't obligated in any way to DE or do anything for you other than play their roll in the group for the run you're on.
Darush Aug 19th 2009 2:08PM
Oh, of course I know that. I was joking on the "outing" part. I usually /whisper them when we finish the instance and politely ask whether they agree to de for me. Almost always they agree, sometimes they're in a hurry and we depart as friends.
jmsalsa Aug 19th 2009 2:39PM
i get both sides of the argument. the issue really comes into focus with everyone running heroics again but not needing any of the drops. i've ran several PUGs and it's way easier to just have everyone greed everything (not to mention the fact that you can get achievements for rolling 100). i don't think it's an issue of people not knowing what to do....i think it's more an issue of most people don't want to spend all that time deciding who gets what loot and is it fair....etc.
Cyno01 Aug 19th 2009 2:02PM
Been farming reg ToC with guildies a LOT lately, the trading BoP thing has been great. Our usual system works like...
Everybody rolls need, hoping to get 100 for the Needy achievement.
Then if anybody actually wants an item for offset or ocasionally mainset, they get it, /roll if needed, then everythings given to the DEer, anybody who didnt get loot gets an abyss crystal at the end.
Similar when farming heroics for emblems, except at the end everybody rolls, highest gets the crystal and everybody else gets shards.
lumacman Aug 19th 2009 2:05PM
In my guild the loot rules are very simple and clear.
if the item is BOP, all enchanters roll greed.
if you need it, need it, otherwise pass.
if the item is BOE, EVERYONE ROLL GREED!
Need or NOT EVERYONE ROLL GREED!
if you need the item and did not win it talk to the winner and arrange payment/services/compensation.
you may only roll for an item if it is for the roll that are filling in a raid.
if no one rolls need for the spec they are in that raid, only then can you roll for your other spec.
no DKP, no loot council, no seniority, no nothing.
My guild started off by a bunch of folks that wanted nothing to do with the 40man raids of the past. as raiding became more accessable we tested the waters, and found that the people were what kept us comming back, and seeing some amazing stories and art in the raids that we enjoyed. the Loot was a bonus. but we knew we needed a way to manage the issues and we discarded the traditional systems.
the above fits with our philosphy very well. we have a guild leader that is from the high council rank. the council was made of the first 5 founders. one of the founders has left, and another cannot play as much as she wants with her health and life situations. that leaves the 3 of us to guide and handle the guild as we can. no one of us is superior to the other and all the members of the guild have the same rights unless special tasks are assigned and those are few. (raid schedualing, bank management).
when we raid this extends to the loot too. I am one of my guilds main tanks and i almost always lead the raid. we rotate in and out the OT as we can and with the dual spec system i even get to fury it up every now and then. every time tank loot drops and im tanking and my pally or Dk is with me they are expected to roll even though I have been there longer and more often then they have been. the number of times i have killed a boss does not matter. this boss is dead. they helped. they have the same rights as i do the loot.
same goes for the enchanters. we all fought the boss/mob and the loot is there for anyone. unwanted/unneeded loot has at best cash value. the enchanter is only making the value greater. just because they can disenchant does not mean that they have any more claim to the shards then I have claim on all plate tank loot. skinners, miners, herbers they all cycle their turn at the nodes if the want them. sometimes they even decided to roll on a node.
Ozzy Aug 19th 2009 2:11PM
The best option is to have the enchanter DE every drop that isn't an upgrade for a member. At the end, the group rolls and shards are distributed to the highest rollers. For example, I'm an enchanter and I have three dream shards and an abyss crystal from the run. The highest roller gets the abyss crystal and the next three highest rollers each get a dream shard.
Who in their right mind would rather have a blue BoP item that vendors for 7g over a dream shard that auctions for twice that?
On a side note, I run most heroics with guildmates and shards go into the guildbank and so who gets what isn't an issue. We typically have a surplus of abyss crystals and dream shards at all times this way.
Bullseyed Aug 19th 2009 3:33PM
Who in their right mind indeed.
You forget, this is the year of the retard. Even baddies get to kill bosses.