A critical examination of Garrosh Hellscream

Yes, I'm talking about Garrosh Hellscream. Everyone's favorite "Oh I hate that guy" guy. And to be frank from the first time my Tauren Warrior stepped off of his kodo in front of the fire in Garadar I've kind of disliked him. He was whiny, dismissive, and petulant, (yes, I said it twice, you're lucky I didn't just type it 3000 times) and frankly even after I went through one of the longest (in terms of what it had me do, anyway) quest chains in BC to finally, finally get Thrall to come out and slap some sense into the kid (which he did with a kicking lightshow - remember Laser Floyd? Yeah, even Laser Floyd didn't have demon lords) I didn't like the new, reinvigorated Garrosh any more than I liked him before. Granted, I didn't expect to ever see him again.
Then there I was in Orgrimmar and suddenly there's Garrosh, giving Thrall lip. So much lip, in fact, that they actually got into a fight. That wasn't all, though. Garrosh won. Seriously, the wiki downplays it, but I was watching, and if the Lich King didn't choose that moment to attack Org then Garrosh was going to slap Thrall down. I was, to put it mildly, stunned. Garrosh? That incredible prat that I couldn't get to take action in Nagrand when I showed him definite proof of the ogre threat? Beating Thrall? How was it possible that the guy who spent four of my levels weeping into a campfire beat one of the best gladiators on the face of Azeroth? Things only got weirder when I got to Borean Tundra.
When I arrived at Warsong Hold, there was Garrosh standing next to Saurfang and actually being a jerk to him. Now, to be honest up until that point Saurfang was more famous for his infamous facts and some insanely nasty cleaves to Alliance stupid enough to pull him (or Horde who were unfortunate enough to run into him when Allies could MC him) but even before I'd gone through the quests that established Saurfang as not just a badass but also a thinking orc I'd always liked the guy. It's impossible not to like a guy who can non-ironically call himself "That which does quell the recalcitrant" really. Well, okay, maybe it's just me. And yet here's Garrosh, talking smack to possibly the greatest living warrior the orcish race has produced. I was pleasantly surprised that Garrosh remembered what I'd done for him, though: characters who hadn't played through the events of Hero of the Mag'har got a considerably less pleasant greeting from the head of the Warsong Offensive.
Since then I've leveled both Horde and Alliance to 80 and really had time to stop and think about Garrosh and his attitude. And frankly, I think the key is this: Garrosh has spent his entire life being afraid. I'm not talking cowardice, or a fear of combat. No, Garrosh has been afraid of himself. When I first arrived at Garadar, I literally fought Garrosh's own opinion of himself the entire way up and down the zone. Look at the sheer amount of work it took to finally get him to stop being terrified of his legacy. Then Thrall comes out and says "No, no, you've got it all wrong. Your dad saved us. It's okay, it's good even to be a Hellscream."
In one moment Garrosh has a lifetime burden lifted from his shoulders, is told that he should embrace being a Hellscream, and given a chance to join an organization that idolizes Grommash. It becomes apparent by his own words that Garrosh's view of the Horde is an idealized one.

To Garrosh, fear (the very fear that once held him back) is the real enemy. The Horde can fear nothing, because it is what freed him from his fear in the first place. Garrosh embraces the Horde because it was the Horde that helped rid him of his terror of becoming like his father. Now, he seeks absolutely nothing more than to be exactly like his father , to the point where even Saurfang comments on how like Grom he is. What Saurfang sees as a cautionary warning - "You're too reckless and impatient, too eager to risk war without even considering the costs" comes to Garrosh's ears as the highest possible praise. After all, his father is savior of the orcs! His father is a great hero! No longer does Garrosh have to stand by a fire, torn by doubts that his will be the hand that dooms the orcs as his father... no, everything his father did turned out to be the right thing to do. It's good to be a Hellscream and act as a Hellscream acts.
Thrall and Drek'Thar have no one to blame for this but themselves, because when they got to Nagrand and found Garrosh paralyzed by indecision their choice was to remove that indecision by making Grom an idealized hero and completely glossing over Garrosh's very real concerns. The fact is, Garrosh is a young orc with a young orc's tendency to go to extremes, and they completely failed to convey any of the complexities of Grom's life to the young orc. His regret, his understanding that he had been duped, his constant battle with the blood haze, his failures and mistakes, the context that made his last heroic stand against Mannoroth a heroic objective correlative. In slaying Mannoroth, the demon lord, Grommash actually slew his own demons as well, but without the context of his own struggles and the suffering his recklessness caused him, the story loses its cautionary bite and Grom is elevated to a cartoonish idol. And that's exactly who Garrosh is trying to be, the cartoon of Grom that Thrall inadvertently created for him at Garadar.
So now Garrosh is pefectly poised to repeat his father's mistakes, because they've been changed into virtues in his eyes. He must find Thrall paradoxical and frustrating, as the older orc has gone from the one who brought him this new understanding and a new world to belong in to a constant irritant trying to get him to stop behaving like a Hellscream. No wonder the two are at constant loggerheads: Thrall wants Garrosh to be his father, and so does Garrosh, but Thrall wants Grom as he remembers him and Garrosh has no idea who that orc is. This all stems from Thrall's tendency to make demigods of the leaders of the old Horde that he met at the end of their lives, like Doomhammer. The Grom Thrall knew was not the one Garrosh would have known. How could he have been?
It makes me wonder what would have happened if Thrall had sent Saurfang as his emissary. At any rate, however, considering what he's been exposed to Garrosh has managed to become exactly what he believes is expected of him in a very short time. He's gone from a sullen adolescent (I have no idea how old Garrosh actually is, mind you) to a warrior capable of giving Thrall a fight and staring Saurfang in the face without a trace of fear. I'd like very much to see a Saurfang/Garrosh duel... if Garrosh won, it would fuel his already aggressive stance even further. And frankly, it might be a good thing for the Horde overall.
The Horde is, and has always been, at a pivot. Thrall's decision to make heroes of members of the old Horde has in effect meant that his government could never disavow their actions, and as a result, can never find peace with the Alliance who remembers them as blood crazed berserkers who poured into Azeroth through the Dark Portal and made common cause with cannibals and lunatics who explode everything in sight. Now, if the rumors are true, rather than a mystic, the Horde will finally have a leader who will fully embrace the warrior ethos of the old Horde and in so doing, bring it home for everyone involved. Frankly, any movement on this part is forward movement, rather than Thrall's hesitant, half-hearted attempts at detente. Perhaps the war needs to burst into full fire once and for all, and if so, Garrosh could be the best possible leader for the Horde, one who truly believes in his people and their righteousness without ambiguity or doubt.
Ironic that it took Thrall, son of Durotan, to give Garrosh, son of Grommash freedom from his doubt and uncertainty, thus making him what he is today.
I feel bad for Garrosh, because I'm pretty sure Cataclysm will be his high point. From there, he'll have to learn, the way his father did, that bloodlust has costs. It seems a shame that the sins of the father are to be visited upon the son who was the most afraid of them.
Edited to Add: Wow, lot of interesting comments already. And while I don't think I possibly can answer all or even most of them, that doesn't mean I don't see your points, especially the ones about how Garrosh seems ungrateful or unrealistic and about how the Thrall/Garrosh fight can be seen differently than how I saw it. There may be enough in what you're all saying for another look into Garrosh in the future.
Thrall and Drek'Thar have no one to blame for this but themselves, because when they got to Nagrand and found Garrosh paralyzed by indecision their choice was to remove that indecision by making Grom an idealized hero and completely glossing over Garrosh's very real concerns. The fact is, Garrosh is a young orc with a young orc's tendency to go to extremes, and they completely failed to convey any of the complexities of Grom's life to the young orc. His regret, his understanding that he had been duped, his constant battle with the blood haze, his failures and mistakes, the context that made his last heroic stand against Mannoroth a heroic objective correlative. In slaying Mannoroth, the demon lord, Grommash actually slew his own demons as well, but without the context of his own struggles and the suffering his recklessness caused him, the story loses its cautionary bite and Grom is elevated to a cartoonish idol. And that's exactly who Garrosh is trying to be, the cartoon of Grom that Thrall inadvertently created for him at Garadar.
So now Garrosh is pefectly poised to repeat his father's mistakes, because they've been changed into virtues in his eyes. He must find Thrall paradoxical and frustrating, as the older orc has gone from the one who brought him this new understanding and a new world to belong in to a constant irritant trying to get him to stop behaving like a Hellscream. No wonder the two are at constant loggerheads: Thrall wants Garrosh to be his father, and so does Garrosh, but Thrall wants Grom as he remembers him and Garrosh has no idea who that orc is. This all stems from Thrall's tendency to make demigods of the leaders of the old Horde that he met at the end of their lives, like Doomhammer. The Grom Thrall knew was not the one Garrosh would have known. How could he have been?
It makes me wonder what would have happened if Thrall had sent Saurfang as his emissary. At any rate, however, considering what he's been exposed to Garrosh has managed to become exactly what he believes is expected of him in a very short time. He's gone from a sullen adolescent (I have no idea how old Garrosh actually is, mind you) to a warrior capable of giving Thrall a fight and staring Saurfang in the face without a trace of fear. I'd like very much to see a Saurfang/Garrosh duel... if Garrosh won, it would fuel his already aggressive stance even further. And frankly, it might be a good thing for the Horde overall.
The Horde is, and has always been, at a pivot. Thrall's decision to make heroes of members of the old Horde has in effect meant that his government could never disavow their actions, and as a result, can never find peace with the Alliance who remembers them as blood crazed berserkers who poured into Azeroth through the Dark Portal and made common cause with cannibals and lunatics who explode everything in sight. Now, if the rumors are true, rather than a mystic, the Horde will finally have a leader who will fully embrace the warrior ethos of the old Horde and in so doing, bring it home for everyone involved. Frankly, any movement on this part is forward movement, rather than Thrall's hesitant, half-hearted attempts at detente. Perhaps the war needs to burst into full fire once and for all, and if so, Garrosh could be the best possible leader for the Horde, one who truly believes in his people and their righteousness without ambiguity or doubt.
Ironic that it took Thrall, son of Durotan, to give Garrosh, son of Grommash freedom from his doubt and uncertainty, thus making him what he is today.
I feel bad for Garrosh, because I'm pretty sure Cataclysm will be his high point. From there, he'll have to learn, the way his father did, that bloodlust has costs. It seems a shame that the sins of the father are to be visited upon the son who was the most afraid of them.
Edited to Add: Wow, lot of interesting comments already. And while I don't think I possibly can answer all or even most of them, that doesn't mean I don't see your points, especially the ones about how Garrosh seems ungrateful or unrealistic and about how the Thrall/Garrosh fight can be seen differently than how I saw it. There may be enough in what you're all saying for another look into Garrosh in the future.
World of Warcraft: Cataclysm will destroy Azeroth as we know it. Nothing will be the same. In WoW.com's Guide to Cataclysm you can find out everything you need to know about WoW's third expansion. From Goblins and Worgens to Mastery and Guild changes, it's all there for your cataclysmic enjoyment.Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Odds and ends, Lore
Patch 5.3 interview with Ghostcrawler
Mystery of the Unborn Val'kyr
The latest patch 5.3 news
All of the latest Mists of Pandaria news





Reader Comments (Page 13 of 13)
Seraphna Sep 22nd 2009 8:55AM
@Thrashnak
What's odd to me is how no one seems to remember that the Horde at least used to also operate it's leadership on a Trial by Combat basis.
Johnathan_Miceli Sep 22nd 2009 1:51PM
I play Alliance though I've been playing up a horde to see the "other side" so to speak and here are my thoughts.
You need to realize one thing people think that the Alliance blindly follows Varian and he is "just as bad as Garrosh" but let's look at the facts all together.
- Regardless of how it stands the main race of the Horde are invaders. Going by the timeline look, outlands is free of the Burning Leigon, why are the orcs still here? They are not natives to Azeroth and they can freely go back and forth through the portal. Why is there even still an orcish presence in Azeroth? Remember the Horde regardless of how there were twisted are still the antagonists of the fight. Pack up, move Ogrimmar to Outlands, make the Dark Portal a de-militerized zone and there. How would you feel if a group of people invaded your world and set up shop? No matter how "noble" they may be there are still an invading force setting up shop on Azeroth.
- People say that the Alliance blindly follow the humans and have no further grudge against the Horde as a whole however let's look at the current battleground scenario and also past wrongs that the Horde have perpetrated against the Alliance.
Warsong Gulch and to a greater extent Ashenvale forest:
The horde are clearcutting the Ancesteral Night Elf Lands in fact the majority of wood in Ogrimmar is from that area. The Horde also killed one of the guardians of Cenarius, true they were under the "blood lust" of Mannoroth but if the Horde don't want conflict why are they pushing forward into obviously Night Elf Lands?
Alterac Valley:
The Ancesteral Home of the Frostwolf clan, but wait didn't we just say that the Horde aren't from Azeroth so therefore cannot have any ancesteral territory here? This is Alliance land that was invaded and settled by orcs. The orcs hold no claim over Alterac Valley, being it is a portion of the Alterac Kingdom, a human Kingdom, the Alliance hold more claim to it.
Arathi Basin:
Kingdom of Arathi, why are the forsaken (The people and Elves of Lorderon) even taking it? Again it is another push from the Horde to get natural resources.
Isle of Conquest and Strand of the Ancients:
Two actual places of conflict in which no side holds any real territorial claims for natural resources. Let's call this one a draw.
So, let's recap what the Horde has done to the Alliance since WC O&H (Warcraft Orcs & Humans)
WC1 - Orcs Destroy the Kingdom of Stormwind, The new Horde is not to blame so much for this.
WC2 - Tides of Darkness, after pushing far into he Dwarven Kingdoms the Horde turn their sites to where the humans have fled. So right now most humans in WC view the horde as a people who not only destroyed their lands they then pushed forward to eradicate them when they fled to allies in the North. Again we cannot entirely blame the Horde for this as they were not of their own minds. Most of the Orcs are pushed back the Dark Portal is closed, the remainder who are left are not slaughtered but put into internment camps (not the Alliance's finest moment but what else do they do? Put them to the sword?)
WC3 - The Old Horde overcome their demons, form the horde with Trolls and Taurens and resettle in Kalimdor where they do some damage to the Night Elves but eventually we all make nice with certain representatives of each major race. A Truce is had.
WoW - The Orcs make Aggressive moves into NE Territory to build their own city, they accept the forsaken who clearly say they are working towards a way to kill not just the scourge but EVERYONE (Orcs, Humans, Trolls included) The Forsaken start pushing down from Lorderon to the south while there are still some pockets of orcs who actively fight the Alliance and Horde (wetlands)
BC - Alliance and horde come together to fight a bigger threat. The Blood Elves who were betrayed not by stormwind but the last vestiges of Lorderon's humans a.k.a THE FORSAKEN now (LOL WHUT they're friends now?) Kidnap a being of light that is here to help all the races to satisfy a magic additction. Conflict still goes on but more along the lines of lighting a paper bag filled with kodo poop outside each other's bases on fire. Nothing big minor skirmishes. We're fighting a bigger enemy here.
WotLK - Orcs and Humans have come to some sort of agreement after fighting off a bigger threat and move forward more or less as seperate but equal partners to fight another great evil. We're not best friends but we know what needs to be done. A "rogue" faction of the forsaken (weren't they making that plague to kill everyone since original WoW?) Attack and kill both Horde and Alliance at the Wrathgate.
Afterwards while the Alliance is fighting Scourge in Icecrown after the fact a contigent of Horde Attack the Alliance from the rear and kill them and scourge without any thought.
I mean really, and Varian Wynn is the racist ass? Let's even pretend he didn't have his own personal issues against the Horde but this is acceptable? If the Horde wanted Peace they should have returned to Draernor after BC. What like Cairn wouldn't have come to peace with the NE's? Trolls wouldn't find a Way to work with the Alliance? The Forsaken are evil, hell in WotLK you're the person who delivers the very weapon used at the Wrathgate!
I mean come on, I don't view the lliance in the wrong here you're entitled to disagree with me but ask me this aren't orcs still invaders on conquered soil? Why not head back to Draenor. Even looking towards Cataclysm you see the Orcs mind you press the attack further against the Night Elves. The Forsaken attack Gilneas. The worst I've seen the Alliance do is attack Goblins on an Island... oh noes the tadpols.
So, the Alliance do not have any right,Thrall is a chump who turns his head while his people continue to be aggressive. Yes the Alliance made the majority of the Villans in the game however we also push to fight against them.. Even with Varian saying F you to Rhonin in the Ulduar trailer the person who still directs us there is an Alliance character looking to save everyone.
So Food for thought hopefully some will agree but hey if orcs want peace, move back to Draenor, you know where you tried to ethnically cleanse Draenei and well the Draenaei can move all to Azeroth since they're a part of the Alliance, so the entire crappy broken world can be yours.
Peace Achieved.
Ullaana Sep 22nd 2009 6:07PM
A question comes to mind about Garrosh and Varian. If these two are what the game needs to put the War back in Warcraft, how do we know that the War won't be civil war?
jasonkidd1234 Sep 22nd 2009 6:10PM
I find it hard to think that the alliance would help the Orcs, Trolls, and Tauren, assuming Sylvanas DID side with the Forsaken.
While the Trolls, Tauren, and remaining orcs would undoubtably go against the Forsaken, I don't see Varian teaming up with the Horde, at all.
Not to mention, the plauge the Forsaken made was obviously very strong. Strong enough to scare the Lich King into hiding, which is something nobody else has been able to do (Aside from the Argent Crusade), and I'm sure if Sylvanas really thought the Horde were going to turn on her (assuming she was thinking ahead and hoping to betray them later) they would have done it long before Wrathgate, probably attacking who the next biggest threat to them are, which would likely be the alliance or remaining horde. I don't see the Sin'adori allying with the Forsaken anyways. If it was any other reason, I'd say yes, but The Blood elves allying with the Forsaken so that the Forsaken can kill EVERYTHING?
I don't see it.
Fact of the matter is, Sylvanas didn't play an integral role over the Apothecary society, in my mind. As far as we know, she was blind to the plauge, or at least their intention to use it to cause mass destruction to all living things. Even if she knew such a plauge existed, I highly doubt she'd use it to combat anything other than the Lich King.
She's a former blood elf. She has strong ties to them, and the Horde have helped her immensely. I don't see her betraying loyal orcs knowingly, and I don't see the combined Mind of the other Horde races falling for an 'act' by her.
Varimithias obviously was bitter. It's natural that he'd take any opportunity that he had to betray her, since as a Dreadlord he shares with Mal'Ganis the mind of the Dreadlords, which cares little about anything but themselves in the long run.
It's obvious from in game text even at lower levels, before TBC that Varimithias is far from somebody ecstatic to join the horde.
I'm sorry, but I just don't see her secretly betraying the horde, but realizing suddenly that she might die, and switching BACK to the horde.
Dreyja Sep 22nd 2009 6:50PM
She was not blind to the development of the plague and planned to use it on at least humans. This is Cannon.
She lives to take out Arthas, and then the living after that. That is ALL. Wow, that's amazing leadership. She may even have her people under her own will, just like Arthas.
All of this was in the Arthas Novel and not only did she commission the plague, she helped test it with the intent of use in combat against humans as much as the scourge.
Blayze Sep 22nd 2009 7:25PM
-Varian and Garrosh-
I like them. I'd certainly want to deck them if I ever met them in person, but as plot devices hamfisted into the game in order to promote outright war between the Alliance and the Horde, I'd say they do their one-dimensional job pretty effectively.
-Sylvanas-
Here's where it all falls apart. The Sylvanas of Warcraft III was a badass. She didn't take crap, knew full well what the Nathrezim were like, and yet employed one as her subordinate. God only knows which designer thought that someone described as "cunning and intelligent" giving power to a member of a species known mostly for betrayal and causing discord was a good idea.
Whoever they were, we have them to thank for the fact that either Sylvanas is nothing like how I remember her from Warcraft III -- turning from "Shut it, Dreadlord" into "I was betrayed, Thrall! It wasn't me!"
She's the Dark Lady, for Christ's sake. There's no way she would be left in the dark about the New Plague -- designed to affect living and undead alike -- so either she's "playing the field" here, trying to perform damage control on the relationship between the Horde and the Forsaken and attempting to manipulate her way back into Thrall's good books, or she's been turned from a badass into an idiot by poor writing.
That's the only way I can see her as anything other than a complete write-off as a character. Think about it -- this way she gets her city cleansed of a load of traitors, plays on the Warchief's desire for cooperation and mutual support, distances herself politically from the RAS and the New Plague... and still gets to have her minions work on it, because certainly at least some trace of it exists still.
Then again, I'm not surprised at how many characters have been messed around by the writing. Tyrande and Vol'jin each had a quest where they did something. Cairne and Mekkatorque have had it even worse. Magni's been crying into his beer about Moira for four years, then finally comes back to fly in for the end of a quest and then straight back out again. Staghelm just mutters angrily to himself and snaps at Alliance players going to desperate measures for their Cenarion Circle reputation.
Dreyja Sep 22nd 2009 7:47PM
Exactly, either you accept that she is a scheming b. that wants to wipe out life or you're making her sound stupid. She knew who she had in her basement, she COMMISSIONED the plague. You can respect her for her scheming, if that's what you respect but she is not doing it for noble reasons.
There is a myriad of reasons why the rest of the horde should be watching their backs around her.
therealbowser Sep 23rd 2009 5:24PM
Keep in mind that Thrall is actually probably younger than Garrosh. Garrosh was born before Grom left the Dark Portal, which was most likely before Thrall had a chance to exist.
therealbowser Sep 23rd 2009 5:25PM
Keep in mind that Thrall is actually probably younger than Garrosh. Garrosh was born before Grom left the Dark Portal, which was most likely before Thrall had a chance to exist.
therealbowser Sep 23rd 2009 5:25PM
Sorry for the double comment.
watspr02 Oct 15th 2009 12:41PM
I still vote to stand aside as the Alliance kill him daily. I currently try to protect the faction leaders now but if he becomes the faction leader, i will sit in the throne room and cheer the Alliance on.
lishuss Dec 5th 2009 7:50PM
you see, the way i see it(being an Alliance boy, born and bred) is that Garrosh more than likely got corrupted and is being used as yet another orc who will get hos brethren to fall under the sway of the Legion once again.
it would make plenty sense, but its just a casual observance since, like i said, i don't really roll horde and the only time i did the character got to lv 30, so i'm a little lost on it's lore