Drama Mamas: Dealing page 2
by Robin Torres 
Sep 25th 2009 at 7:00PM
Dear Drama Mamas: On my last trip to the Trial of the Champion, I (a Paladin tank/healer) picked up a random warrior DD. At some point before the first pull, the Rogue asked who the tank was. The healer answered that I was the tank. At this point I looked at my fellow party-mates and noticed that the Warrior was wearing a shield. I asked him if he could change his spec, and he didn't reply. We waited a moment, and since he still didn't reply, I pulled the first boss. He started to use taunts on the boss (who was marked to be killed last), instead of keeping with the marked target. It took a while to get the three champions down, but I've had worse.
Before the next pull, the healer asked who the tank was, thinking it was just a misunderstanding. She offered to respec to shadow, so that I could heal and so that the Warrior could tank. The Warrior insisted, however, that there was no misunderstanding -- he was a shield-wearing, protection-skilled damage dealer.
Without further ado, we continued the instance and finished it successfully. The protection DD, unsurprisingly, did significantly less damage than I did. How can I solve a situation like this, without making a fool of myself or of him? Thanks in advance, A Confused Paladin
Drama Mama Lisa: Honestly, unless the Warrior seemed open to conversation (which it doesn't sound as if he was), your best bet is to manage the situation in a way that allowed your group to succeed -- which you did, most admirably. We really don't know why this Warrior was choosing to DPS with this particular setup. Maybe he didn't know better -- but maybe he did. Maybe he was simply weary of tanking and he wasn't dual-specced. The point is, you did manage to salvage a workable group without "making a fool of myself or him." That's the win right there.
If you do find an opening for conversation, though, you could work in some of these good points from WoW.com's resident He-Man Tank Matthew Rossi:
"See, I disagree with you because of the line that the shield-wearing Warrior was TAUNTING," he explained when I asked him about your question (with a caps-lock warning thrown in for good measure). "You DO NOT TAUNT if you do not want to be the tank. NOT EVER. The only time you as a Warrior in a five-man hit the taunt button is if the tank is dead or there is a mob about to rip off the healer's face. If the tank is alive, all you do is bring that mob back to him and do as little damage as possible so that he can get it back. You do not taunt, ever, if you are there to DPS outside of these two situations. You certainly do not pick a mob that is to be killed last and taunt it and effectively tank it, forcing the healer to heal two tanks and lowering the overall DPS on the focus target."
"If you want to run heroics as a prot spec DPS, there are at least three issues to consider:- Most protection Warriors will have Improved Defensive Stance. This means that their damage output is significantly boosted while tanking in D stance. This also means that when not tanking, they will lose the benefit of this talent because it requires attacks to be focused on them. (This is probably why that prot Warrior taunted that mob, which he still shouldn't do.)
- If you're there to DPS with a prot spec, WEAR DPS GEAR.
- Don't DPS in defensive stance. It has a threat increase and a DPS decrease baked right in. You're the one who said you didn't want to tank; don't make the guy who IS tanking suffer for your choice.
Thanks, Concerned Pally, for being savvy and cool under pressure enough to roll with the punches and make this against-the-grain group a success -- and thanks, Matt, for lending insights that may head off an uncomfortable situation in the future.
Drama Mama Robin: Awesome advice as usual from Mr. Rossi. In my opinion, The Taunter needed to be kicked from the group. He had already made a fool of himself and, honestly, good DPS is readily available. Obviously, as Lisa said, you already did a great job by salvaging the situation with class and skill. In the future, save yourself some grief by just replacing The Taunter quickly and enjoying the rest of your PuG without stress.
Remember, your mama wouldn't want to see your name on any drama. Play nice ... and when in doubt, ask the Drama Mamas at DramaMamas (at) WoW (dot) com.
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)
velutina Sep 25th 2009 7:22PM
Confused Paladin didn't state what server he was from, but it could be that the DPS prot warrior was role playing. If that were the case, he should have cleared it with the group first, but there may have been a method to his madness.
jbodar Sep 26th 2009 3:43AM
RP is never an excuse for pulling aggro on purpose and doing crap DPS. Period. That's worse than roleplaying "the dick", because you're ACTUALLY being a dick OOG. Basically, you have decided that:
your fun > everyone else's fun
That's not good RP.
jbodar Sep 26th 2009 3:45AM
To clarify, when I say "you" I'm talking about the Prot Warrior, not flaming the above poster.
Gamer am I Sep 25th 2009 7:35PM
That second letter made me think of a "holy DPS" pally who ran a Naxx-10 raid with my guild. He ended up doing 120 DPS in the first boss, hardly contributing at all, so we kicked him. I say give people a change, but in the case of a gross misunderstanding of spec-role relationships, never more than one chance.
halophoenix Sep 25th 2009 7:44PM
Okay, this is going to be a little embarrassing for me, but it's a story that's worth telling:
That poor warrior? He's probably a nub. In the best possible sense - he sounds like players I've come across that are uniquely and truly just ignorant of some of the mechanics of the game. He may have discovered and read enough to know that when you're prot specc'd that the things he did were things you just DO - taunt, wear a shield, things like that. I've never played a raiding warrior and I wasn't there, so I can't say whether or not this was the case.
BUT. What I can do is tell you a story of my own nub-ness. So I've been playing WoW since beta, you would think that means I know a lot, right? I should know my class in and out? I don't think so. At this point, I'm sure I know a lot more than I used to, but there's always room to learn, even if you're absolutely sure that you know what you're doing is right.
Example: back in Vanilla WoW, I was playing my main, a hunter, and we were running through Scholomance. For me, it was the first time I'd been there, but I had been 60 for a long time. My guildmates and I were casual - not raiders, and we didn't run many instances really, but I thought I was hot stuff: thought I knew my class. ....and I also thought traps were a waste of time.
Yes. I was a hunter, without traps. Never trained them up. Didn't see a use for 'em. Didn't know what "CC" was.
So when someone asked me to put down a trap to get ready for a big pull, I didn't understand why it was needed. I said "that's dumb, why should I do that? Besides, I don't even have traps." The party chat fell silent. A long, awkward silence. Then it was broken by one of the two PUG-ers in our group: "A HUNTER? Without TRAPS? What the hell?!"
Looking back on it now, I still have absolutely no idea how I could possibly have played up 60 levels thinking all of those talents available while I leveled were worthless. I guess I thought trapping was for survival hunters or something, even though I could get them. I don't know - I can't explain the nub-ness of the time. I know better now, but I know better than to think I know everything about my class.
That warrior? Maybe he's just like I was. Thinking "this is how I'm supposed to play" and that "being the tank" is an option for him that has nothing to do with what he does while he plays. Like the Mamas' suggest, he might just need a little education - especially if he's a new player.
I think we'd all be surprised (and incredibly ashamed sometimes) at what we don't know!
Gamer am I Sep 25th 2009 7:52PM
I was once a tank without taunts. We don't talk about it.
Jenn Sep 25th 2009 8:46PM
Shaman without totems.. for 35 levels. I hated dropping them, so I didn't. Until my significant other threatened to beat me with a golf club if I didn't drop something while he was running me through SM. I look back now and weep for those 35 levels.
The Exiled Warlock Sep 25th 2009 9:31PM
My first toon ever was a dwarf hunter. From level 1 to 40, I never fired a single shot with my gun. I would send my boar in, then I would run in and smack it with an axe until dead. Took me forever to level. Couldn't figure out why people called Hunters an "easy" class. Until 41, when some kind soul in a SM run was nice enough to whisper and ask why don't I just stand back and shoot? It all just clicked right then, and I realized how the class was supposed to be played.
That's sounds like it's a duh moment, but had that whisper not happened, I could be smacking skellies in Icecrown with an axe while a boar munches on it. And it's not like I was just some kid who didn't know better. I was 22. I was in college. I had been a gamer since I was 7. So I can believe that someone could make it to 80 just simply not knowing that there's a flow to how each class and each spec is supposed to operate.
jbodar Sep 26th 2009 3:50AM
Man, it takes some stones to tell stories like these. In fact, Jenn, you can have "honorary stones".
Ziberious Sep 26th 2009 8:37AM
Exiled, your very lucky someone came up to you and nicely said that, cause if you went any further there would be one guy like 'GAH WTF??!' and immediately boot you, spam you with crap, and all that.
Very luckeh indeed XD
And damn, I woulda rerolled if I thought the class was THAT slow the entire game.
Domi Sep 26th 2009 10:18AM
For a time, I was a warlock without a pet.
...So, I was basically a mage.
Sri Sep 26th 2009 11:39AM
Exiled, I agree with Ziberious, you were very lucky that that guy was nice to you. Leveling my own hunter alt in Hinterlands, I ran out of arrows with like 4 quest mobs left to kill at the top of that huge troll temple/city/whatever that makes up so many of the quests in that area. I had a full quiver going up the city, but some bad pulls and some guy doing the "kite mobs away from you and then die so they reset and try to kill you" game made me burn through them fast. I decided, eh, what the heck, and switched into aspect of the beast and meleed them down. On my last one, a druid passed me in cat form and spammed me with tells that I was a "scrub" I "should delete this game right now, because you're terrible" "/wrists." I sent him a tell saying some not very nice things, told him I ran out of arrows with 4 mobs left, and I had at least switched to an aspect that benefits melee. Then I told him some more not very nice things and put him on ignore.
At least you learned when people said something, not like the 80 warlock trying to DPS as destro with a VW out and using only dots and shadow bolt I saw in HVH a few weeks ago. I tried to be nice and tell her that she should have her imp out and be casting chaos bolt, because it's a very good spell. She told me that if the (T8.5) tank went down, the VW was going to tank, and that chaos bolt only did 2k damage. I figured that, since she didn't train chaos bolt past rank 1, fixing her rotation in the instance was a lost cause, but I politely tried to suggest to her again that she take out her imp, that I (the healer) was able to keep the druid tank alive. She said I was doing so little healing that she was afraid that I was going to let the tank die (I was disc, and it was VERY unlikely that the mobs even chewed through the bubble.) After screaming out for heals because she life tapped herself into the ground in the middle of the kite boss, I let her die, and then suggested that, since I'm a bad healer, she should take out her imp, since he doesn't cost a shard. No one else died for the rest of the instance, and at the end she noticed that her DPS was way up, but she still sent me a tell that she was never going to group with me again. I guess I deserved it a little.
clevins Sep 26th 2009 3:28PM
Nope, sorry. Any player who refuses to use all of the skills available is being silly. The skills are there *for a reason*. To deliberately not train or use them is, bluntly, stupid and that person isn't a good [insert class here]. It's one thing to not get that at level 30 or whatever, but not after 80 levels.
I have another theory on the warrior: eBay.
Erikamel Sep 27th 2009 7:42PM
I agree that the warrior could have just been a noob. He may have overheard someone talking about prot warrior dps going up in WotLK, and took it to heart a bit too much.
As an example, I was tanking the regular ToC 5 man on the day it came out for the first time (on my warrior) and another warrior was in the group. When I joined, I noticed he had 26k health unbuffed, so I asked if he wanted to tank, since both of my specs are pretty solid. He insisted he was fury dps. This was true, spec-wise, but he definitely had an interesting mix of gear on. When I mentioned I was really hoping for the Black Heart to drop, he said he wanted it too. Another person said it should go to the tank, to which he replied, "Hey, I'm a warrior lol."
The point here being, some people can easily just not get things. My warrior example above couldn't figure out how dps and tanking were two completely different roles with different gear requirements.
I also ran into a different warrior once who had 68 points put into the fury tree, and 3 points into Improved Rend. For reals. Maybe it's just the lack of intellect on our gear o.O
Quint Sep 28th 2009 3:36AM
Uhm... Levelled a retri pally almost to 80 with a one-hander and a shield, because of how that looked. I'm still gratefull for that warrior that pointed out the two-handers.
I think we've all made stupid mistakes in the past and the only way to learn is by either reading up on tha internetz (Which I don't normally do on a new game; I read the booklet and that's it.) or by having other players help you.
syi Sep 25th 2009 8:19PM
I for one never enter a group without knowing who is doing and what and try to steer clear of pugs, I had teh BEST pug ever when we tried to do a timed cos and teh hunter ran out of ammo and hearthed, needless to say i kicked him and progressed onward. the rest of the group was vry confused as to why I kicked him and refused to invite him back. I think the poor performance said it all, he also pulled groups before I did and got very defensive when I told him i need to grab agro first
themightysven Sep 25th 2009 8:27PM
my theory, Hunters like to tank, let 'em ;)
Taladan Sep 26th 2009 11:30AM
That why, in a pug, the first thing I say when the group is complete is:
"Oh, I have one rule: You pull, you tank."
QQinsider Sep 28th 2009 4:52AM
@themightysven
Like hunters are the only ones that do this. I've seen that same type of idiot on every dps class, and been equally delighted to let them all experience the delights of tanking :)
Daniel Sep 25th 2009 8:28PM
Ten to one that was a bought toon. The number of crap you see at 80 is unbelievable. Alchemists who don't know what a specialization is. Druids who don't understand they can shift form in combat. Mages who don't know what a portal is.
yeah, I've seen it all.
He's not an idiot or a role player. He's an ebayer.