I think it's a shame that this game has such a strong compulsory element. Guildies treat you like garbage? Man up. Players getting bullied? Pffft, it isn't you. Raids not even advancing to new content? Shut up and collect your loot.

There's such a strong undercurrent of hostility I've picked up in many professional raiding guilds and even in the pug groups. "Mature adults don't quit in the middle of a raid." Yea well mature adults don't do the things that the raid leader quit over. This game, and the players who constitute this game, need to allow their raid leaders to walk away when the fun evaporates. The players ought to feel empowered to walk away when the fun disappears. Scientists ought to study this game to understand why women stay with abusive husbands.

I'm playing the "this is a game" card. Even in guilds with people in it I know down the street, I never stayed when it was apparent the guild was dysfunctional. I sometimes left guilds that were perfectly functional, but filled with jerk players - like that ninja-Rogue that the Raid Leader sided with, even knowing it was a ninja.


TL;DR
This is a game.
If it isn't fun, there should be a policy of "no fault" gquit.

I'm going to hijack the 1st post too and agree with Kurdaj. Guilds evolved as a social mechanism in a game (or games if you count the predecessors) that didn't lend itself to social involvement. From that came the massive guilds of the pre-BC era that dominated the servers and post-BC came the more "casual" guilds we all know and loathe today.

Kurdaj has hit the nail on the head that when the game is no longer fun and the focus is solely on winning then it's time to quit (unless you like that kind of abuse). None of us are paid millions to play professionally so there's no reason to put up with the drama.

TL;DR - not fun anymore? stop playing, go home, and read a good book. :)

@ Kur

I agree, that's always been my policy. Is the game fun? If not, why? We're going through simliar stress, we're a big guild now, doing some raiding, doing 25s w other guilds, trying to get a second raid group going. That's a ton of stress for me (i am co-GL and RL of 2nd team). ...Anyway this stuff isn't exactly fun. So i've been logging into a dift server starting fresh, that's very nice as I dont know a soul on that server (well except one kind person).

But yeah if you arent having fun, if it becomes more of a second job, i'd wow quit or take a break at the least.

I agree 100% with what Kurdaj said.

I am an officer/raid leader of a guild which has currently downed 9/14 Ulduar-10. Trying to progress even further to Trial of the Crusader and even 25 mans like Ulduar is hard, especially when you're in a situation where you're slightly low on members for 25 mans.

Raid/Guild leadership is stressful, especially when you get situations where raid members (particularly pugged ones) act like jerks and leave a raid the moment they see a wipe.

Sorry, I'm coming down on the other side of the fence on this one. I totally agree with the 'it's a game, not a job' angle; if you're not having fun, you need to reevaluate your playstyle or your decision to play at all.

HOWEVER, raiding is a team sport; there are 9 (or 24) other people that you made a commitment to when you signed up to raid, and even more so for a raid leader. What would people say if you were on a basketball team and you got fed up with some people's loose talk and just walked off the court, mid-game? What if your team captain did it? That kind of behavior doesn't fly in real life, either.

I think even ERL recognizes what he did was wrong; why do you defend it? Even he understands that he was contributing to the drama, not avoiding it. You seem to imply that 'no-fault gquit' includes any time, anywhere, under any circumstances; personally, that sounds pretty selfish to me.

I apologize if I sound overly harsh; one of my biggest pet peeves is the different standard of behavior that we seem to have behind the veil of anonymity provided by the internet...

JBluntz I would understand the team co-captain storming off the court if some of the other players were openly talking shit about some of the other players and the other co-captain undermined the first captains authority and made a major decision without consultation. WoW players are only human and sometimes due to shit in game and shit IRL they can get so angry they do that kind of stuff.

Hell I have nearly rage quit a couple of times recently because there are some douchebags in my guilds that I can't do anything about. There is only so much disrespect people can take before it isn't worth their time to keep playing.

That said personally I would have banned the shit talkers from vent and told them to stfu or find another guild. Shitheads are easy to replace.

It may have been wrong but it was completely understandable (just like punching some of these shitheads in the face IRL).

@theRaptor:

You really have an overt fondness for the word "shit", don't you? Lol! I agree though, some people I have come across in this game in particular, I have just wanted to strangle. People think that just because we can't see each other, that entitles them to a free "be rude to everyone" licence. It's, quite honestly, dispicable.