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11-10-2009 @ 3:02PM
Why does most of the WoW community seem to think that PvP'ers are bad PvE'rs and vice versa, when most of the top arena players (top being 2500+ ) Are usually in guilds that are in the top 100 (worldwide)?
11-10-2009 @ 3:19PM
At the risk of being flamed, all the good PvE players already know that if you have what it takes to be a top PvP contender then that automatically makes you good at PvE. Fact is pve is pretty easy even on hard modes, except for a few boss fights and doesn't take more then a basic knowledge of your class. PvP on the other hand requires you to know every single detail about all the classes and how people are going to play comps. Much much more difficult.
11-10-2009 @ 3:37PM
./agree w/como x100I started as hardcore PVE. Then did PVP. After that I became a beast in PVE. Here's the deal....you can be great at PVE, and be horrible at PVP. But if you can master PVP you pretty much have mastered your class and will be able to dominate in PVE.I always suggest my guildies to try it. and they all say, PVP sucks, and i just think to myself that they only say that cuz they're not good at it and havent taken the time to really read their abilities. It really is fun, but also frustrating. The thrill and adrenaline rush you get in an arena win is unmatched, but I also love defeating bosses after weeks of trying them on hardmode.i /cry when palladins say they hate pvp when they have the greatest arsenal of pvp tools ever.
11-10-2009 @ 3:46PM
First off, just because you're in a top raiding guild doesn't mean you raid. Second, even if the top raiders also include a lot of the top PvPer's, you can't extrapolate that down onto the WoW playerbase at large.
11-10-2009 @ 4:09PM
Being downgraded as we speak, gotta love people who can't take reality. PvP is always defined in difficulty by it's players. At the top level of Arena play the smallest of small mistakes will make or break you. That being said to be the best in Arena you MUST know your and every other class/spec inside and out. That is pretty much by definition harder then pve where there is a set level of difficulty that goes down as your gear improves and there is plenty of room for error. Everyone knows there the pve end game is much easier then games before it and even wow itself. I'm not complaining about that or calling people out on it. I'll put it this way, in order to excel at pvp you must know everything about every class/spec and be able to know the strats to beat comps and they are evolving on the fly. the skills needed for pve are following a strat that doesn't evolve and only gets easier with gear. Having the skill set to excel in pvp guarantee's that you have the same skill set to excel in pvp...so yea downgrade me all you want for calling the endgame easy...sighAnd of course top 100 guilds have their 'b', 'c', and 'd' teams how do you think they get to be the top 100, by picking the best out of them and encouraging competition. It has nothing to do with what I said though.
11-10-2009 @ 4:30PM
PVE is only following a set strategy after someone else has put in a lot of hard work figuring everything out. Every facet of PVP can be easily learned from online sources, if you want to know the abilities of other classes the info is available. That said, on the top end PVP you have to be really good with on the fly decisions and for PVE you need to know all of the class abilities to figure out what will work.
11-10-2009 @ 4:42PM
"That being said to be the best in Arena you MUST know your and every other class/spec inside and out."Oh like kittens you do. At the high end of Arena, you just need to know how the cookie cutter class combos of the current patch are played, because that's all that exists at the high end."the skills needed for pve are following a strat that doesn't evolve and only gets easier with gear."Let me tell you a story. I heard this professional drummer say how whenever he gets a new student who's an intermediate level drummer, the first thing he does is gives them a relatively simple beat to play, and that they have to keep playing it until he tells them to stop. And you know what? Most of them can't do it. They inevitably end up throwing a fill in somewhere, or changing up the beat.That's the problem with PvP players in a PvE environment. They're so used to the twitchy, on-the-fly improvisation of Arena that when they're presented with PvE, where it's just one straight-ahead strat, they can't do it. They make stupid mistakes. Now I'm not saying this makes PvE'rs better or more intelligent than PvP'ers. I'm just saying that it's two different skill sets.
11-10-2009 @ 5:02PM
"Every facet of PVP can be easily learned from online sources, if you want to know the abilities of other classes the info is available."Umm, same with pve...where do you think guilds get their strats? From the top 100's who figured them out. Where do you think people get their pvp strats/comps, from the top. Both have plenty of information on them online so I view it as a non issue."At the high end of Arena, you just need to know how the cookie cutter class combos of the current patch are played, because that's all that exists at the high end." Riiight, so everyone running the cookie cutter spec(which I do agree with) automatically gets a 2500+ rating? No, they beat all the other comps and strats because they know the comp better and have the ability to beat those same comps.And the whole drummer bit, we'll have to agree to disagree because I won't even go into how dumb that sounds? A pvp player isn't going to be good at pve because he is too twitchy not to stand in the fire? They are not 2 different skill sets and whatever anecdotal evidence you have of this is simply that, your limited experience.
11-10-2009 @ 7:13PM
They are different aspects of the game, but I think what most people run into (and complain about) are the players who use PvE gear in PvP, or vice verse. Think about a VoA25 PuG and you'll see a few people who are in their PvP gear from just doing WG, or who only do PvP. The problem is that VoA is a PvE encounter, and so they appear lower on the meters because they aren't geared or spec'd for PvE.It is possible to be good at both, but usually I see people focusing on one or the other.
11-10-2009 @ 7:21PM
@NizariWhat a retarded comment. If you play arenas at the high end you didn't just magically appear up there, you had to wade through all the lower brackets meaning you do have to understand how to deal with every class. No one got to 2800 by only knowing how to counter rmp (although that knowledge definitely helps)."They're so used to the twitchy, on-the-fly improvisation of Arena that when they're presented with PvE, where it's just one straight-ahead strat, they can't do it."This is possibly the most fail thing I've read on this site. It's pretty much a Logic Fallacy. You're assuming that just because arena players are sometimes improvise in arena play that they must always improvise? And thus can't follow a set plan? What? I'm sorry to break it to you, but people who play high end arenas would make good PvErs whether you like it or not, playing against a computerized opponent that you can study beforehand and fully anticipate their every move is not that difficult.
11-10-2009 @ 7:41PM
I would say that it takes being a really good player to be truly great at either one, PvP or PvE distinctions aside. People who prefer one side over the other - to the extent that they think the other "takes no skill" - are just going to bicker one way or the other.
11-11-2009 @ 12:51AM
I only have a couple of 80's but I can definitely say that being great at PvP would absolutely not get you a free ticket through PvE content. On my mage, I know that PvE and PvP are nearly as different from each other as separate classes. Much more so when fire was the only PvE spec and Frost the only PvP.Also, Arena players don't "often" improvise; improvising is all you do in small scale PvP. That would certainly get you part of the way to mastering PvE but not all the way. If you're great at one you'll likely be very good at the other also. Few people are actually great at both.
11-11-2009 @ 3:13AM
I will absolutely agree that PVP is "harder" than PVE. It takes not only the same kind of mastery and knowledge of your abilities that is need to be a top raider, the knowledge of other classes abilities and limitations that say a good raiding tank, raid leader, etc, needs, but it also takes something that by and large even the best raiders don't need..... good twitch gaming skills, especially for the Arena, but somewhat true in BGs as well. This is why I hate PVP, though I readily admit that its harder than what I do and hats off to those good at it. But i play WoW to RELAX, sit back, chill out, watch a movie while i play, maybe have a few beers, talk on the phone. If I want to twitch game (and sometimes I do) I'll go pop in Halo or Gears of War or Call of Duty.
11-11-2009 @ 3:42AM
I leveled a Warlock to 70 in BC. Questing and a few instances. Then I wanted to try out the PVP end of it and got stomped, because all I knew about my class was dot, dot, dot, shadow bolt.Now with every alt I've rolled since I make a point of running at least one BG per play-session, it's magnificent in terms of teaching you how to use all those CCs, protective abilities (oh shit buttons) and various other things that don't end up part of your typical PVE rotation. I can't speak for everyone, but PVP has definitely made me a far better player, in raids and 5-mans as well as BGs and arenas.
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