Ammo controversy in 3.3 already
by Mike Schramm 
Dec 9th 2009 at 11:00AM
Let's not forget, however, that this is cutting edge (no pun intended) ammo -- this isn't the kind of vendor junk you just fire while leveling. It's a 30 point DPS gain from the previous high level ammo, and that kind of increase probably does justify a little tougher requirement to make. Of course, it'll probably work out so that other classes get that increase normally through their itemization, but that's just the way it works for hunters. If you want the new ammo, you'll have to find an friendly engie of the right spec with the right skill Honored with the new Ashen Verdict faction, and then keep them supplied with as much Crystallized Earth and Shadow as you can find.
Filed under: Hunter, Engineering, Items, Analysis / Opinion, Fan stuff, Making money, Wrath of the Lich King
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 8)
Barinthos Dec 9th 2009 11:12AM
I was a bit bummed that the ammo required a specific type of engineering to make these. It doesn't quite make sense that Blizz just now decided to start making use of the Gob/Gnome "specs" like this either. Last time I had any kind of requirement to make anything specific with the specs was when i was in Tanaris...40 levels ago.
LilBanshee Dec 9th 2009 11:39AM
That's actually not true at all, engineering is the only profession that has retained a few distinct recipes for its different specializations throughout all expansions. Goblin rocket launcher ring a bell? I loved using that for pulls in BC. Also... Gnomish poultryizer? X-ray specs? Global thermo-nuclear sapper bomb thingamjig? All require a specific spec. There were far more back in vanilla, but that was true of many professions.
The relevance of specializations has been reduced to extra procs for tailoring and alchemy and worthless low-level recipes for leatherworking and blacksmithing. Engineering is a last holdout of a classic specialization system, and even that you can easily respec now for a nominal fee.
Allarr Dec 9th 2009 11:54AM
Any other profession in the game has methods to make money. I do not see a problem at all allowing engineers to do the same. Even if there is only one class in the game that wants what I'm selling, versus every class for things like JC or enchanters.
I believe they should allow engineers a few more ways, perhaps tinkering other people's armor? I'm an engineer, because it's fun, I like the tinkers, and I don't feel like leveling a new profession. I'll be pleased to be able to earn some money now.
There is no other way to get this ammo in the game. QQ. There's no other way to get gems but from a JC, not other way to get enchants but from an enchanter.
Thank you Blizz.
Tirrimas Dec 9th 2009 11:54AM
"Engineering is a last holdout of a classic specialization system, and even that you can easily respec now for a nominal fee."
Wait - wut?
Boz Dec 9th 2009 12:10PM
@Tirrimas
As of 3.2 Engineers have been able to switch back and forth for 150g. Details are available at:http://www.wowwiki.com/Engineering under " Switching specializations"
furry Dec 9th 2009 12:19PM
I think the fact that they required goblin or gnomish is ridiculous. Look at all the other new craftable gear for blacksmiths, leatherworkers, and tailors- none of them require a spec of any sort.
Look at all the craftable items in Wrath of the Lich King- There are no items at level 80 that are restricted to a certain spec for crafting. Any tailor can make any of the items. Blacksmiths can all make the top-level crafted weapons and all the top-level crafted armor. The only place I see specs come in is in crafting side-items- cloth, elixirs, etc.
I'm talking about Alchemy for the ability to produce extra items depending on their spec and Tailoring to make two pieces of cloth for a certain type rather than just one piece. But in these cases, all Alchemists and all Tailors can make everything, even if it isn't a proc chance.
If they split up the bullets and arrows that way, I'd be ok: Make both the bullets and arrows craftable by gnomish and goblin (and no-spec) engineers, but give goblin engineers a chance to proc extra bullets or every craft makes some number of extra each time, and the same for arrows and gnomish engineers.
I'm a goblin engineer and am currently using a crossbow. I'm still an engineer because I can make my own ammo. Shouldn't being an engineer be enough? Especially at the cost of a primordial saronite?
Verit Dec 9th 2009 1:20PM
Well I think the problem here is there aren't ANY bows that drop out of end game instances currently (Naxx is the only one) - which means gnomish engineers get screwed again.
Verit Dec 9th 2009 1:23PM
Whoops - stand corrected - there is a single xbow in TOC-25, but I'm still correct - the ultimate ranged weapon most people I've seen seem to have is that gun from h-toc.
I still don't think arrows will sell all that well :/.
QQinsider Dec 9th 2009 2:25PM
Are you kidding? There are loads of xbows in the game. The ilvl 245 one that drops off Jax in ToC25. The ilvl 232 one that I have from Anub in ToC10. And I just 10 minutes ago had a ilvl 232 bow drop at the end of Halls of Reflection heroic. These are all far better (albeit harder to get) weapons than that ToC5 gun which is only ilvl 219 (a while ago Blizzard buffed ranged weapons of ilvl 226 and above, so there's a massive dps jump between 219 and 226+ weapons).
I do think it's unfair to engineers to split the ammo like this though. All other professions had that removed a while back, LW no longer requires me to choose between the different specializations for example. So why should engineers be screwed like this? Even more annoying if you're a hunter with engineering and can't make ammo for your own fkn weapon because it's the "wrong" type...
Deadly. Off. Topic. Dec 9th 2009 11:12AM
Or you could have two alts, one goblin and one gnomish engineering, so that when specific recipes call for a particular branch you have one ready for the occasion. (That's what I'd do if both my engineers were 80...)
OR
Wait for them to update the recipes so that both arrows and bullets can be made by one particular branch.
Qot Dec 9th 2009 11:44AM
"Honored with the new Ashen Verdict faction"
That's going to be the hard part. I have an alt that knows engineering at high enough level, but there's just no way to get both him and my main up to honored anytime soon, since the 5-mans only gave Sunreavers rep (unless they put in dailies, which is unlikely given their status as Violet Eye 2.0).
Heilig Dec 9th 2009 11:50AM
"Or you could have two alts, one goblin and one gnomish engineering, so that when specific recipes call for a particular branch you have one ready for the occasion. (That's what I'd do if both my engineers were 80...)
OR
Wait for them to update the recipes so that both arrows and bullets can be made by one particular branch."
OR
You can just buy them off the AH for about 30% of the cost of the current top-end ammo. I currently spend 6-8 G per 1000 rounds. A week of raiding requires me to shell out 30(!) gold in ammo. Once these are available, I will have to do exactly ONE daily to fund my ammo costs each week. Anyone complaining about this is simply looking for something to complain about. The irony is that these are the same people who call it World of Casualcraft and complain about welfare epics. You can't have it both ways, guys.
Look at it this way, guys. The cost of ammo is your fee for not ever having to worry about buffing anyone. Ever.
Gnosh Dec 9th 2009 11:51AM
From what I heard, all Ashen Verdict recipes are BoA. So no alt grind.
Deathgodryuk Dec 9th 2009 1:02PM
Hunters whining about something? That NEVER happens. /sarcasm
Thalen Dec 9th 2009 7:24PM
Rep will be an issue, until the time ICC is easy enough for alts to be brought in, unless you're lucky enough to have both kinds of engineers as main raiders in your guild.
The cost of the ammo isn't the issue, once you're there, no one is arguing that.
Now, getting your guild to let 2 of you have a Primordial Saronite to buy the pattern may be more of a problem. Or, spend 23 (?) badges each to get one instead of gear. Or wait a few weeks until you can get one in the AH for under 5K.
It's a pain to have to bug someone to get the right ammo when we've been so used to being able to be self-sufficient. We'll deal with that. The Primordial Saronite is the real sticky point for some people though, not the actual mats.
Ringo Flinthammer Dec 9th 2009 7:44PM
"From what I heard, all Ashen Verdict recipes are BoA. So no alt grind."
You heard wrong.
Arrowsmith Dec 9th 2009 11:13AM
To me this seems perfectly fair. Crystallized Earth and Shadow are easy to find in Wintergrasp, and as for finding the right Engineer, it's no different than the specializations of other crafting professions, like Tailoring for example. Plus, it's another way for Engineers to make money, so where's the problem?
Barinthos Dec 9th 2009 11:18AM
The mats are definitely a lame reason for QQ, they're easy to get and a hell of a lot cheaper than i was expecting for such awesome ammo.
I was just hoping I could use my warrior to make both types of ammo instead of just the bullets lol.
Meh, who knows, Blizz might get rid of that stipulation in a later patch.
Ringo Flinthammer Dec 9th 2009 11:18AM
Which other Ashen Verdict recipes require specialization? Go look.
LeggMyMuoio Dec 9th 2009 11:27AM
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=52023
"Requires Gnomish Engineer"