I don't get what the debate about "Think a level 80 player ought to be on top of his or her game?" is. The answer is an undebatable, indisputable yes.

Hell, the player doesn't even need to be 'on top of his game', just making an obvious effort to both doing the best he can and also improving his game. To me(I have an icc10 geared mage and a toc10/25 geared reso shaman) this means that after being asked to dps marked targets (skull->cross->etc) they do so. It means that if someone suggests in a reasonably nice way that they could improve x by doing y they respond in the same way. Not with a 'f--k off nerd i dont have hours to geek around at the pc for some silly numbers, now htfu and get me my epics'. It means that someone in ilvl187/200 blue/epics can do 2k dps.

It doesn't mean someone who is in 232 t9 and 245 badge gear who is pulling 2k dps. It doesn't mean someone who is in 264's and dieing every pull because the tank with LESS gear than him can't hold aggro (lol wonder why). It doesn't mean someone who is standing in the fire all the time and blames healer when he dies.

I'm ok with carrying someone who is putting an effort in to improve. I'm not ok with carrying a 'casual' (since when did casual come to share the same meaning as clueless idiot?) who refuses to both learn to play and to take advice.

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