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All of the latest Mists of Pandaria newsThe Queue: The new standard
by Adam Holisky 
Dec 30th 2009 at 3:00PM
That's a picture of my hunter above. She can use some better gear, and hopefully this weekend it'll be her turn to get decked out in tier 9. It's just so easy and fun. Plus I really like the idea of all my 80's having their tier 9 shoulders to look at on the loading screen. That's not strange, is it?
Saberix asked...
"Is tier 9 gear the new standard in gear? Am I going to be teased if I don't have it?"
While I think the answer deserves at least an article or two written about it, I'd say yes, tier 9 has developed into the new standard of gear upon which everyone is judged off of. I know that from a mechanical perspective tier 9 is far from necessary to run everything but Icecrown Citadel, and is most certainly not necessary for heroics. Yet when I go into a heroic and see a tank with less than 40,000 HP, part of me sighs and wishes for a new one, even though a 30,000 HP tank is going to do just fine.
The standard is irrational, and doesn't really do WoW any good. But nonetheless, it's something people have to deal with. One way to deal with it is to get your tier 9 shoulders as quickly as possible, those 30 badges are pretty easy to obtain. Once you've gotten them people will just look at you briefly and say "oh, tier 9 shoulders, good to go." Of course if they're using something like gear score (which is equally ridiculous as any tier 9 standard), then they might see otherwise.
The other thing to remember is that when people complain, just ignore them. If you're doing 1500 DPS in a heroic, then you're ready for the heroic. If you're not, then take a look at your rotation and spend some time on the practice dummy. If you still can't hit 1500 DPS, take a look at your gear and see what's missing. I've been able to pull 1500 DPS using level 70 Black Temple / Sunwell / Archimonde gear, so it's not too hard to hit. If you do need some gear, check the AH for a couple BoE level 80 blues and epics, and don't forget to roll need on any blues from heroics that can help you. Then when people complain that you're not in tier 9, you can just say "Since when do heroics require more than 1500 DPS?"
People will usually stop complaining after that.
Finally, remember too that this won't be an issue in six months or so when Cataclysm is out.
Averrex asked...
"What's the defense cap?"
Defense has a soft cap of 540. It's "soft" because defense still is useful after 540, just not an absolute necessary. If you don't have 540 defense though, you'll get yourself crit by raid boss mobs, and that's no fun. It's pretty easy to get these days with tier 9 gear, so it shouldn't be as big of an issues as it once was. The defense soft cap really don't apply for druids either, since they're talented into being uncritable.
Logan asked...
"When is Cataclysm going to release? Do you have any leaks?"
We know that Cataclysm is going to release in 2010, but not any specific time-frame therein. In other words, we do not know an exact date. Sites like Amazon are not listing the correct date, the just list something so they can get you to pre-order the game. When the release date is finally leaked or announced, trust me, you'll hear it here right away.
Have questions about the World of Warcraft? The WoW.com crew is here with The Queue, our daily Q&A column! Leave your questions in the comments and we'll do our best to answer 'em!Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Blizzard, The Queue, Cataclysm
Reader Comments (Page 4 of 8)
ZMES_Matt Dec 30th 2009 3:59PM
@Rin
Ah, okies, I gotcha. I was looking oversome of their wowwiki articles to make sure I wasn't forgetting anything, and you're right they do say they're just watchers. It is kind of confusing though cause Freya's article says she's daughter of the titans, but I guess not actually a titan herself. *shrug* Stupid powerful beings and their confusing reporductive ways.
Regardless, all 4 watchers are still fairly powerful beings, it's not like we rescued some peasant that's going back to the ol' farmstead to live out the rest of their life tilling/milking cows...I would think what the watchers decide to do after Ulduar could and should have some great affect on the current story.
Sunaseni Dec 30th 2009 4:04PM
To be pedantic, the Keepers of Ulduar are not the Titans, Titans are akin to gods who created Azeroth and a myriad of other planets.
With Yogg dead, I'd expect the Keepers to go back to doing what they were doing, or at least helping in keeping the Scourge at bay. Mimiron would be inventing, Freya would be cultivating nature somewhere, Hodir would probably return to his sons (if he were anything but a beatnik dad). Thorim's the tough one, besides for revenge on Loken, there wasn't much in a way of a goal for him.
Mordockk Dec 30th 2009 4:20PM
ulduar was really a prison built by the titans for yogg saron and freya hodir etc were the gaurdians.
now that yogg escaped' kinda' and we killed him......it'll probalby end up like alcatraz.....just another tourist attraction.
RogueJedi86 Dec 31st 2009 12:20AM
Oh god, can you imagine the Watchers fighting in Icecrown Citadel? Imagine fighting the Lich King alongside Mimiron's Roflcopter/Voltron. I would personally go to Blizzard HQ and kiss the feet of everyone there just to see Mimiron fighting the Lich King alongside us. Can you imagine that fight, the Gnome God versus the Undead God?
Adeany Dec 30th 2009 3:42PM
If you're doing 1500 dps in heroic HoR, I will politely ask you to leave. If you insist on staying, I will try to votekick you.
Joshua Ochs Dec 30th 2009 3:43PM
True. There are heroics, and there are heroics. 1500dps will NOT carry you through all of them. HoR especially not.
clevins Dec 30th 2009 3:47PM
Yeah. And, really, while it might be a bit mch to expect people to be in full T9/245 gear, 2 piece T9 is 60 badges. That's 10-12 heroics.... so if someone isn't in that they're saying they haven't run a dozen heroics in the weeks since 3.3's been out (to be fair they might have upgraded other slots first, but still).
tatsumasa Dec 30th 2009 4:03PM
um before gearscore and cross-realm pugging, 1500 dps was the minimum for heroics. once you dps was pushing out 1500 you were ready to move up from regulars to heroics. if you have two people pushing 2.5 to4k and one pulling 1.5, you're not going to miss any enrage timers or anything. before t9 existed no one was doing more than 3.5k anyway. expecting more of people now on their alts is a bit ridiculous.
when people pull triple digits i will let them know i'm not happy about it, but i won't ask them to leave or vote-kick because it's not going to keep us from completing the dungeon. but they should know they need to do better. you weren't born doing 6k, so don't act like everyone else should be. these people might be just a little behind the end-game curve and are only now hitting 80. how the hell else should they get gear? and why are you in heroicS (plural) if you're full t10 hardcore leet anyway?
Sel Dec 30th 2009 4:55PM
@tatsumasa. If you actually read the comment you replied to you'd know he didn't say that someone with new gear doing 1500 shouldn't be doing heroics, he said they shouldn't be doing H.HoR. If you are ready to start gearing for heroics, do the lower level heroics and work your way up. Doing 1500 DPS in H.HoR means your group has to be able to carry you.
I see tons of pugs where the DPS is doing 1.1-2.5k and myself or other well geared people need to carry them. Most people are happy to do so to help them gear as long as we can still clear the instance comfortably. In any of the lower heroics, bring in your 1.1k rogue (seen three today), do nothing but spam fan of knives (seen that twice today)... but get your dps up more before hitting instances like H.HoR.
Expecting to go from "ready for heroics" into the hardest heroic is just arrogant. Arguing people should have to carry you because you do anyway, is just obnoxious.
tatsumasa Dec 30th 2009 5:57PM
@sel
i was replying to adeany. had you read what i said instead of looking to pick an argument you would have realized that.
Sorcefire Dec 30th 2009 6:50PM
Again with this topic of acceptable parameters to an instance and yet NOTHING is being said about the mechanics of the random LFG. I can't blame a player who entered the random queue and got HoR despite being in gear that would not allow them to do "acceptable" DPS there.
I'm getting quite sick of all the whining and complaining, not to mention elitism, people are showing towards other players because they got put into the ICC dungeons when they hit "Enter Queue". Blizzard needs to fix the gear matching/requirements for the random queue quickly before we have a player cataclysm of our own!
The whole things seems one-sided. You are locked out of certain instances if you're gear isn't of a sufficient quality, but that cap seems to fade pretty quickly once you get ilvl 200+ gear. That's not even commenting on the old-world and BC instances where it's strictly level-driven.
Come on Blizz, fix the damned thing or throw it out. At the minimum stop penalizing people for dropping out instances they are not ready for.
Reps Dec 31st 2009 5:25AM
By the time I was eligible to enter heroic FoS on my alt, I was pulling 3k+ in heroics. I think I pulled 3.5k my first heroic FoS run. If somebody is in a heroic FoS run with you, and they are doing under 2k dps, they are playing their class wrong, or gearing wrong.The same was true of normal heroics. I was not able to enter ANY heroic dungeon before my gear was at an acceptable level. By the time the dungeon finder would let me enter heroics, I was pulling 2k+ per run. If somebody is pulling triple digit dps in a heroic, they are playing their class wrong.
Doing 900, or even 1300 dps in a heroic is not a matter of having inadequate gear. It is a matter of not knowing how to play the game. And no amount of being carried through heroics will fix that. In fact, it will have quite the opposite effect.
If a perso consistently does 1200 dps in heroics, and is carried though them, he will have no reason to go look up how to fix what he is doing wrong. He will earn badges and will save up for and buy his tier 9 pieces. He can continue this until he has 3 or 4 tier 9 pieces, and a gearscore of around 4500. With all this new gear, he is doing around 2k dps in heroics now, so nobody bothers him. Now he is sitting in dalaran, and he sees some guy advertising for a ToC 10 run. The raid leader looks at his gear, which checks out, and invites him to the raid. They start the run, and the DK doesn't even know he is doing anything wrong.
Sadly, that DK is the guy at the bottom of your recount list, sitting just above the tank, doing 3k dps and standing in fires. Yes, sadly, this happens every day. And as long as the group is completing the instance, the DK will be sitting on your shoulders waiting to be carried, and nobody will say a thing.
Now, if people had decided not to be Mister Nice Guy and had confronted this person about his dps and possibly even removed him from the group. Repeatedly. By every person he grouped with. He would either 1) Fix his dps or 2) quit the game.
This is the truth. Carrying players through any instance, be it a heroic or a raid, for any reason other than a lack of gear, helps nobody, and hurts everybody.
PvtDeth Dec 31st 2009 6:48AM
Not sure what's going on with the voting on this post. The original comment said 1500k dps was not enough for heroic HoR. I've had a ton of wipes in there with really well-geared players.
It drops 232 gear. Would you bring a 1500 dps to 25 Ulduar?
Sel Dec 31st 2009 8:14AM
@tatsu - Yes, you were replying to Adeany. Which is why I said "If you actually read the comment you replied to."
Read Adeany's post again:
"Adeany Dec 30th 2009 3:42PM
If you're doing 1500 dps in -->heroic HoR
Sel Dec 31st 2009 8:17AM
@PvtDeth - All people read is "votekick" and "1500 dps" and they start jumping up and down to throw a tantrum instead of reading the whole post.
Blizzard needs to fix the gear matching, but I've seen well geared players pull 2k dps. They can't gear match for skill or deception. I've seen people load in wearing a few pieces of higher level gear that are inappropriate - like leather dps in caster cloth, then switch to their actual gear once inside so they get queued in higher instances.
mcdingo Dec 30th 2009 3:44PM
So I have a question. I recently did the epic druid flight form quest. Spoiler alert, it revolved a lot around the emerald dream. Turns out the raven lord was causing problems. At the end of the quest I killed him. Does that mean I fixed the emerald dream? Is there no possibility of the emerald expansion because of a class only quest that fixed the whole problem?
Pam Dec 30th 2009 3:57PM
I'm just sad they took out the achievement for when you did the swift flight form quest line. That thing is a pita...and I liked seeing the 'badabing' at the end of it.
epsilon343 Dec 30th 2009 4:01PM
From what I know about the Emerald Dream there's something called the Nightmare that's infecting it. On top of that Ysera is like permanently dreaming. I don't have a Druid so I'm guessing you stopped just one of the things attacking the Emerald Dream.
I look forward to having someone with more knowledge on the subject explain it better.
Tamednan Dec 30th 2009 5:21PM
@Pam
There is still an achievement for completing the quest chain. It's a feat of strength. Unless there was another achievement associated with the quest that got removed.
John Dec 30th 2009 3:53PM
I wouldn't buy T9 shoulders when you can buy iLVL 245 shoulders for 15 morde badges. If you awnt to increase your dps though and only want ot spend 30 emblems, then get the T9 gloves.