Breakfast Topic: The all-DPS Group
by Matthew Rossi 
Jan 13th 2010 at 8:00AM
Often in these situations I'm unfortunate enough to have decided to DPS on a character that can tank, but luckily (or unluckily as the case may be) yesterday I was on my shaman and so could simply sit back and wait. It was mentioned to the 'tank' that, as the person who had signed up to tank the instance it might behoove him (or possibly her, hard to tell who's behind the keyboard) to slap on a shield and some tanking gear, but only the grim silence of the truly disinterested was our reply. Was he even at the keys? Hard to say. The wait extended to the point where we could safely kick him, and kick him we did. but that's ten minutes or so of my life I'll never get back. (And no, my shaman couldn't tank HHoR, I didn't even try).
This is leaving out the fun of the HFoS run where the 'healer' was in full Elemental gear, used Flametongue on his weapon, and let the melee die twice on trash pulls because the only healing spell he cast was Lesser Healing Wave, only to roll need on Nighttime and drop group immediately. At least he pretended, I guess. (Best quote of the evening was from the surprisingly friendly and helpful death knight... sorry, dude, but it goes against your class' whole deal... who said "You went pretty much that whole boss fight with no healer and we still killed him" in front of the guy.)
So, I ask you: do you queue as a tank or healer to get a faster group and then hope someone else will do it? Or queue and then sort of half-heartedly pretend? Or have you run into one of these folks and found yourself tanking or healing a run you signed up to DPS?
Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Breakfast Topics, Instances, Wrath of the Lich King
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 12)
Kroof Jan 13th 2010 8:06AM
I have never been unlucky enough to experience this first hand.
You should have the general courtesy to click on the role you are willing and able to fulfill.
Anything else and you might as well be sitting in Dalaran spamming trade chat with
"LVL 80 looking for run through random heroics!"
Noctune Jan 20th 2010 1:49AM
My priest is Shadow priest as a main
i still have Healbot loaded and yes i don't normaly switch gear for HC still with 4pc T9 i don't have to.
i have enough raw HPS that once im in Holyspec i don't have a problem healing an instance.
sure you will see me switching spec and drinking for 20s but that aint a problem.
i have been in a run where we actualy had a DPS warrior tank it wasn't a problem as long as he is DEF cap. i don't realy care. he have to keep aggro then i don't care i can heal a tank with 28k hp with ease so 28k and def cap then i don't care if not then i will ask if they are going to switch gear else im going to vote kick them.
Res Jan 13th 2010 12:19PM
Sometimes I think it's an honest mistake people make.. when you can do either role the default setting has each one clicked. If someone doesn't pay attention they can think they're queueing as DPS when actually they're picked to tank because they didn't notice it was selected. I had that happen once where the guy honestly seemed confused about why he was the tank and apologized and left the group.
That's just sometimes though, I'm sure it happens on purpose all the time, someone just expects someone else to pick up the slack.
Rotties67 Jan 13th 2010 12:32PM
Kroof you are a very lucky player. I have experienced a lot of people claim to be tanks and...well they aren't. Or they are beginning tanks, and click on the role in their DPS gear and are in WAY over their heads.
The one saving grace for me is that my Pallys are dual spec Ret and Prot, with Prot being my primary spec. However, I always queue for Pugs as Ret because I have run into this problem so often (and I tank for my guild, I like a break and the waiting for the instance to pop gives me a chance to scan the AH, do dailies, etc).
If I like the group, or the person that got in over his head (was in their ret gear), I will offer to tank. If they did it to beat the queue, no luck. I will wait it out (tab out and read WoW.com), etc. No way am I going to let them dictate how I play the game, nor am I going to let them give me an expensive repair bill.
kabshiel Jan 13th 2010 12:54PM
Most of the tanks and healers I've run with have been at least semi-competent. The DPS, on the other hand, wow. I've been in a number of runs with casters who will cast about one spell per minute and maybe wand a little. I've been with melee DPS who will hang out in the back and never attack anything. I was with a warlock who just spammed Seed of Corruption over and over. It's kind of shocking how people can be that bad.
humperdinck Jan 13th 2010 1:49PM
@kabshiel I spam Seed of Corruption on groups of trash mobs. As an affliction lock, it makes things deader quicker than my fire rain. Although if I find the tank is not holding aggro, I switch back to fire.
Bedessa Jan 13th 2010 2:34PM
I've never experienced this either, and I tend to play hybrids that could take up the role. But please believe they would not be able to get me to do it for them. More than likely because I don't feel like waiting I would go to my non-dps spec, and then kick them out of the group, while we get a near automatic dps slot filled. I'm down for expediency, but ass hat won't be getting the perks of it.
kabshiel Jan 20th 2010 4:40PM
@humperdinck:
I should've been clearer. They were spamming Seed of Corruption on a boss with no adds. And when I say spamming, I mean chain casting it over and over so it wouldn't even get a chance to tick.
Gamer am I Jan 13th 2010 8:07AM
I my first random heroic, I healed a group with a tank in all greens and blues, and they were all fury armor. He also had an "of the" shield. Since then, I have tanked all of my runs.
I personally don't get why people sign up as tanks or healers if they intend to DPS. Sure, your wait may be shorter, but is the time you spend waiting for someone to volunteer to tank or heal worth it? I'd like to hear one good reason why people do that. I've been lucky that it hasn't happened to me since that first run.
Verit Jan 13th 2010 11:11AM
I think I can answer this - at lower levels (like 25-40 etc) this is a REALLY common problem - and generally speaking this isn't an issue until Zul'Farrak (probably the first dungeon you'll ever run into that requires any amount of coordination).
Some people probably get it stuck in their heads that if they pick healer/tank that they will generally queue faster, but in reality have no idea what healer or tank means (remember - you're looking into the mind of a 10-12 year old here...).
Maybe as WoW moves more towards a hack/slash style of game - they should be putting in game guides? In the website guide: http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/basics/content-index.html - they really never go into combat roles unless you read through all the class guides (and even then - they don't say what tank means) - even in the combat section threat, tanking or healing isn't even mentioned except in passing.
Draelan Jan 13th 2010 2:01PM
@ Sleutel
The main problem with an "Unprepared for Role" vote that you've described is that it could, and most likely WOULD, be heavily abused.
OMG! That DPS is only doing 1500 DPS in a heroic compared to your 4k DPS! That must mean they suck and don't deserve to play! (As opposed to simply being a fresh 80 trying to gear up.)
or, That tank is doing well enough, but I don't like his attitude. Since most of the group are my buddies, I'm going to vote to make it so he can't run dungeons for 24 hours!
or, Gee, I'm an asshole who likes to piss people off for giggles. Let's see how many people my buddies and I can pull into our random group, vote to ban from dungeons, then boot!
As you can see, the abuse could be horrendous. Not to mention, the punishment wouldn't be helpful to anyone in the long run. ESPECIALLY for people simply trying to gear up.
The best way to punish people who queue up as tank/healer with no intention of playing that roll is for them to constantly be booted from their group. If no one is willing to do the job they signed up for FOR them, it'll eventually become apparent that that particular scheme isn't worthwhile, and they'll queue as the roll they want to play. Afterall, 30 minutes of queues is better than 3 hours of constantly being booted from dungeons because you have no intention of signing up for a roll you can pull off.
Possum Jan 13th 2010 4:12PM
Proposed solution:
After someone in the group has switched specs to tank/heal continue through the dungeon, vote to kick as soon as the option becomes available, get near instant new dps, lazy bastard has had his time wasted, you haven't.
Microtonal Jan 13th 2010 5:04PM
There's a much simpler solution to the problem of DPS queuing as tank or healer, and it can be managed by the LFD system itself. If your character does not have a spec with at least 51 points spent in a tanking or healing tree, you cannot queue for that role. You would be unable to check that box, just as if your class wasn't capable of it at all.
Not sure how this could handle cat druids, though.
ash Jan 13th 2010 6:00PM
I think that's a reasonable suggestion for now Micro. Until something is done to fix this type of thing though, I would just kick the player. If you can fill the role you thought would be filled by the other player I would make it contingent on kicking the douchebag in the first place.
Jonathan Jan 13th 2010 6:13PM
@ Microtonal
Problem with that is that it really doesn't solve anything. What's to stop a hybrid class from just having tanks or heals as their offspec just to continue abusing the system in this manner?
Liontamer14 Jan 13th 2010 8:23PM
@ microtonal
Your idea doesn't really jive for deathknights either as it is possible to tank in any of the three specs.
thebitterfig Jan 13th 2010 11:02PM
To further monkeywrench the "51 points in XYZ spec" idea, my tanking DK (granted, level 74) is 23/23/19. He's a solid tank with good gear, high threat, and a lot of great survival talents. Frigid Deathplate, Veteran of the Third War, the standard 5/5/5, Imp Icy Touch, 15 second DnD cooldown. Heck, I'll probably continue to 80 and be 23/23/25. Raid bosses might omnomnom me, but for heroics I'd be fine.
The flaw in such a strict requirement would be to kill nontraditional but effective specs.
Rakah Jan 13th 2010 8:09AM
best way to deal with this is first ask to make sure they aren't just in their off spec gear, if it looks like they can't tank then just leave, no reason they should benefit from other peoples ability to pick up the slack.
kv83 Jan 13th 2010 8:28AM
What actually happens IF you leave, is that they can return to the top of the qeue as a DPS'er and find someone to tank for them. You actually do them a favor by leaving I think :)
Didn't run into this yet, but then again... my main is a tank and my wife plays a healer.... Didn't see it on my alts either tho
Foxfyr Jan 13th 2010 9:01AM
I haven't had this happen yet either. I usually queue as leader and if it did happen in a group I was leading I would not put us back into the queue until that inconsiderate primate left the group.