Wintergrasp's hidden balance mechanics revealed, minor changes coming soon

The changes are posted in full below, and keep this note from Zarhym in mind: "[...] although this information may feel very new to you, the actual changes being made in the patch to the current system are relatively minor."
- There is an internal tug-of-war scale not visible by players which will shift under specific conditions.
- The scale starts at 0 (neutral) and can move up to 700 points in either direction favoring the Alliance at one end, and Horde at the other.
- This scale is persistent and does not reset to 0 whenever control of Wintergrasp shifts.
- If an attacking force captures Wintergrasp Fortress while under the effects of any of the advantages listed below (400-700 points in their favor), the scale tips 100 points in favor of the opposing faction.
- If a defending force successfully defends Wintergrasp Fortress two battles in a row, the scale tips 100 points in favor of the opposing faction.
- Each consecutive successful defense after a faction's first two consecutive defenses will further tip the scale 100 points in favor of the opposing faction.
- As a quick example, if the scale is at 0 and the Alliance capture Wintergrasp fortress while attacking, the scale will not move. If the Alliance defend Wintergrasp twice in a row after this, the scale will move 100 points in favor of the Horde. Each consecutive defense by the Alliance after this will move the scale 100 points further in favor of the Horde each time, bringing the Horde to 400 points in their favor after one unsuccessful defense and five unsuccessful attacks, a total of six Horde losses in a row.
- As another example, if the scale is at 400 in favor of the Horde and they capture Wintergrasp fortress while attacking, the scale will move 100 points in favor of the Alliance. If the Horde defend Wintergrasp twice in a row after this, the scale will move 100 points in favor of the Alliance. Each consecutive defense by the Horde after this will move the scale 100 points further in favor of the Alliance each time, bringing the Alliance to 100 points in their favor after one unsuccessful defense and five unsuccessful attacks, a total of six Alliance losses in a row.
- The following advantages are provided at the beginning of the battle for Wintergrasp whenever these corresponding ranges on the scale have been reached:
- 0-300: No advantages granted.
- 400: Faction starts with the Sunken Ring Factory under their control.
- 500: Faction starts with the Sunken Ring and Broken Temple Factories under their control.
- 600: Faction starts with the Sunken Ring and Broken Temple Factories under their control and gains access to Catapults after earning 1 kill in battle.
- 700: Faction starts with the Sunken Ring and Broken Temple Factories under their control and gains access to Catapults, Siege Engines, and Demolishers after earning 1 kill in battle.
Filed under: News items, PvP






Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)
timmckeoun Feb 19th 2010 4:39PM
Well that makes more sense :P
Halkalla Feb 23rd 2010 1:52PM
Here is the stats for our Realm's WG... I managed to grab a screenie the last time we had WG. I am not going to ID horde/alliance as the problem exists for both sides depending on your servers population.
Side 1:
Keep Defended: 45
Keep Captured: 109
Side 2
Keep Defended:448
Keep Captured:848
Almost 10:1 ratio on one and over 8:1 on the other. I really don't think these ratios really inspire me to use the word balance. Of course our server lvl 80's from one side outnumbers the other almost 2:1
censuur Feb 23rd 2010 2:56PM
utter bullshite hallkala, you cant capture wintergrasp unless the other side has it, so you cant ever have more then 1 capture more then the other faction, you failed
Halkalla Feb 23rd 2010 3:42PM
Here is a link to an entire thread discussing the log... other's attesting to the fact that the log captures get whacked. Heck there is even someone's screen shot. Call it utter BS, but thats what the log book shows. Even at that, it still doesn't change the severe disparity between the two sides defenses.
http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r23646072-Vault-of-Archavon-Archavons-Log
mtsadowski Feb 19th 2010 4:42PM
That clears up SO much.
Bob Dewane Feb 22nd 2010 11:05AM
I don't think this clears up anything, really. On my server the Alliance RARELY (i.e. on Tuesdays for VOA runs only) controls WG. What good does it do my faction to start with shops under our control if we dont have the manpower to stop the Horde from coming out of the keep, taking them, destroying our towers and then retreating for the win?
Until Blizz figures out a way to address the problem of a swarm of one side crushing the other, WG will remain an unbalanced mess imho.
kyrro Feb 23rd 2010 7:23AM
Timear Foresees chinese mercenaries for hire in Wintergrasp battles in your future.
Darkseid Feb 23rd 2010 8:26AM
I'm with Bob on this one. Who the heck cares "why" one side is constantly controling WG? On my server (Thunderhorn), the Alliance dominates WG almost non-stop.
The battles go the same way nearly every time.
-We start with tenacity 3, 4 or even 5+ sometimes, killl 1 thing, head out rolling a dozen seiges into the keep at the start. Pound all the way into the center, lose all our seiges, look up and they've retaken everthing we started with WHILE still defending the keep and hitting our towers with overwhelming force. Then we're never a serious threat from that point of the battle forward.
Tenacity does absolutely NOTHING to deal with one side having a 6-1 advantage in man power. And until they introduce something to account for that, and not just "who won last time", WG will never be balanced like they want.
Gamer am I Feb 19th 2010 4:45PM
That explains why the Alliance can only capture WG on my server after a few games pass.
Finnicks Feb 19th 2010 5:14PM
On our server (Cenarion Circle) I'm pretty sure the Horde has been hovering between 600 and 700 points since this system has been implemented. >.< And Alliance STILL defend the keep 75% of the time.
N-train Feb 19th 2010 5:24PM
Yeah I'm on CC Horde too and I find that these mechanics are helpful, but yeah we still usually get our buts kicked.
I'm wondering what kind of things they'll implement for Tol Barad in Cata to help assure that imbalanced realms each get fairly equal usage. While the benefits of controlling WG are handy and worth having (between the VoA raid and the exp buff) to just about everyone, there's nothing essential about controlling it.
A quest hub, on the other hand, while also not technically essential, has more value, imo, than WG does now, and if one faction totally dominates 80-90% of the time, then the other side is REALLY missing out.
Tridus Feb 19th 2010 6:06PM
It's the same with Horde on Argent Dawn. Alliance routinely own the place.
For the longest time people have thought the Horde was cheating because 30 seconds into the match 12 siege engines show up. Blizzard really should have cleared this up a long time ago.
Angus Feb 19th 2010 6:54PM
Yea, Echo Isles is like this for the Horde.
"Oh look guys, we got siege engines and who else is pushing 200K thanks to tenacity? Oh and look at that sea of red names just waiting on us... Oh, there went broken temple..."
This is usually about 30 seconds into the match. We spend a good 3-4 minutes being farmed while the alliance gets some vehicles to our towers and then laughs and retreats back to the keep.
Tenacity won't help you when your faction seems incapable of stopping RPGGs or lone DKs handing out behind vehicles...
dragon_eel Feb 20th 2010 5:02PM
On Hyjal we only see the alliance have wg on tuesdays now. Just to do VOA
You would have to be on at 5am to see it again the rest of the week.
The alliance on our server have pretty much given up on controlling wintergrasp.
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I would almost like to see an equal amount of players on each side allowd in... not just a max of 120..... if 86 players on one side come in, then only 86 players on the other side are allowed to join. with a max of 120 per faction.
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Radroti Feb 23rd 2010 10:16AM
I have to take issue with the idea that imbalanced realms need to share equal time in possession of WG. It seems to me that one faction having more players should warrant more time and more availability. As an extreme example, consider that Horde has 90% of the realm population and Alliance has 10%; does that mean that Ally still deserves to hold the place half the time? If that's the case it doesn't seem fair to the faction with the larger number.
SamLowry Mar 18th 2010 5:26PM
Blizzard almost seems allergic to the concept of numerical balance, and increasing the number of players from 100 to 120 showed quite clearly that they didn't give a rip.
Letting players in on a 1:1 ratio is the only solution, yet they don't even want to talk about it. Better to let EVERYONE in!
Gamer am I Feb 19th 2010 4:46PM
I should have asked this with my last comment, but if all of the point changes are in increments of 100, why not just have the scale move one point each time and have a maximum of seven on each side.
Runya Feb 19th 2010 4:52PM
These go to eleven
Arashikou Feb 19th 2010 4:57PM
Probably future-proofing, in case something came up in the future that they wanted to have finer granularity. "Oh, the Horde used the Ziggymuffin and won? That's a 25-point in favor of the Alliance!" or maybe some kind of logarithmic scale for earning bonuses.
(cutaia) Feb 19th 2010 5:03PM
There's a Ziggymuffin in Wintergrasp? Man, I gotta find that thing. :D